Omegawave and Moxy as complementary training technologies
A quick. Intro. My. Name is Gareth or head of performance here at sport 91 with. A UK. Athlete, Institute, so we've, been operating since the early 2000s. And. Obviously. From then to now about, the luxury, of working with a great, group of different athletes different, organizations, partners. My. Whole new who's head of performance, so I get to fly manage SSE, team I still. Get to do a little bit of coaching for myself. And then I get to sit on our innovations, team as well and this. Innovations. Teams a little bit like our think tank, it's. What we're trying to think about the next treaty and ideas haven't improved, when you potential with our athletes and it's a little bits of slice of that which. Is what we're going to go through today. To. Start with. Why. You, know why. Look at me going why I look at mocs, indeed. Why I look at any of these technologies. So. Over. The time we've. Been really striving, to, move from a managed. Training, situation, to. One where we're able to optimize and, optimize daily, what. I mean by that is the process we usually do with our teams and disciplinary. Periodization. Forecasting. A few life to. Where, we can be a bit more objective we, could be a bit more personable, and personal, as. To when and how for what we do with each of athletes, so, it's this emergence. Of these, two areas which is what we've been interested in what, these technologies, to to us these, years I. Suppose. The. Other thing on the boat is that we've had to reverse engineer how, we've gone about cheating, so. Or. Anyone, that's listening to lose in coaching, those that the constraints, the packaging if I'm quite, different to an academic environment. So. Unless we are balancing when you potential with our athletes unless you know within team that we have a capability. Of moving winning. Potential forward we can't really use any of these. Just use it because it's interesting it's got to actually have outcome, that we can action so. You can reverse engineer basically. What do we need to do at the front line and what can support is doing. So. Where did we start or, we started, really you hear this all the time context. Is king and. It was a realization of all we, knew a lot about the sport context, know what doesn't affect and will do, and. We could break that down it's a nice digestible. Metric you notice this fast look this drawn what's this eccentric did your first serve whatever it may be we. Know a lot about the sports environment, but we knew very little about athlete. Specific context, so. How, well do, they adapt living, - you know how well do they respond to typical. Training because we're training travel, heat huge jet lag how. Well they adapt, to. This context and that, was really a little, bit of a Ground Zero so, we knew the sport but we really didn't know where I asked this worker so if. We were going to optimize daily that was the first thing that we need to cover we needed to get a better grip on where our, specific. Athletes context, were. That's. Where I am either way Kingman and we. Were lucky to work with the media wave in the early two-thousands, with soccer. Club. But. When it became portable, it really became a bit of a no-brainer first - looking. This context, specific, area that we wanted to look at so. We, really summarized, a legal area bus and do our athletes fly or survive in their environment so. We, got guys well adapted, yes. We have some adaptive capacity to, push them a little bit we can move them into that really potential, easier well. Do we have guys to a really, yes are able to produce the, external, market performance. That they're surviving on a lot of fluctuation, data sometimes. Good sometimes they're, not good and. That was critical for us and. So to start with we really we, really went at this point to be able to better at that what. We did with our athletes on the daily basis, and. Indeed the immediate way games that juice pumps where are you today so. If I'm going to do some video optimization with, you literally where is your adaption, profile what should I do and it. Also gave us the capacity to look over time. Some user cycling right so. In our quest, to optimize, this, was really a groundbreaking opportunity. We, could find out yes we know what the sport requires but. Now we can find out what you all like how, you're coping of what we can potentially do to optimize your training better on a daily basis, and.
