The Wombat's Matthew "Murph" Murphy talks, touring, TikTok and "taking a risk" with 'Oh! The Ocean'
So hi guys, Jonathan Graham here for Guitar Interactive Magazine. We are sitting here with Murph from The Wombats. How are you doing today? I'm good, thank you. Thanks for having me. Man, it's such a pleasure to see you, but in particular when it's a release of a new album and it's just dropping in a couple of days. Yeah. How are you feeling? Good, yeah. It's kind of that interim period when it is no longer mine
and it becomes everyone else's. And see, I'm excited, but a bit nervy and kind of quite tired. Yeah, of course. No, I can believe it.
But you should rest easy, obviously. Oh, The Ocean, it's called. It's fantastic. I got to hear it a couple of days ago.
Obviously, you need that fan reaction. But, you know, you're coming off a number one record, the biggest record you guys have done, sold out tours all over the place. Was there that little bit more pressure to follow? Did you follow up such a hit record? No, not really. It would be nice to have another number one.
But, no, I think we just want to make albums that people want to listen to 25 times from start to finish before they kick the bucket. That's the goal. Absolutely. And if it charts at number 20 and does that and charts at number one but doesn't do that.
We'd rather it chart at 20. Has that always been your approach to writing? No. No, not back in the day. Not on, like, album two where I had kind of Warner breathing down my neck and, you know, and rightly so, trying to get the best out of me and the band. So then I would have, yeah, I would have probably wanted the more material number one than the...
Long-term value. No, absolutely. Just to get it done with. For sure.
And in terms of, like, the process of actually crafting the music, because obviously, like, everything feels on here like it's super cohesive. It needs to be an album. I think it can't just be, you know, these days you wonder, is the album format even as important? Because people can just release singles and just keep that train going.
This feels very much like a collection of songs that needs to be an album. Was that specifically the way you set out to do this? Because obviously coming off such a hit record, you could take that approach where you go, well, we'll just drip feed a few bits and pieces over the time, but you guys sat on it, you crafted something fantastic, and then you end up with this new record. We wanted to do something different, and we figured that not taking a risk was the riskiest thing we could do. Right. So we worked with John Congleton, who's worked with everyone, basically, and is a bit of a mad bastard.
And he, yeah, it was a whole different approach to recording an album than we've done on the last three. Well, all of them, to be honest. And we recorded every song from, you know, everything was tracked from the start to finish.
There was no, like, jumping into a point. Even if you wanted to jump into a point at the end, you had to go from the start. Wow. And he didn't listen.
John didn't listen to any of the demos, which are demoed to a height. We could release those demos. They're pretty, they sound good. He didn't want to listen to them. And so every song started with generally me just playing the song on an acoustic guitar or on a piano or something. And that's how we got into the song.
And then we started working from then on with a lot of live takes. And, yeah, it was very different. Yeah.
And kind of annoying at times. But the songs were finished at that point. You said the demos.
Yeah, the demos were good. I mean, there were a few songs where kind of the structure or arrangement changed. But the songs were all there, ready for him to listen to if he wanted to. So, yeah, that obviously why that gives it that extra little bit of energy there.
So what are some of the frustrations about crafting this, crafting the recordings and that? To be honest, it was just, it was me. I just got frustrated, I think, on like two occasions where I was playing a song that clearly isn't meant to sound like an open mic night kind of at a pub at 10pm kind of thing. And I was like, why am I doing this? But aside from those couple of moments, everything was great. And I think it has this organic kind of raw, messy quality. Like it's not, it's not the most. Gritted, well, it's just not a gridded album.
It's not like, it's not the height of our musicianship. It's not perfected. It's a, you know, just a bit below to give it that excitement.
But there's a human element that's going on there. Cause obviously you guys, you know, you're prolific with your live shows. Incredible energy on these shows as well. So I guess that must have been the goal was to capture a little bit of that energy in a live show. Yeah.
