#betd22 Panel: Skill Development in the Energy Transition

#betd22 Panel: Skill Development in the Energy Transition

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While the worldwide ramp up of renewable energy  is gonna create jobs up and down the value chain   and has the potential to provide sustainable  economic growth, there is an acute shortage   of labor in the sector, particularly in  markets that are going to grow exponentially.   We heard it yesterday and today, certification  is key. The session that we have right now is   going to look at how countries and institutions  can fill that gap with vocational training,   syllabi, training of trainers, use of remote  and onsite learning. I'm going to make the   introductions short, which is an important  topic I want to get into what we have today.  

On the left of your screen, joined by Dr. Kristina  Celic, the Director General at Directorate   for Energy, Ministry of Economy and Sustainable  Development in Croatia. She holds a doctorate in   the technical sciences in the field of electrical  engineering, more than 33 years of experience.  

Joining online is Stephen Byabato. And  Deputy Minister of Energy in Tanzania.   Holds a Master's degree and a post-graduate degree  at the law school of Tanzania. Hello, welcome.   Next, joining us again in our  Europasaal is Dr. Rabia Ferroukhi,   an international economic development  expert dedicated to sustainable energy and   socio-economic development. Currently the director  of the Director of Knowledge, policy and finance   center at IRENA. And next is Berthold Breid,  Renata at RENAC. N Germany. Building capacity   on green energy technologies. Welcome. And right  next to me is Ranisha Basnet . With energypedia,  

a nonprofit, with them since the founding days.  And more than 7 years of experience. And research   lies in knowledge management and communications.  This is an incredible panel we have assembled   this morning. I want to get right into it. This is the part where I have to be a little bit  

stern with you all and say we have so much  to get through today. I'm gonna ask you for   the first round of questions. You have about 2  minutes to respond. And thank you so very much.   I would like to start off with our first two  ministers on the panel, Dr. Celic and Mr. Byabato.   Why is there a shortage of skilled  workers in the renewable energy sectors   in your countries? Start with you, Dr. Celic. Thank you very much. I would like to underline   that Croatia is known for the quality  higher education system. It allows us   to have in 2007 the -- our strategy and  the return to renewable energy sources and   sustainable development. And it helps  us to be on this part until today. And  

to manage to have the different technologies  in our countries such as sun, such as hydro,   such as wind. Also, geothermal energy utilization.  So, this is very important to know to need to have   really good basis on the dedication  to achieve the energy transition.   And to have the good place strategies and to  use our sources. This is important for us to   know how to use and how to perform different  technologies in energy sector and to use it.   And this we need to -- for this we need  to have good skill and education system   and skill workers. So, we heard today a just  transition. A just transition means also to use   knowledge that we have and to transform  that knowledge to new technologies.  

To emerge the use of these technologies. So, in  Croatia, we are connected our legislation, our   regulatory framework, administration  bodies with faculties and we are online   each day, I could say, to manage this transition  to see what the best options are. And how we   could -- from the elementary school speak  about energy. Speak about sustainable   development then through higher education and the  faculties at the universities. Put this in the  

frame how we will act on the -- some project.  Because learning is -- is the best to learn   on the projects how to develop projects. How  to develop facilities? And how to maintain it?   So, this is the procedure. And also, we need to  know where to put this new facilities. Renewable   sources. what our spatial plans need to have. So,  this is a really big job to do and it needs to   be -- to connect all those stakeholders and first  of that you need to have the clear strategy that   you want to perform renewable energy sources. Absolutely. This clear strategy is vitally  

important. We're gonna come back to the  question of strategy later in the panel.   I would like to go now to our virtual  panelist, Minister Byabato of Tanzania.   If you could speak about the shortage of skilled  workers in the renewable energy in your country.  

Thank you, moderator. Can you hear me? I can hear you, yes.   Thank you. Back home in Tanzania, we are doing  just a great job in the ministry of energy. We are   not so much far. We are not so much behind. But  we are struggling to make sure renewable energy   has expert and provide a quantity which may add  up to the already storage capacity in our country.  

As of now, we are still lagging behind. And  as you know, we consider this a big hydro. As   not renewable energy as such. But we  have a little bit of renewable energy   in -- below 10 mega hertz of energy and we  have around 50% of what we have into hydro. But  

as of now, we do not have anything coming  out of wind. We get something from solar, not   insignificant. So, we can say we are still very,  very far behind in renewable energy sources.   So, that being the case, for instance, we have  like a 1700 something-megahertz storage capacity.  