We Use that for quite some time just, on its own you know this kind of level of data is, what we utilize, to try and move our winning margins fall and, it. Was pretty successful. Over. Time we, were searching for how to quantify. What. To do with a lie in, a more, objective way. And. Really that's where immediately. Solid, once again Moxie. Gaiters the flipside of the point we knew where you where you're democratically. Was but. We could now look at how you adapt lies in the training environment so what costs are you paying in the training environment. So. We're, you know what limit or you get in how he compensated, ultimately, was adapt likely, to be at, the end of this training session and critically. Here this this bottom bullet point so what don't this response, could produce the most favorable, of action, give. Them your current adaptive profile. So. There's. A quick summary between, a meter wave of moxie that what we were trying to achieve both, Tech's we're. Having allowed. Us to look at the athletes functional, systems. Stress. Both indications, from, trying to change include. This and you know D training, media. Where you guys looking at regulation, shifts, adaptability. In ROTC obviously playing around th p.m. estimate to resting. Levels and capacity to d7. Session, so. They both met the criteria we, need to be able to optimize daily, so we could have this planned, approach you know the Disciplinary. Period ice model but, we could start fine tuning that, on a daily basis, both what actions, like and then. A dose response of. The trainer G we. Now. The, second part of this I. Want. To explore and it's an adapt to fit your contest but. It's certainly, not here is a formulaic, approach. Stimulate. Some thoughts you've. Got to realize there is no real formulaic. Approach become, a coach you don't become a decision, maker with, and from. Those decisions you need to learn what's effective, and what's not with your classmates so. Don't. Take this as gospel but, it's there just as a jump-off, quite to discuss some of the tech. The. Athletes we're going to look at here on Univision sports athletes, reception.
Based Intimate, and speedo please so think people, like soccer racket, sports. Some. Of these guys have relatively, normal external, data so GPS the fourth platform for, the cost of living in this environment doing, these tasks varies enormously day, to day. So. The first group, and. We're going right at the top here these. Are our best guys these are I've, turned them elites here, Olympic. Medalist world champ superstars, moving super lucky to go to work this calendar we're asking. What. Do we learn when we approach this optimization, model, with them well, a great, percentage of those guys thrive you. Know think of that a media age to live and survive these guys are flying, so. That positively, adapt to the environment so, you tend to see very consistent, data from these guys not a lot of fluctuation, in the data and. Overload. So. A lot of greens and winds are trained ability so. They are meddling and they also look, like they're the best, drivers. Out of the group, when. We added Moxie to see what how we're doing in session we, tend to be strong external performance data, of crisis, party. Singer limiter so. One way shape or form they have found a way to in terms or balance between the mechanical profiles. The physiological, profile so they can perform very. Little cost so. High performance, outcome minimal, cost super, efficient. And. Ultimately. They. Were doing it with me before we looked at managing them so they managed, approach the forecast both actually very close to their optimum, it. Doesn't mean that we don't still optimize. Their routes it just means that the dose of the optimization. Is small we're looking at fine-tuning, these guys. And. That's good because their competition, schedules are so hectic. That there's very little development, time anyway. Now. With the elites it's worth noting. One. Particular group of units. And these are the guys who have got fantastic tactical, advantages, we, read the game really, really well and that's, their string that's what they win on and 19, out of 20 times that, successfully. These. Guys though you just have to be careful where they're, not able to do that for whatever reason they get off stuff in the game they can't do what they do. And. Then they willing to do some physical problems, earlier they sense here that limit is early they compensate, accordingly the.
Dose Is slightly different and so the immediate way believes it's a survival, kind of response an, unusual. Response or they impose it. It's. Good to find that because, the competition schedules, are so hectic, we. Need to see it and then use the moxie and the windows are trained ability to adapt their readiness for the next friend, so that we we, keeping them high as opposed to the start, of a declining. Process, so. With, the elites it's very much about fine-tuning what, they're doing watch, for the road bones live decisions. About training need some careful consideration these. Cars are already meddling, very, very, well if, we need waivers quickly constant, that found a way so. It's to feather that towards. Maintaining as. Opposed to going in there and just. So. The elites look, a leaf when we look at their optimized process well as they aren't getting pencils. With. Nor. That well these are still closed but they tend not to be the medalist or a different group of athletes so. They tend to the outsider medal contention at the Olympics not guaranteed that starting, eleven is Premier, League above. 