Because. Over the years, I suppose when you're recording in different ways, you don't always, I mean, it allows for people when they're going to a live show to get a completely different experience, but it's a shame sometimes that that's not captured. And it definitely does feel like you've got that on Ode to the Ocean, you know? It feels like it's definitely the closest we've ever got to a live show on an album, which is, which is cool. And a lot of the things that he would have us do were, you know, as I said, if we wanted to go into a certain specific part of the song and change something, he'd make it, we'd start from the start and finish at the end, not just jump to that section. And we, he would never, ever take the bit that we were aiming at. He'd take all the mistakes and accidents that happened around it.
So yeah, it's kind of an album of, you know, purposefully found accidents. Oh yeah. Well, it's, it's fantastic for sure. Just taking things back to the start. Do you remember? Like the first sort of time you were here in the guitar, it really sort of in a song that just made you feel like I need to pick one of these up and learn.
Oh God. My dad had me playing guitar when I was five or six years old, like classical guitar, and I didn't really like it, but I did it. Yeah. And then, I don't know. And then my music taste went on a serious kind of U-turn into like dancey, hard, happy, hard. Of course, Scouse stuff.
And then I heard Creep one New Year's Eve. So maybe, maybe, maybe the, the chugs in just before the chorus of Creep would be a moment that made me go, yeah, I would like to do that. Just inspired you in that way. And then what were you, what were you playing guitar wise? Like what did you have when you were that young? Always tellies. The first telly I got was kind of a Johnny Greenwood-esque beautiful. Um, gray, gray burst.
Right. We called it a telly, but with really hi-fi Japanese pickups in it. Sure. Um, I can't remember what the brand name was. Um, so you always, always tellies.
Just that shape's always stood out to you. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Um, tellies and strats.
And then my, my blue Bob, the telly I've been using for about 20 years now. I don't know how he's still going. Um, but yeah, he's, it's. It's just a, uh, a neck pickup and a bridge pickup, um, going straight to the volume pot. So it's really little, you can't do much with the sound. You just, it's either on or off.
And has that always been your approach? You've just sort of preferred to just go keep it as simple as possible. You use it more in terms of like the, the colors are coming from you more than necessarily effects pedals and messing around with the amp. Oh God. I hate messing around with the amps and effects pedals.
Like fully, I just can't, I'm not a good, I'm not, I don't have the patience to twiddle anymore. But, um, yeah, I just like the guitar that feels good. Sounds good. Um, for, for live show.
And I like them, I like them bright for the live show because there's so much bass coming off stage. I need something to, in my head, something to sit on top of all the, um, low end. But, um, yeah, I, I mean, I play some strats and other things on stage, which have, um, you know, the pick up selectors on, which I keep knocking and changing and that, then that starts annoying me. So I just like a guitar with a volume pop. Absolutely. And how does that change for you in the studio? Because obviously there's plenty of colors that are going on in there.
Big, big wall of sound at times must be, you know, multi-tracked and what have you, but is that something you're actively getting involved in after the fact, or you'd leave that down to the production a bit more? I think when we're, when we're tracking, we will cycle through guitars and, um, and, um, pedals and stuff, but, um, I can, I, I can only do, you know, 30 minutes of that before I'm like, what is this? We need to stop and just record. But to be honest, John is so good with all that stuff. Um, you can just relax, relax and rely on him. Of course, for sure. Now it's one thing to be able to play guitar, but to be able to write for your own voice is, you know, it's incredible talent finding your own voice with songwriting.
Was that something that came to you quite quickly, or was it something you really needed to work on to get, get it down? It, um, when I first, uh, when I first started writing songs, I honestly kind of was just ripping off other stuff. Um, and I didn't really know what I was doing. And then I remember a period when I was in uni, like listening to different class by Pulp. Mm-hmm. And just listening to Jarvis Cocker's lyrics and going, oh, he's just singing about real life stuff. And that is resonating with people.
Um, and then, and then that kind of opened up a, a portal for me. And I was like, oh, I can, I don't have to be as ambiguous anymore. And I can wear my heart on my sleeve and just open up the flood gates. And that, that was, I think that was when, you know, I guess, um, my voice started coming through and I guess I've also been lucky enough that I, you know, I'm, um, I'm pretty, um, I'm a pretty open person. So it's kind of easy for me to just talk smack about myself or my loved ones even, and just get it on, get it out.