We have something like 10 to 15%  of it being from renewable energy.   So, we are still having a big work to do. And from  what we started generating our own electricity,   we used to do what we had with water as hydro.  And natural gas. We produced from fuel. So,   we did not invest much into the technology of  renewable energy as a wind and solar and water.   So, we still have work to do. We are now going  to the energy mix so that we can make sure we  

attain what we have to attain with others  who are aligning -- who are in front of   us in this fight to achieve renewable energy.  That being the case, we have not sufficiently   done with technological transfer.  Technological imparting it to our people.   We still have work to do to make sure we bridge  that gap of people and technocrats and specialists   into internal -- into renewable energy. Absolutely. bridging that gap is   one of the big themes out of yesterday. We  will come back to you. Now to the studio   to ask you underlying reasons for the shortage of  skilled workers in the renewable energy sectors   in the different countries where you're all  active. Start with you, please, Dr. Ferroukhi.  

Thank you for having me, Jennifer. Three points  I'm going to make. We now have countries with   ambitious technological targets. There's,  a technology-centric approach top energy   transition. And the measures and the policies  required to skill up the educational and skilling  

policies have not necessarily followed up. So,  just, for example, just in renewable energy,   we estimate every year the number of workers  in the labor force of renewable -- the   renewable energy sector were 12 million.  We estimate that we want to go to the 1.5,   in the next decade, just renewable energy, we'll  employee about 38 million people. So, that means   that we need to start scaling the workforce. Not only that, that's just renewable and   there's also the energy transition-related jobs.  That's energy, bar grids, energy flexibility,   et cetera. Where we expect in the next  decade to go up from about 16 million to  

over 70 million. So, that's one point. So,  obviously, we need to rapidly scale up the -- and   train -- education and train people in order  to prepare them for the future energy sector.   And to match the skill and supply  -- the skilled supply and demand   what is really important, and I think we're  still not there in terms of planning, is to   make sure that we have an integrated approach  between energy, labor, and education.   The second point is that the sector is evolving  very rapidly. And education and training  

systems are really lagging behind.  So, the fact is that we don't need,   for example, skills in only in the power sector,  but we need them in the heating and cooling.   We need them for electric vehicles. So,  that's manufacturing, infrastructure,  

digitalization, access. I mean, there's a lot  of direct but also indirect job requirements   that will -- will increase the skills  needs. And finally, the last point,   about the fact that we're really not tapping into  the full potential of the talent pool that we   have. And this is why I think a lot of interest  is increasing in the inclusive transition.   Just to give you an example -- I want to come back to the examples.   I want to make sure the other panelists have the  opportunity. This is the challenge of the panel,  

I know there's a lot to discuss. But right now,  I would like to come to Mr. Breid from RENAC.   Tell us about the skills where you're active. Thank you. I would like to add on to what Rabia   said. From our observation, the problem is  oftentimes there is many countries with quite   high ambitions concerning embassies and so on.  But oftentimes, it really lacks a strategy. How   to build up the training landscape in the country.  So, it's -- maybe there's like some universities  

doing something for the engineers. But then  economists have forgotten lawyers, to transfer the   knowledge that is necessary for the development  of the technologies in the faculties. Or   technical vocational training is forgotten  in some branches. So, what is really often  

times missing is a national strategy to build  up skills according to job profiles required.   Four different sectors on different  levels along the value chain.   So, what we oftentimes observe is it's  punctually there's something, but the   whole strategy is missing. This is the first  point. The second point is that we also observe   oftentimes it's the ministry of energy who has the  obligation to fulfill the targets and so on. But   skill development is in a responsibility of the  ministry of higher education and the ministry of   vocational training or in the ministry of industry  and commerce. And mostly these ministries are not  

working together to really define a national  strategy. This is -- I mean, this is -- yeah.   I think a big message from this BETD also too many  nations, please, if you want to really reach your   targets, invite all the ministries on one table  and develop a strategy for the skill development.   National strategy. You have  said it a couple of times. Yes,   I think this is one of the big takeaways  from the BETD. Miss Basnet, your thoughts.  