20 in the world in a ratty sports car no position still. For normal, athletes, but. The same tends to be a difference, between you guys and those elites and, when we looked, they. Have a greater proportion, of survival, is fast than. 5mm sponsors, and that's happening, acutely so as one offs and through, chronically over time. Because. Of that response, they tend to have, great foodd rotations in their own need wave and I might be easy HIV, or energy or, mix of all evil and they. Tend to run into their limiter and complexity, larger. And earlier, than. The elite scheme so. They're there. We. Plan to optimum, is not quite as good, these. Guys really need support, and you've. Got to figure out what to do each individual if you look on actually I'm not giving really anything away because it's very difficult you're gonna have to look at the age of a figure out what each athlete needs to win war, but. These guys need this important, so they still have. Ideas. They still want to be a medal contender, they still want to get starting. 11 still greatly top 20 the. Common schedule is very busy so, you need to be careful about when you push it on when you stop now. If you know what their adaption, profiles life will be the wave and you know what their limited is to democracy, you can better optimize, the window of opportunity when, you get it so. If they don't play on Saturday and you want opportunity, to push them a little harder and start to the week you, can choose to do that and dose. Them accordingly, I still get the net ready state come next game so. These guys are the optimized. These. Guys are the ones that really need that. Inconsistent. Guys now. There's. All sorts of inconsistent, performers the guys we're looking at here tend, to be big survivors, again not drivers. So. Bigger limiters, bigger compensators. That's result and. Although, you can get different types of. Inconsistent. Performers. The ones that we're talking about here tends, to be the athletes, on the outliers, so high. And low on what the sprawl spectrum requires, so. For us that tends to be either, power houses in repeat sports repeat. Sprint support so power house trying to be in football, and, we tend to happen it's delivery interpretations, with those guys. Ideas. Of what. To do with them you, know you got to the sport requires you, to move them water water repeat sprinting, and. You've got to do that in sport specific way and it's going to require that to. Get better in to win war but, you got are doing the way which has a firing reaction, so the adaption profile, and their efficiency, ieading little need to be included. So. Markers, in the data which tends to go along with these guys including, the resting and resting, sno2 speed, of estimate it could be between the intervals total. Amount of descent. Reset let's move to, MRI. Improvements, bagel in see improvement shape. Of time and values of DC. If you're, hitting those and improving, the sport performance to know the efficiency, is, getting better than the limit is getting less, and, you're likely to not. Have this inconsistent. Performance, along the way as well. The. Other end of the inconsistent, performance, athletes, are the ones who can't get in towards within the game they tend to lack the explosive, characteristics. So good, GPS, data. Can. Actually acutely, appear to top 5 but, when you look put the data in a bit more detail, they.
Tend To tap, cradle. Dominant patterns so they tend to run on the engine quite a lot and that's where they get their survival. Alongside. That bagel dominance, they tend to be utilisation, limited, assuming that no greedy modes of effect there, so. What do we do with guys like this. Coaching. Wise we use a mix of external, and internal data, so the overarching goal is to reduce the volume down and enhance intensity, can gain some mechanical, efficiency so. External markers, xld separations. High speed ones also great and for sauce pro farm work on your fishing pot that profile, to make them better and. Moxie, you can use throughout all of that you, can look at dese at peak of really PG, sets leave away we're looking more balanced each off because of being dominant, so, that's either less vehicle, power, or just grace sympathetic power. Obviously. Improve them it could be pattern because. You're working quickly, just. Need to watch the tissue, overload, you, know you need. You're too fast one way then. We can start running into support. The. Last group, that was going to provide a little bit of information on here is the group are termed as mindset, these. Guys tend to be more is better they're. Overly, focused on outcome measures so, they're, not very process driven more, is better bigger, kgs, lifts more. Training, lifts more of everything they. Have high. Training monotony so high doses. Exceeds, limit up all the time more. Is better. What. Do we see with athletes like this large. And potentially. Negative I will trends within within, you need wave data so SNS, domination, that eliminates. HIV, reduced. MRI effectiveness. Large, deviations. In DC all over the place. Poor legal powers are don't cover very opportune based exercise. Huge. Compensations. In our world that tends to be big offs you should not take large, mechanical outputs, just mutes the movie limitations. How. Do we optimize using. Both wave and these. Guys we. Tend to use the data to empower yeah this is a belief issue me. Adding my belief to them it's unlikely to be effective if I show them the adaptive. Profile, I show them what they're doing why it. Gives them the opportunity to learn from themselves ask me or ask the team what. This means what they could do to improve it so they, effectively. Learn from themselves and improve themselves and we can go back to coaching supposed to Japan's convinced market. So. A little bit of a summary for me amoeba wave of moxie, both, provide information on the adaptability of your athletes of stress a media, wave acutely chronically, on adaption capacity Moxie on live and, acute, and chronic adaptions, both. Texts, are incredibly, useful if. You want to try and optimize, trading alongside, the, traditional creep, an approach, that's. It. Okay. I think thank you very much Gareth. We'll. Just. Go right over to Aaron I think Aaron Aaron's got a presentation, as well so. We'll just uh we'll, go right over to Aaron next okay okay, everybody hear me good. All. Right. Okay. So. I'm. Aaron Davis of training, up Duvall up here in Austin Texas, we've. Been using both the Omega wave and and.