Get it down. No, I mean, obviously great singer, songwriter, all of that stuff, but you know, it's kind of taken for granted sometimes how, um, great artists like that can really be very real on, on a record, because a lot of the time, especially these days with social media and filters and all that, the same things happens in music where people kind of wear these masks, something that they're not, but the stuff that really resonates, of course, is something that's very true. And, uh, but Caesar said that done to actually do that. So to find out that you've been able to do that right from, right from the office, impressive, also disappointing that it's not something that you learned, I guess that all the greats, that said, they just kind of have that, have that in them.
Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I, it still gets me into trouble. Like my, um, my wife for camey is always like, there's a song on this new album, kind of all about our old neighborhood. And, um, I'm, I'm really just exposing the gossip and she's like, why did you have to do that? Like when this album is released, at least 40% of them are going to hear this and you're going to put us in a, put us in an awkward situation.
I'm like, yeah, I mean, I am. Um, and I'm sorry. Absolutely. No, you know, you're part of the tour that's coming up. Obviously you've got this fantastic homecoming show record release on, uh, uh, on Friday. Uh, you'll be back at the O2 again in London.
Yeah. Obviously played Glastonbury multiple times. What have you, what are some of the downsides of playing these mega shows? Cause obviously people just look at like, Oh, it's amazing. That's sold out.
Everyone's there to, to adore you and what have you, but there must be some aspects of it that are a little bit challenging playing a big venue. Well, um, there are, there are, I mean, there's certainly aspects to huge festivals that are, that are challenging. I mean, um, just getting, getting onsite, making sure, you know, it's just festivals are a bit of a struggle getting onsite, getting, getting all the right credentials, making sure that you, you, you, all your gear isn't covered in mud and piss and, um, getting on stage with everything working is, is a lot. But then, um, but then the shows are, are amazing.
Um, but then I don't really, I, I, I don't almost don't see a downside in big shows like the O2. I am way more comfortable in that setting than I am, you know, at a 400 capacity club where I can see everyone's faces and I can see, I can see that like Murray's bought, brought her boyfriend, but he is not into the wombats and like he's having a shit time. And I can see, I can see all this stuff playing out in, in, um, uh, across the, across the set and it takes me out of it and starts to prang me out. Whereas in the O2, it's like big lights. Everyone is kind of one massive energy. And, um, and I also, I can hide as well.
I feel like I can hide at the O2. I can't hide in the smaller shows. So there's really no downside to the bigger ones for me. Makes sense. Playing a show at the O2, what's your, uh, what's your rig? Is it up going to be for that? Obviously we'll, we'll see that very recognisable telly, but what about amps wise? Oh, well, I mean, we're all, we're on Kempers now. Yeah.
Yeah. When did you switch to that? 20, what, fourth album, I think. Was it the fourth album? No, was it the fifth album? I think it was the, I don't know, fourth or fifth album or maybe in between. And I suppose once you're at that stage where you're playing such big venues, a lot of the time you're hearing probably just what's coming back through. Uh, the monitors and that anyway. So I guess with the Kemper, you're not really feeling a difference in the, the, the, the sensation.
Well, the great thing about the Kempers is, and why I wanted to use them was because it allows us to have, you know, um, 10 different guitar sounds in one song. Um, and I was always kind of tap dancing as I was trying to play and sing and I was always kind of bouncing between these words. You can just, you know, um, the Kempers just do it for you. It's just there, yeah.
So I think I would rather, like in an ideal world, we would rather go back to touring amps for that kind of sound, but, um, it's just too, it's just too, too easy. I suppose as well, like touring the world as well, it's so easy now, isn't it? You could just put that in your hand. Yeah, I mean, our, our tour manager was very, very happy when we decided to do that. Yeah, I bet, I bet for sure.
Looking back on Wombat's career, I mean, I mean, we're, yeah, over 20 years now that you guys have been, been around and obviously the music industry has changed massively in that point. I mean, now when you guys came in, the process even to sort of get signed or get popular is almost, that, that's almost non-existent now. You know, people are getting big off TikTok and what have you.