Thank you so much. What the other panelists  already shared, we work on knowledge management   in the global south. And we see four  As that contribute to your question.   Access, is the resources and the knowledge we  require to train and have skilled manpower,   is it available? Is the training available, is  it affordable? Applicability. Is it applicable to  

that particular setting? Is it comprising both the  academic and the practical knowledge which always   is -- we see lacking as either too academic or too  vocational. Do we combine both of the streams?   And also, do we actually concentrate on the  local capacity building? Because if you don't   have the local capacity building, the project is  not sustainable. That's the core of it. We see   the four As. And one also is availability for  the target audience that you are targeting. If   we could focus on four As, whatever resources and  skills we are trying to build. Make it accessible,  

affordable, applicable, in that particular  settings, that would be like wonderful for   the renewable energy sector. Thank you. Thank you so much, Miss Basnet. The same   question for each of you again. You spoke about  this for a moment. But I want to dive deeper. On   what educational level is it problematic, on the  academic level? And what are some of the obstacles   looking for the ministers, and start with you,  face in your country or the institutions that   you see on a different scale? I would  like to start with you, Dr. Celic.  

I will say that it is -- and higher education  level. Academic level is -- they have their   role and they are doing that well. And new  technology. But we need a wide range of   skills in this higher education and craftsman. And  also to connect that with the digital transition.  

So, this is a more challenging topic now in  I think education world. How to -- because   when we speak about our strategy, it is,  you know, our energy strategy shows the   way. Renewable energy transition. And one of  the measures that is included here to educate   people to have skilled workers on the sites you  know? And what the transition brings to us?   Different and distributed production  of electricity. Particularly and   also heat energy. Corrected with some  technologies like biomass, thermal.   So, what do we need? We need a wide range of  technical skills and also we need the wide   range of, you know, dispersive activities on the  different sides on the islands, on the mainlands,   on the, you know, those parts of the -- we heard  that a lot of people do not have electricity   right now. That problem of cooking on the -- on  environmental friendly and not healthy way. So,  

this is the challenge that we are facing. This is the challenge that we're facing. We   talked a bit about that last night. We're  focusing a lot on challenges. We'll get to   the good things in just a second, but  first to Minister Byabato of Tanzania.  

What are some of the problems faced in Tanzania? The major problem we have is part of the   technician and the -- those people will need  much to be in the field and do this and do that   at all the time. We are not in a position to have  a so much many specialists because we do not have   a large quantity of renewable energy stored  into our area. So, we need to have those   more technicians, more artisans, more technical  level at the lowest grade so we can make sure   all of our time, as the fellow Minister said, they  can access everyone and offer the services needed.   Do this and that to make sure renewable energy  is in place all the time. And being innovative   to have a new thing out of what we have for now. So, at level is we speak with I hope  

we are ready for now. And make sure we produce  this at all levels so that you can bridge the gap   and make sure we have everything. We're gonna talk about that in   just a second. You're right. Now I  would like to come back to the room.  

Dr. Ferroukhi, where do you see the problems? I'm gonna focus on renewable energy. We looked   at the segments of the value chain and  try to identify what kind of skills and   occupational backgrounds are required. What is  interesting is we found about 30% are mathematics.   And then lawyers and regulators. But what's  interesting is the majority of the skills   required do not necessarily need a university  degree. This is where obviously the necessary   skills can be brought for alternative pathways  and you have spoken about vocational training,   apprenticeship, on the job training, et cetera.  The challenges are different at different levels  

of training. At higher education, the main problem  is they lag behind, usually slow at bringing   new materials into the curricula or create new  courses. And vocational training which is much   more agile and flexible. One of the issues we have  is when there is no regulation. So, for example,   if you have no regulation in the vocational  training system, then you can have a solar PEV   installation program that is done without any kind  of standards. But many countries just mention by   the deputy minister in Tanzania but also  in Kenya are also integrating that in the   regulatory framework so there are standards. That's one example. But maybe just to finish,   in the energy access context I think what is very,  very important is that the skill building be also   accompanied with local project development.  And there are many examples which I'm sure my  

colleagues are gonna speak about. Fantastic. I want to get right to   those colleagues. Mr. Breid from RENAC. Oftentimes what's missing is often the   practical aspects of the trainings, yeah? So, in  universities but also in the technical training,   emphasis is missing. People  are skilled in photovoltaics  

and never built the systems and connected  to the grid or put it into operation. And   so, this is -- yes. I mean, formal, they have some  kind of certificate or they passed the exam. But   the practical aspect is something which is really  missing. And I mean, yeah. The point that Rabia  

pointed out to have this combination with project  developers in reality is really a good approach.   And another thing is also we observe oftentimes  companies, they are doing training on the job   for the technical level installation,  operation, maintenance. On the one hand side,   maybe because there is no training facilities.  And opportunities to send stuff for training.   But yet it is also the perception that they save  money. They don't want to spend money on training.  