Mock Now for they. Had probably four. Or five years and. For. Us the, marriage of these two systems. Is I. Think. For us probably. The cornerstone, of what we do. And. When. We start looking at these monitoring. Technologies. Even with Gareth was talking about right like I always like to try to keep it as simple. As possible in, the essence of what it really is even, if that's monitoring, from a, wellness. Questionnaire, or your forceplates, or a watch, when it comes to speed, if. We boil it down it's, all about energy. It's either the expression, of energy we're watching how the the. Body is utilizing, energy or maybe. Trying. To mobilize energy, for. A given situation or, environment. So. It. Doesn't matter what we do and how complicated, is I think sometimes we kind. Of get lost in the weeds, a little bit when we look at both the Omega wave and and Moxie but if, we really just look at it as from a very simple perspective, that we're just looking at energy. Just. Like Gareth said which is very, very interesting, and I love, that he mentioned it the fact that when he sees his elite athletes, we see these athletes a mega wave data this kind of plateau, out right and in a good way it stays steady and consistent I, always. Like to give an example of the fact that if you're the guy watching, the seismograph, on an earthquake you like it when it doesn't say anything right, or it, doesn't say a lot you know big fluctuations. If you see big fluctuations, then you know that there's something that's going on that's wrong right, and, it's very similar in this monitoring, aspect. And, especially with the mega way when we look at the adaptive, potential. Of an athlete we, would want to see things being consistent, while hard work is still being done. Now. It. Is also good in this essence the seeing FG. Starts being lower what, are the adaptations. That, are. Happening within that or, even when it an athlete becomes depleted right. That's. Where a mega wave really comes in because in these altered states we can see what, part of the functional, systems we, need to address or we need to intervene right and in, our space we do a lot of one-on-one. And kind of deep dive on a lot of these athletes and. This. Gives us the road map of what system, might be playing, catch up which. One is really strong and a, mega wave really gives us that picture. Now. When. We look at Moxie this is just a representation, of like one high intensity interval. It's. Still the same thing if you think of like what Moxie, is doing from an acute standpoint, in real time within. That workout we're looking at energy being, utilized, and and gained. Within. That session all right so it's always about energy, a mega way it gives us more of that kind of that loading, and that adaptation while, Moxie's. Given us that acute bout and and being able to really monitor and, intervene in. Real time. Obviously. When. S mo to Falls. That's, when the, athlete is utilizing. Energy. And then in the recovery period is when, it comes back up and we know we're ready again for next interval. Very. Very simple. Also. If we just kind of look at it from a very simplistic. Standpoint. From both, the the th. B which. Is the blood volume at that acute site and s, mo - we, can now say, hey how. Much how. Big is this battery what's the capacity, right and then how much potential. How much is that battery charged by the s mo - okay, at, the end of the day if this is an interval and I'm watching this this just allows me to see what, the energy status in that muscle is while the athletes going in real-time so. How. Do these guys talk to each other. They. Talk to each other in multiple ways but I'm just going to pick this one just, because it's interesting this, is a field sport athlete fast. But. If, we really talk to the coaches they're the ones that are saying that this guy doesn't have very good endurance, wear.