If you were starting over again, would you do anything different today? Well, I almost, well, I kind of think it's more extreme now. That, that, that when we started still artists and bands, we're only getting signed when they could pull a crowd. We only really got a record deal after we sold out the, the Academy in Liverpool. But now I guess that's translated to, well, you can only get signed if you've got half a million TikTok followers or whatever. So now it just seems kind of crazy and a bit brutal. But what the, But the question was, what would we do differently? Well, it's just, it's just the old man in me kind of, kind of feels a bit like that process there is, you know, incredible way of connecting with an audience where you get this, you know, visceral thing of seeing a band live and they know they've got that following.
They know they can, they know they can cut it in a live situation and then you want to hear the records. Whereas, I don't know, you, sometimes people are just liking something off the back of, they hear 20 seconds of it in a little TikTok video. Yeah. So if you, if you were coming in now, I mean, obviously you, you want the success, so you're going to try and go the direction that is going to facilitate that. But do you think you would still take that route of what worked for you or, or, or what's actually working for others these days? Yeah, I think so. Because I think you want to hone your craft live before you make a record.
Doesn't it, doing it the other way where you get big on social media, make the record. And then, and then start touring. I just don't see how that is a long-term strategy. I mean, some people are obviously doing it, but there's got to be a lot of people who are getting signed, making a record.
It doesn't do well. And then they're just, that's it. They're just, it's just a sport. How are you sort of consuming music these days? Through my daughters.
Streaming, kind of. You know, Spotify, Amazon, things like that. But I don't really have much choice over what I put, I listen to. And of course, you know, you just celebrated a very important birthday recently.
You know, I mean, do you find these days you've got space? Because I'm finding I'm running out of space for bands, new bands. It's like the ones I like, they're kind of there. And I'm trying to not be that old guy that's not into new stuff.
But you need to kind of keep one, one foot on it, don't you? Yeah, which I don't. I would like to. But no, I'm just in a kind of... The wind tunnel, I would describe it as just kids and schools and driving around everywhere and just trying to get to the end of the day without anyone kind of needing to go to the hospital. It's basically my mind frame at the moment.
Just touch it on that slightly. I mean, over the years, you know, your music has kind of referenced, you know, some anxiety. And mental health stuff and what have you. And, of course, that's never been more prevalent in today's world, you know, where everyone's 24-7 on social media and, you know, anxiety levels are at a max. How have you learned to control that over the years? Is there a hack? Well, the ultimate hacks would probably be like breathing exercises. Like Wim Hof has a load of good ones.
That will remove... Remove the anxiety within about five minutes, I'd say. And then exercising and then just kind of being mindful, stuff like that. Really, the biggest thing I did was getting sober and then doing all that stuff on top of it. And that kind of sorted out the wig outs. But they still come.
I've just got to remember that a life ran... On my will is not going to work. It's like I kind of... I find myself wanting to construct the day specifically to my tailored needs and wants. And if I start the day in that headspace, I'm fucked. I just need to, like, let go and just kind of let the universe do its thing.
Get out of your own way. And get out of my own head. And is that your approach in music as well? Yeah, pretty much. Apart from writing a lot of titles. I'm really big on titles.
So I've got a huge list of them. But apart from that, as soon as the door closes behind me in whatever room I've gone to write in that day, it's just about freaking out until something happens. There's no direct path. I think it's...
You've just got to wait. Sometimes you've got to have a bad day. Sometimes... And then...
And then sometimes it comes. And I don't know where from. Yeah, yeah, of course. Now, like we were saying, you know, a lot of your rig can kind of stay the same over the years. You know, we're used to seeing you with particular guitars. Anything you've added to your collection over the last couple of years that you can't put down? Wait, did you guys do, like, a starcaster kind of thing? Oh, yeah.
But Fender, yeah, yeah, absolutely. They do do a starcaster, yeah. I think I got one of the newer versions of that, which has been great.
I just like the simple Tele Strats. And then I have a couple of kind of, like, fancier Mustangs, which I use for recording, but not for live, which I love. I'm quite into the old Mustangs.
Killer. Well, Luke, absolute pleasure to chat with you. Congratulations on the new record and the tour that's coming up. And we'll look forward to seeing you at the O2. Thanks so much. Thank you.
Thank you. Cheers. Cheers.
Cheers. Cheers. Cheers.
2025-02-27 14:08