And this is a big problem in general about like  skill development in the energy sector, yeah?   Many expect that -- I mean, there's Internet  so, sending people to go to the Internet and   reading something is enough for training. This  is not the case. I mean, you could just like buy   1,000 books and distribute it in a country and  ask people to read them. But this does not mean   they really digest it and know what they should  have learned. So, this is really the difference.  

And this perception oftentimes to save a bit  of costs for training, yeah? This calculation   is not really -- is not really practical. There is a lot about this learning by doing   aspect. But the importance like part of that vital  training is to get in there and then actually   to be doing it. And to be trained on before you  are deployed to do it out sort of in real life.  

I saw your colleague next to you, Miss  Basnet nodding along. Tell us, please.   No, I actually agree with everything my  panelists said and summarized everything.   I would like to add, along with the practical  on hands training, we need to work between   the practitioners. I learned how to do it,  but when I went to the field, oh, my god,   many of the indicators that I learned in my  studies, they don't apply. I need someone   who has done it before to give his or her  input. Those are the exchange also missing.  

And also bring one complete new point in the  agenda. As we move towards energy transition,   we are moving from pure renewable energy to more  Nexus. Talking about energy and agriculture,   energy and water. That means we are  also merging two specializations.  

And that's going to be -- because we see more  and more demand for knowledge in this seconder,   that's a huge topic that will come up that we will  need more and more skilled manpower by the two who   we can then train to merge into one or some course  that kind of helps us to produce manpower who can   work in Nexus topics. Because those are going to  be the new challenges in the sector. Thank you.   Thank you very much. We looked at some challenges.  And in some ways, it's lovely that there's   agreement where the challenges lie. But I want  to look forward by looking back. What has worked   well so far. What has been some strategies that  you've said, okay. In terms of skill development,  

this is something that we've seen working. I would  like to start with your perspective from Croatia.   What is working. We have realized a lot of  projects in the last 15 years when we started   with our strategy on renewable energy sources.  So, we built a lot of new facilities. One fifth of   whole installed capacities in electric sector we  have nowadays from renewable sun, wind, biomass,   geothermal. So, learning by doing is the right  world -- word and the right way how to achieve  

this targets having a good working -- good and  skilled workers. And we managed to do that,   yes. We implement maybe different technologies  abroad. Not -- we do not produce all of them.   Some. But nowadays we have skilled  workers on these different areas.   Also, we transform those who are working in this  mining industry, hydrocarbon industry. And they   now are in the -- they are focused on geothermal  energy. So, this is how also this transition  

works. From the other side, we have also industry  -- very powerful industry producing generators and   motors for hydro -- hydro power plants. Also,  they turn to wind industry, for example. This   is how it works. And how it works well. So, this  is our experience and now, for example, we are  

starting with hydrogen. Last week we adopted  Croatia hydrogen strategy. And this will speed   also the process. So, you need to be dedicated to  -- and focused to your targets to manage them.   Thank you very much. I would also like to get  the perspective from Tanzania. Minister Byabato.  

Yes. For us what we see has worked for us in  the past is to have those exchange programs of   making sure our people down here comes to you, for  instance. We have had several exchange programs   with the Germans. And we are getting some other  skilled labor from other areas to come in and   input some knowledge to us. That is one of what  we do. The second thing we do, we have some hydro  

projects down here going on. We make sure in every  hydro project we have a simulation center for   making sure that these people who are there adjust  practically and acquire knowledge of what they can   do. And we are now scheduling the exchange program  in further technological studies so that we can go   into what the Minister has been saying from  Croatia. Going to geothermal. Going, extending   to biomass and some other renewable energies  so that we can be in a position of having --   Oh, I think our connection may  have just -- yes, I think the --   You lost me? We lost you, but   you're back. We will give you  another second to wrap up.   Make sure we don't stop this program and make sure  when ending up what do we do with the application   back home? So, we can make sure we have excellent  programs to advance knowledge of what we have and   go back into the renewable energy sources  to make sure we have everything we want.  