Capacities, Crap, they. Might even say, that. He is lazy, right. And. When. We look at these athletes, especially on a mega way we can start seeing cardiac. Numbers being low this. Aerobic and anaerobic status. Is just a. A representation, of the heart if we just think about it from a very simple perspective. If. We're, seeing an aerobic high and aerobic, low. We, know that that that heart is playing. Catch-up now within. That environment, and. So. We really want to change these numbers and generally when we think and we see these athletes, and. Specifically, when we had just the amiga wave, you. Know there, always is these I come from the endurance background, and so I'm taking this athlete and I'm like okay we really, need to up, the, the, volume of this low-end, aerobic work right and we. Really didn't see huge, changes, we. Knew there was an issue there it was spotted, but. The intervention. We chose. Didn't. Take into account some of the mechanical, forces within this athlete. Here. Was the. Kind. Of the monthly averages when we first started obviously. Giving. Athletes, a bunch of roadwork. For. This type of athlete will usually. Not. Be great and that's. Just because when we start looking at these mechanical, forces we. Have to realize that within the contraction, of their sports and. Activities. They're doing they, can affect. How, blood, flow is. Entering. Into the muscle and leaving the muscle. And. With. That said we, also have to realize that if, there, is. Inhibition. Of blood, coming back to the heart the heart's gonna have to work quite, a bit harder, and. So that's really where. Moxie's, come in in the sense of looking at what, does the contraction. Type, actually affect, some, of these kind of physiological, parameters, that we're picking up on a mega wave if. We have athletes that are doing their sport and they're constantly, in arterial occlusion where they're blocking off both the inflow and outflow the. Heart's going to have to work just that much harder for, that given activity in duration. Granted. This, slide here just shows the spectrum of how kinda we look at arterial, occlusion if we really think of arterial occlusion to the right for. Those a mega web users, this. Is let's say a powerlifter you're doing their one arm. Velocity, is slow force is high creating, a lot of tension it's, ideal in that sport but, it's probably not ideal for a marathon, runner which and this, is represented, in actually, when we. Monitor. Runners, or strength, athletes, right, we never seen a marathon, or at least not a good marathon yet arterial, clued during their sport. And. Likewise I doubt I'm gonna see a powerlifter, that's super. Elite not create much tension and just do a compression force okay. So. Here's the spectrum, right. Just. So you guys can, kind of see a visual what I'm talking about what may be an occlusion looks like it's, just that hose analogy, if I crimp, one in the hose fluid, will build up on the other side that, crimping, action is the muscular, forces. To, the capillary, beds. One. Thing that we have to realize that in sports performance, we always talk about things being fast. And. Powerful and, you. Know we. Use these words that are that are very aggressive, but we also have to realize that. For. Athletes to perform their sport and the characteristics, that.
Allow, Them to repeat, these, high, aggressive. Contractions. Is. That, they have to relax. And. So this is actually from super. Training it's taken out of super training and this is just from, level one to your left to level, five to your right this is the different qualifications, of athletes, by being elite, one, being the. Couch potatoes and you. See that contraction. Is a gentle. Slope but the relaxation, velocity. Is is is, the, bigger deterrent, on what. Causes that athlete to be elite, but. It's something that we don't talk about or we, don't think about training with a lot of these athletes. So. When, we started this athlete, we we started doing actually, high intensity, exercises, but at low force. In other words maybe on a spin bike but, going at high rpms, with. Very. Low force so you just spin it and the idea is that when we look at this from an acute standpoint, with. The Moxie we're trying to allow the athlete to do high-intensity. Without, occlusions. Okay, and we can walk we can monitor that in real time even. After the first, month. We can then start seeing that the heart doesn't have to work as hard are, we training hard of course we are it's just that we're doing it in a different way to allow the athlete to recover because like Gareth, said before the. Best athletes, right this should be just steady, right, and then that's kind of what we got from then on out right we got a steady increase. But, it's really just kind of just plateaued there and that's great even, though we're still doing hard work. Another. Example, which is something that's probably gonna you, know probably talked about more. Probably. Later when we start diving, down into this you. Know physiology. Here in a couple years is the. Fact that. What. Myoglobin it can actually do so myoglobin is, the. Heme protein, that's attached to the muscle that's gives the red tint we. Started noticing that, that roll has, a, very unique role and when we started seeing these athletes, that would come in that was overtrained, we'd see these big parasympathetic. Shoots on. A mega wave and it was always interesting to me to look at these deviations. From the norm and see like well what is actually. Happening and what, does this actually look like on the. Moxie and. So. We started seeing that, we, would have huge, increases, of SM o2 percentage, and very. Low D saturation, right, and so that's just one high. Intensive about this athlete is going all-out and can only desaturate. About, ten percent right and. This. Was really, the trend high s mo to low. D set. Then. On days the kamut come in and look. Normal. It.
Would Be a completely different picture huge. Desaturation, moderate. Sm o2 percentage. And. The same. And. So it really got me thinking okay what, what are things that potentiate. That that vagal, tone or, that over vagal expression. And. It's. Interesting looking that even, the the, moxie unit itself if we really look at the signal, that, myoglobin, is a big, part of that signal, and that's not a bad thing I think people look at as a bad thing but we just don't understand, the mile globins physiology, myoglobin. Has a way to store, nitrate, and to turn into nitric oxide to help the cell kind, of survive right, and it also scavenges. For nitric oxide okay, but. In. Overtraining. States. Systemically. You're gonna have a rise in nitric, oxide, it's your emergency, vasodilator. Okay, but. It also potentiates. That parasympathetic. Activity. So. When we come back up and we see these high parasympathetic states, we. See these, that. S mo tube gets limited because nitric, oxide actually limits. Cytochrome. C oxidase in that mitochondria. So it actually stops the utilization of. Oxygen. Okay not favorable, for some of these athletes by any means and so. We. Really kind of dope in. You. Know to this and started, looking at well how does this really, affect Moxie, and then how does this affecting, some, of the chronic stuff we're looking at a mega wave right and it's, really this myoglobin, has. Tons. Of different interactions. With their physiology that we just are not too, keen on quite yet but. It's something that allows us seamen for us you, know longtime, Moxie, users when SM o2 is, desaturating. Really well desaturating, really well then all of a sudden it just stops nobody, told me what that was right. Or what's going on there and there's, maybe a potential case. For it being this nitric, oxide, production. From. The myoglobin. Stopping. The utilization. Of, oxygen, and it's. Just interesting that from a peripheral, standpoint, if we do that type of exercise, too much and we're going into this like survival, mode within that muscular tissue that. It might throw off some of our autonomic s-- right. And it's something that when we look at this, mega wave and Moxie weekend in one, from. The, Omega wave we can then intervene. Because. Too many times we, also hear, about all this athletes stress they're very sympathetic but we don't talk about that parasympathetic, overshoot. Which in my book is actually probably worse because. You still have utilization, to the sympathetic side but parasympathetic, overshoot, means that you're probably not getting great utilization. And ultimately, we, really think of that oxygen, not being utilized by the cell is probably. One of the most unhealthy things, in fact most diseases are in this state right depressions. In this state we there's even research out there that you know cancer sometimes, represents. Itself like this and so for, us when. We see athletes, push to this like overtraining, state we're, looking at one can we identify it on on, you. Know a mega, wave and then can we intervene, by looking at what's actually happening, with Moxie. And. If you use Moxie, enough and if you study myoglobin, you can see that in those hard, states when, the athlete and that tissue is really. Beaten. Up doing. Low-level aerobic. Work with, very high s mo to build. Up will. Actually scavenge. A lot of this nitric oxide, and. Even. Doing altitude, training with let's say a respiratory trainer, with, co2 will, help reverse some of these and I'll even help reverse that the autonomic because, the body will feel that it can actually drop off and utilize oxygen again and, so it's these little I guess, you could say. Nuances. That we really look forward to identify what's, actually going on and for. Us we, couldn't get, that picture completely. Unless we had both systems. So. That's my little tidbit on kind, of the marriage of both a. Mega. Wave and moxie, appreciate. You you guys is that time. All. Right thanks, everyone thanks, for presenting both both. Erin and Gareth there if anyone, has questions. Please. Submit. Them into the chat box on the in. The lower right of your screen. I've, got a couple here, so. So, first of all if. You see a con like between, the moxie and the Omega wave data what, do you what, do you do about that I.