Thank you very much for that perspective from  Tanzania. I would like to bring it back now   into the studio. Dr. Ferroukhi from IRENA, what's  been working well that you have seen? And why?   I think we have to be -- of the fact that  the energy transition will bring challenges.   Educational nature that we spoke about. I think if  we look at that from the outset, we are bound to   have solutions and plan for them. For example you  ever very often project developments outside urban  

centers when the skills are concentrated in urban  centers. Bring those training centers as close as   possible to where the potential is. This is what  happened in Morocco. You have three training   centers put close by the project development  and that has worked quite well. That's just to   give you an example. I would like to make one more  point. That's the fact that we are talking about   how to exchange best practices, et cetera. And I think that's essential because we have  

seen a lot of successful examples. And IRENA  is actually launching a new global platform   on education for the energy transition together  with UNESCO and other institutions. And in that,   the main point here is to bring all the  different stakeholders between industry,   project developers, governments, et cetera. And to  basically share best practice and at the same time   the first thing that we will be doing actually,  and I think that's another thing that is needed   not only globally, but obviously at the national  level because it will be much more accurate   which is a skills survey that is aimed at  employers in order to better identify, actually,   the specific needs of the sector. Thank you. Thank you very much. It's always exciting for   me to get to host a panel like this to see how  fellow panelists pull out their pens and start   writing something. I want to go to you, I saw  you pick up your pencil and make a note. Please.  

Some things are working well.  But in the skill sector,   as I mentioned already, practical  oriented trainings are key.   The second thing is the trainings should really  focus and relate to the specific job profiles.   It doesn't make sense to train people in something  they will not work in. Which oftentimes happens.   So, you can save a lot of time, resources,  energy, and money if you really focus to what   the target group needs to learn. Also, we observed that if you build up the   trainings with an exam and a certification, this  helps a lot. So, I mean, then it's also comparable  

and clear what participants will learn. And also,  I mean, they will use this for their personal   development. And also, we noticed what is working  well is this concept of planning -- planned   learning that we use a lot. So, oftentimes we  combine a lot of online training which can be done   whenever participants can or have time together  then with later face-to-face training, yeah?   So, with this kind of package,  this is quite economic.  

And I can imagine that the pandemic over the  last 2 years has sort of brought this blended   learning style. We realize that there are  ways to do that there weren't pre-pandemic.   Yes. To wrap it up, miss #Basnet, what and it why?   Like as was pointed out with the local  practitioner training. In Southeast Asia,   the sector. In the 1980s, lots of trainings  and resources were done to build up the capital  

city such that you look at it now, there's a  vibrant hydro chain with trainings in the region   and there are continuous exchanges between  practitioners not only from the region,   but across different continents and  coming up with new collaboration ideas,   new technologies and so on. So, definitely a local  capacity building. That is the key if you want to   achieve energy transition. And second, to build  what Ben had already mentioned about exchanges.   We have seen it again and again. Just having a  bunch of experts in the room, whether it's online,   onsite. And let them talk. So much good  comes out in the room. There is so much   exchange of ideas, collaborations, interregional,  intercountry, again, you name it. So, really,  

if we focus on local capacity building, practical  actions, I think those are the two ones that in   our experience we see working really well. Thank you so much for that. I have to say,   you have been a fantastic panelist. I want to  keep going. We have got two more questions to   get through. Start again with our Ministers. Is  there a plan that your respective governments   has for the development of specialized workers  in the region -- renewable energy sector? Do you   have any up-skilling measures that specifically  benefit global phase out of coal and therefore   decarbonization through renewable energies. Limit  your responses to 2 minutes. Start with Croatia   Yeah, we have a smart education strategy. And  why it's important to have this word "Smart."  

Because we heard also here that we need different  kind of activities. Agriculture, transport,   different sectors when we apply to energy and  where we use energy. In civil engineering. We need   good planning for doing that. So, education and  train of people who will carry this development   of green transition is most important  in these days. And we need to start   even on the receipt -- research level. Also on  this commercialization of -- that means that   we need -- we need to connect also different  segments, different sectors and to have   really skilled and smart working force. This is -- this is why not to focus to only  

one segment, but to broaden it and to have a  basis -- first to have a basis of what's going on   in the transition? What are the segments that you  need at the, you know, base knowledge? And then   to apply on some segments and I will -- I will  support this thing that it is very important to   have face-to-face trainings. Not only  we are Internet. Because it is -- it   is how it's -- it is best to share knowledge. Absolutely it is. I can only support what you saw.   I would like to go now to the Minister Byabato in  Tanzania. Does your government has a specific plan  