Suppose. This what kind of conflict yeah. Is. It something that you see commonly. I. Mean, we can see sometimes, the most common one that I would say is that. We see is that maybe the cardiac system looks really good on a, mega wave but. Then maybe. What we consider like the the, blood. Volume at the particular muscle, might not reflect say. An increase in th B when we would expect it to but. Then there's there's tons of reasons for that if the peripheral, system. Is safe. The muscles as we know even with ten tomography as muscles, get, more fatigued they get more stiff and so, if an athlete is doing repeat sprint work or whatever else and that stiffness might, actually start, limiting, the blood flow in that area. But. Then there's also the obvious things that when. We look at cardiac we don't think of like stroke volume we think of you know we obviously think of heart rate but. We don't think of stroke volume contraction. Time of the heart so there's, a lot of different variables how that heart kind of creates. The. Output, that sometimes, we just can't capture unless we have some of these other like maybe a physio flow or something that can really kind of dive in. But. Those are that that's I would say that one's probably the bigger one that I see at times where we get a clear green light on the cardiac but it's maybe not showing up for, whatever reason, and we generally can tease that out on. The. The th B side. Okay. Just just adding to that what sometimes, having event whether you see this as well you. Sometimes get greenlit, cardiac, on, HRV. Data, the, rest I guess mo to is, low relative, to them you, know so heart's good to go but maybe there's a community. Fatigue. Issue that it's, not kicked up on. Okay. Okay. Great, we've got one, here this, one maybe well, maybe you can comment it comment, on it now but it might be one to follow up on, the forum discussion. But it says thanks for the great presentation. I'm. Struggling, to find peer-reviewed. Studies. On the use I, should. Read the whole thing here I. Find. The DC potential approach of a mega wave very interesting. In. It in addition to heart rate variability but I'm struggling to find, peer-reviewed, studies, on its use in recovery, monitoring, can, you help me out. Gareth, you want to hit that one I mean yeah, yeah for, sure I mean I think it's two things there, are no legal. Studies. On this that, should be published in the next kind of six, to twelve months but. Beyond that there is, I've. Actually got a load of data on us but they won't you know send me some info I can actually throw. Them a load of papers on it. Okay. Okay great well we will post this on our forum and and so we can continue some of these discussions there as well another. One here how is the Omega wave date data, gathered, processed, and presented. The. Amega wave data is just two. Ten-minute, tests depending on what system you have, most.
The Athletes that we have that our mobile are, a two-minute tests when they when they wake up and. It. Is, used off their iPhone or Android, phone and it's you, know we have one electrode on the forehead one on the palm and you, have the, Omega, wave. Chest. Strap and. It's gathered in two minutes and it's you. Know given, right to your to the phone I think they're think there's an option where the athlete might not be able to see it which sometimes is good, and. Just so, and, then it's up into a cloud for the coaches to to, monitor. Okay. The, next question have you used ten siomai ography, with moxie before and seen associations. Between the, TMG, results, and moxie. Outcomes, during work no I haven't I'd say that probably the person just been, able to study the cinematography, is extremely, expensive but, the probably the expert in that field would probably be Landin Evan sees he's. Done tons. Of work with both moxie, and mega wave in intensity oh my ography. Okay. There's. A handful, of comments here about we had some audio and and some video difficulties. I think with the with. The webinar software it was a little glitchy today just, so everyone knows we will be posting a recording of this that. Should have those issues should not have those problems so if. You want to follow up later on that. Aaron. Do you recognize, desaturation. As an indication, of, minimum. Effective, training, effect. Yeah. I would say that depending on what we're doing. You. Know if we're looking for, detached any, lights a high power, outputs. And. Generally, the athlete, does Dees at we generally have like kind of norms, for the athlete it's very individual, you can't obviously put averages, with athletes, together across the board but individually. We can see specific. Desaturation, time points, and. Percentages. And I just want to make sure that that looks. Normal. I always. Talked about it in the sense that like if you. Know say if somebody is doing an.
Interval, Based method. And they're their only, goal is like they hit 350, watts on every, interval say, and they. Have to repeat that every week I would. Probably want desaturation. Not to be as low. As week. One right. Because it become more efficient, now. If I'm looking for high output, in that same regard on each one and they're they're maximizing their power right, their wattage on each interval then I would want I should expect the. Normal, desaturation, that we look for on each interval and the moment that they don't desaturate. That's. The moment will will cut them off because. And. The reason why is that not the fact that they can't handle it they can go in this survival, mode and do a couple more reps that's great but, it's the idea that we have to make sure that the. Next day they can come back and we go hard again I think, a lot of times when we think about this monitoring, we think that we're making athletes, soft but in reality I think it's like no if we use it correctly we can maybe. Get more intensive. Training that will actually move the needle a little bit more, and