when it comes to skill development of specialized  workers in the renewable energy sector?   Yeah. Yes. Initially --   Mr. -- I think we got you back. Yep. You're back. Yes. I'm saying in renewable energy,   locally we have the national energy policy 2015.  We have the policy master plan in 2020 update. And  

we have some other put in place integrations to  make sure that we do not get left behind when it   comes to imparting knowledge and the bridging the  gap in renewable energy. But on top of that one,   when we want to go globally, now we make sure that  we should join the international organizations   from all over the world to make sure that we  go with the clean energy and cooking energy,   power and whatever., for instance, we are --  we are now joining the sustainable energy for   all. We are going into the international  alliance. We are going into international   renewable energy IRENA. We had them yesterday.  And carbon sequestration and so on and so forth.   So, we can share what others share so that we  can bring that knowledge back home and share   the note of making sure that we do not emit a  lot of carbon and whatever into the air. Yeah.   Thank you very much. And thank you for sticking  with us through these technical difficulties. It's  

great to have you with us here virtually. No problem.   I would like to ask the three panelists left in  the room. What do you see from your perspectives,   what are the capacity building pre-conditions  to developing RE and EE markets? Are there   educational, or re-educational measures  that specifically benefit the phase outs   or decarbonization through -- you're already  nodding. Go ahead from IRENA, Dr. Ferroukhi.   Thank you, Jennifer. I don't know  how you do it to speak so fast.  

I'm so sorry. No, I have told you before   that the energy transition will bring a lot of  job creation. That's the good news. Obviously,   it will outweigh the job losses that we'll have  in fossil fuels. But that still means that we   have to take care of the fossil fuel workers  and we need re-skilling and up-skilling measures   to accompany the labor market interventions. Now, the good news is that some of the skills  

are transferable. So, for example,  the offshore oil and gas industry   has specialist skills that really could fit  with the offshore wind industry, for example.   Another good news is that we have  seen through different studies that   some of the -- there are synergies between  the coal industry and solar PV skills. It is   estimated that about 40% of coal-fired power plant  workers could be transitioned into the PV sector.  

On the other hand, the coal mining industry, about  30 to 35% of jobs are specific to the industries   and will require some kind of re-skilling. Very  important measures that we've seen that works.   And this is in terms of this transition is to have  a transition training fund. So, training at large   scale skills training. This is important. It is  important to have these funds. We have seen them   in Spain, for example. In the coal phase out. Nice  example in the State of Colorado which created a   bill that has a $15 million provision to assist  coal-dependent workers and communities in this   transition. And 7 million of that is actually for  apprenticeship and training programs for workers.  

But that means you have to have the means  for that. And I'll talk about that later.   We would love to bring that up in the closing  statements which we will get to after we talk   to our panelists. Please, Mr. Breid. Rabia mentioned a lot already.   I'm a terrible influence, please. This is exactly the point I was about to make.  

So, the job which will be lost in the  coal industry of our coal power plants,   a lot of them these people -- I mean, they  are electricians. They are engineers. So,   they can work in the field of renewable  energies. Either in solar PV or bio energy.   A lot of potential is there to really go forward  working in the renewable energy sector without   re-skilling. And others need to be re-skilling. Re-skilling is going to be an incredibly important   part of this. absolutely agree. You make  great points. Wrap up for Miss Basnet.   First focus on the pre-condition. And tweak  did a little bit to add local skill level.  

That's the keyword I'm going to add today.   You can have them on the energy building  infrastructure. But if you don't have the local   capacity development, who is going to maintain?  Who is going to do the after service? Who is   going to be responsible for the sustainability of  it? So, really without local capacity building,   you cannot expect to have a sustainable energy  infrastructure project in the long-term.  

So, that's my two thoughts  on it. Thank you so much.   Okay. I'm -- we have lots of time  left over for your final thoughts.   We have been too fast all day long. Now we can all  take a deep breath. I would like to ask for your   final thoughts before we end the panel. Start,  of course, with Minister Celic from Croatia.   Please be sure to use your microphone. Thank you. Sorry. I would like to say maybe we  

didn't mention funding. For example, our  energy -- renewable hydrogen strategy   show -- to establishments of regional  hydrogen center. For that we need   also to have human resources. But  also we need to have -- to equip   that. And to work and to finance this. This  was the main question, actually, when we were   communicating this strategy how to proceed.  And will only industry and the potential  

investment bring knowledge? Or we need to do that  parallel. We need to do that in parallel. So,   this is -- this is just one example of what we  are doing and how we need to proceed in this green   hydrogen industry, for example. We have really a  lot of -- we are looking at the hydrogen -- green   hydrogen as a new fuel. So, particularly  important in transport sector. To mention that.   But I would like to conclude with one -- just  one sentence. We have given the ambition goals.   It is necessary from the earliest stage to teach  and support young generation to think critically.  

Take in initiatives and respect nature in order  to gain understanding and skills in the fields of   environment, sustainability, and climate change. And the -- for this renewable energy transition,   energy transition will help to  do that. And to achieve goals.   Absolutely. These are inspiring words. Thank you  for sharing that with us today, Minister Celic.  

Now to our virtual guest, Deputy Minister of  Tanzania for his final thoughts on today's panel.   I think -- I think we might have to come  back you in just a minute. So, I'll turn   to the panelists in the room. Dr. Ferroukhi  from IRENA, your final thoughts on today.  

Thank you so much, Jennifer. Back to two points  which I didn't make in the beginning. That we   tap into the talent pool that we are already have.  This is why a lot of people are talking about an   inclusive transition. To look at gender, we did  look at women in the renewable energy sector.   32% of women. Which is better than the  conventional sector, 22% in oil and gas. We  

can do better. But that's one. And we have to look  at technology-by-technology in the global energy   sector. When we did the wind sector survey, it  was 21%. Much closer to the conventional sector.   Again, this is a STEM issue. Which we found out  that 28% of women are only in the STEM jobs in   renewable energy. So, there is a long way to go. And again, educational policies and measures would  

be essential in order to promote women. But  other minorities, quote, unquote. We're not   really a minority. We're 50% of the population.  But the second point you would like to make,   it goes back to your point. I fully agree with  local capacity and building local capacity.  

And this is intimately related to the kind of  development that we have. And the new classical   paradigm of economics that we are -- have  embraced for centuries -- for decades, rather.   So, the point is that renewable energy  is great. But we also need to diversify   our economies -- economies that are, for  example, commodity-dependent. And we have   to make sure that the local value is created. So, for example, it's not just about renewables.   But it's, for example, a new topic on rare  Earth materials, for example. Where we go  

and basically take the raw materials and bring  them to the rest of the world. No, local value   has to be created. It has to have a benefit for  local domestic value. Otherwise we're gonna run   into the same kind of problems with basically a  producty type of development. A paradigm. Which we  

need to move away. I mean, doing renewables and  energy transition doesn't mean that everything is   gonna be rosey for everybody. So, we need from the  onset to make sure that other economies, economies   that are dependent today on technology, et cetera,  from certain regions, have the opportunity to also   diversify their energy sectors and beyond. And  take -- along the segments of the value chain   really create domestic value. Thanks. Thanks so much. Diversifying, incredibly  

important. And I do want to come back to the first  point you made about girls. I think you said 28%   in STEM, exactly. And I think it's important  to say this. We're talking about re-skilling   people like me who are working. But we also  need to be paying attention to education   much younger. Make sure that  girls aren't weeded out in high  

school or weeded out when they go study at  university. We are 52% of the population.   I'm glad to see our virtual guest is back.  Back you, Deputy Minister Byabato of Tanzania.   Thank you. I'm so sorry this introduction  of the communication. Finally, and lastly,   I would wish to say we in Tanzania, and  I hope many of the African countries,   are eager to move faster into renewable energy.  And down here we are looking to make sure that  

when it comes to capacity we have something like  10% of the full internal capacity of our energy   into -- coming from renewable energy. And maybe as I said before,   we have those initiatives which are in place.  Making sure that we attain what we have to attain.   But I should also tell you what we have. We are  welcoming investors down here to invest into  

renewable energy. We are looking to have somewhere  in the future a 1,000 Mega watt coming from solar   and coming from wind and other areas like biomass  and geothermal. We welcome you. Whoever wishes to   invest here. The environment is conducive.  And very, very much favorable for anyone.   And to make sure, I assure you it is available.  The eagle project which was stated about   yesterday. At least 90% of that pipeline passes  through Tanzania and it is safe down here.   And it is a bigger advantage to both of us.  So, that is what I could say. Thank you.  