I think that's the goal I. Think. That's absolutely key, you know in. The fields we work with in Texas, collage you can to, take, away from athletes, and that, that that that's, Tegan was there with the athletes as soon as you bring something you take in their thinking what is this gonna stop me playing on Saturday so, actually using it for more there's. Always a training outcome, whatever, that may be you're, trying to get more from these guys that's fine and that that is absolutely key message. Okay. The next, question here I'm new to maxi but have access, to another heart. Rate variability app are. There patterns with SM o2 and, thb that are present, during. Sympathetic. Overstressed. Or parasympathetic. Overstressed. It's. A necessity to. Be there present. Well, just on the parasympathetic. Overshoot. Side you know presented on we're seeing that on, the sympathetic, side I don't I'd, probably you, know agree with Gareth. In the sense that they they're big utilizers, right there they're going to the well all the time. But. On the parasympathetic side, we're just seeing probably. Lower utilization. Which. You, know if we like I said if you look at that mile globe and physiology, a little bit deeper I think that all probably tees itself out on. That, I suppose one, of the thoughtful consideration if you're, able to profile the guys for lost do is particularly, at the high velocity. High course requirements, see what muscle stiffness characters, the attendant, compliance, know, what so mechanical, efficiency like, some, of these guys who tend to be quite, fatigued. Or dominant they're not that sharp. At that end of the for supposedly spectrum either so from a mechanical efficiency perspective. Okay. And they. Said thanks, how about extended, reps and high-intensity, reps. Extended, reps versus, high-intensity, reps in the sense of I. Guess, in what context. Let's. Well let's maybe come back to this one in the in the forum if, you'd like to continue, that discussion on, the forum we're. Not with this format we're not real good with the back-and-forth so the the forum might be a better way to go out, twenty second Sprint's versus ten minute oh there you go there you go yeah I would say. I'm. It's. Gonna sound weird coming, from an endurance background, but I look at everything from a sprint, coach's eyes. Because. In a sense that we, just talked about these mechanical, forces from contraction right, you. Know when we see these mechanical, forces.
Let's, Say occlusions. Happened. It's just an intramuscular, like. Bracing, strategy, right they just they have to like try to recruit a lot just to kind of make this coordination, of the whole body happen, at. Those desired power. Outputs, and so, when. We think of trying to train these athletes, depending, on the sport. I always, think we got to be kind of close to whatever velocities, or power outputs that they're producing and, ultimately. Try to make. Them more efficient, so they can repeat this process over and over again and so we just have to identify what that looks like if it's an endurance athlete. What, their coordination, needs, to be is whatever race pace is right so if they're a mile or a four-minute, mile pace then their coordination, needs, to be very efficient, at. That, pace so then we, want to train certain, aspects, or certain intervals, around that. That. Pace and and by, using moxie we can and again just like I said before if we have an interval of 350. Watts every. Interval, right and we do that on week one I shouldn't. See that same, desaturation, maybe less desaturation, by like week four or six and it's very similar when we think of endurance training. Say. That four-minute, mile pace if that's sixty second per quarter if I do that over multiple. You. Know weeks I would see hopefully, less desaturation. Right more efficiency, at race pace more coordination, at race pace and then, extending. It right, and. So it's not that ten, minute runs are better than 20-second. Sprint's or vice-versa it's, just really trying to marry. You. Know the the intervention, with what the athlete actually needs. Okay. I think we'll take one, last question here and then we'll, finish up. Gareth. Do you think that Omega wave would, be more. Accurate to measure heart rate variability if, the, assessment, was while sleeping, when. In theory there is not any kind of voluntary, disturbance, from the person for. Example the changing and breathing, rhythm, for. Sure I think this there's a whole heap of paper out there on Stevie HRV. Working. In the line that we work with in college. So there are, inevitable. Pitfalls, as to when we take it but. As long as you context. Your lies when. They're taking it and it's, normalized, each time so they take it more like 30 minutes after getting up the, note foods no Cathy you know none of that and, that's when they do it as long as it's baseline, get continuation, of eating then that's more realistic with, us to be able to obtain. Likewise. If they're awake and they're traveling we only get it in a hole before we go compete and at least we get what you like before you go on so, I suppose to, some degree it's the environmental, constraints of getting the guys to do it because, value if you're looking at this sleeping, HRV for sure but, in our experience getting, guys to do. That regularly. Be. Very difficult. Okay. Thank. You so much for for, giving the presentations, and answering, the questions and and thank you to all of our attendees. I'd. Also like to say thank you to Mikhail, at Omega wave was. His idea for, putting. This webinar topic, together and he. Helped with the organization, of the event so. A big, THANK YOU to Mikhail, when, I when I send out the follow-up with the with. The recording, I will also send the contact. Information for Mikhail, if you'd like more, information on, Omega, wave. So. With that I think we'll wrap it up for today and thank, you again to everyone, yeah thanks guys, thanks. Guys.