Thank you very much for those  final words. Back to the studio,   Mr. Breid from RENAC, your closing statements. Yeah. Nations should see this not as a burden,   but also an opportunity. And also reflect on  the co-benefits of climate mitigation. One   co-benefit has been mentioned already. Like  local job creation, local value creation.   There is a lot, a lot, a lot in it. Especially for  the renewable and energy efficiency sector. And   also to what my colleague says, it is so crucial  to really build up local training infrastructures   with local trainer pools, with local training  institutions. It is really not economic to  

send trainers around the world all the time. So,  and this is possible to really build up this local   training institutions and also as Rabia mentioned,  it would be good to reflect on where these skills   are needed. In which geographical region, yeah?  So, close to where the investments will be also.   And yeah, again, closing remark. I  think it makes sense that nations,   meaning different ministries really sit  together. Okay, what's the co-benefits  

of climate mitigation? What can be achieved in  our country concerning the local value creation?   Also, gender aspect and so on. I mean, to really  have the whole -- yeah -- opportunities to see   them. And then as a next step, really to decide on  developing strategies for skills development. On   different levels, for the different genders. For  the different professions along the value scale.   Thank you so very much for that perspective.  Our last panelist, final statements,   please, Miss #Basnet from energypedia. Thank you. My colleagues adequately summarized   everything, I will try to add. Especially with  the local capacity building, now there is a  

lot of resources and training material. But the  question of affordability is still a big issue.   As long as those are not affordable, applicable,  and available to the target audience, we are still   at a loss. So, really urging everyone to make it  affordable. Because it needs to be affordable.   And also, the second thing is because I'm a  practitioner myself, it's always assumed that   practitioners exchange happen automatically,  organically. They will just come together.  

We will exchange. But in real life, it doesn't.  You need to foster it, you need to nurture it. You   need to bring a couple of experts in the room. You  need to provide that environment so that there is   an exchange. Just the thought that it would happen  organically, it's more -- so, really let's foster   more exchange between practitioners. Because  there's so much of learnings in the sector.   And every time when we have such kind of events  where people come together, exchange ideas and,   you know, bring the experiences, there's so much  of collaboration happening. So, with really making  

resources available and really focusing and  fostering exchange between practitioners at   all level. Online, on-site, thank you. Thank you. Fostering exchange is what we   need to do here at the BETD and taken back to  the practitioners also. Please, Mr. Breid, you   wanted to say something else and we have time. Yes, I wanted to add to the question, who pays?  

Okay. And we need to see a differentiate between   education either on like technical level  or an academic level. And further training,   yeah? So, what concerning educational  programs for electricians, for plumbers,   for whatever -- mechanics. But  also in the academic level.   I think in the very end, for a government,  it is not so much expensive to just   modify the syllabus of the study  programs in the university.   For the technical and vocational training.  So, this has to be done once, yes. But I mean,   it's this kind of like lessons on PV installation.  For example, they're replacing others, okay?  

In the end, you don't need to have a longer  program. So, this is just to see, okay.   What kind of like the old topics that have been  touched on can be removed? And what can come in?   So, in the end, it will not be so much more  costs. Except for having this process.   Concerning the further training, there  is a segment where like people from   industry, commerce companies could go in and  pay for it. But again, this is a bit small  

also. And it depends on the possibility. If you  can really pay for that. So, it depends on the   country. It depends on the amount of money which  is available there. And also, for public servants.   Which play a crucial role, yeah? For giving  applications of construction for the regulators.   For I mean, yep. Providing all the different  services where public sector is involved.   There needs to be also the understanding  that public sector somehow has to invest   for the training of public sector stuff. This  is not falling from heaven, yeah? So, again,   it's a question who pays. In this case, again,  it's -- it's a public sector. So, coming back to  

private companies or private  people, participants can pay.   This is for the further training. But also to  a limited extent. So, this has to be seen.   I think it would be fantastic for all of  us if money did just fall from the sky.   Unfortunately that's not the case. The  idea of funding incredible important.  

We are now out of time. Thank you to the fantastic  panelists, what a fantastic way to start out   on day two of the Berlin Energy Transition  Dialogue. From Croatia, Minister Kristina Celic,   and virtually, Stephen Byabato, and Rabia  Ferroukhi, Berthold Breid, and Ranisha   Basnet. Thank you very much. It has been  such an honor and such a pleasure to have  

you here with me. We've got a few people  in the hall. I'm going to go ahead and   give you a round of applause. You were  fantastic. Thank you all so very much.

2022-04-11 14:18

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