The International Touring Boom for Artists | SXSW 2024

we're really excited to do this just introduce everybody again Han schaer senior vice president of global touring at Live Nation John lieberberg um of Baron management where he manages kuchis um so we're really excited to talk about this we were talking a little bit uh before the session um and just really kind of connecting about just how much activity and excitement there's been um over global touring in general both you know we've seen Latin artists as a great example of how there's such a demand for these artists all over the world um there's also you know a huge appetite for for angle artists as well in Latin America I wonder if we can start a little bit by talking about how you guys kind of see this growth in global touring and kind of where you think it it sort of started Hans maybe we can start with you uh yeah um obviously the the sort of you know the social media platforms have have allowed access to music right we become much more integrated um I think community over globally where you have access to this to all this music that's been the Big Driver for for the content to to kind of reach new barriers and hit new places um and then what we've seen is is you know the I think one of it is one part of it is language another part is we're moving around we're immigrating to different land different different countries and that landscape is is evolving and changing we're seeing you know Carol G going out and touring in Europe and it's a Latin fan base in Zurich in Switzerland in Belgium and in in a lot of places you know part of it yes there's a driver of of of the fan is crossing over which is something I I talk about a lot it's not the music the artists aren't crossing over fans are crossing over they're listening to music in Spanish right that happens to be Latin um but that that I think is is is one of the main drivers for the International and globalization of of international touring um you can give us some yeah I mean you touched on most of the the the good points here but I think social media in general is obviously like a huge driver and um I mean through Tik Tok I feel like people are more we we're more in this interconnected Global space where hey I'm going to check out here is bnab boy from Nigeria and I'm like you know this is great you know like and you see the success of that and then vice versa in the Latin space you know like with you know like you know people like Bad Bunny having these you know insane years back back to back and uh you just see that there's more more of an appetite maybe on a sociocultural level for um you know things from music from different places you know and I think it's also you touch on the language barrier that um you make a connection with music regardless if you understand the lyrics or not you know like and that's also ever expanding and and I think the discovery on social media has definitely been like a main driver for that too yeah um there was a point I think during the pandemic where there was a lot of sort of J and Gloom about when live music was going to get back it seemed at one point you know where imagining sort of the movement that we're having right now in Glo Global touring seemed almost difficult um but then that hasn't been the case at all we've seen a tremendous amount of activity and a tremendous amount of excitement I wonder if you can talk a little bit about the impact of the last few years and how sort of fans have opened up again and and and kind of demanded to see these these artists that maybe they were listening to and and wanting to bring to to their cities yeah I think I think we're you know in general we're social creatures and and you know content definitely is King but the only thing to surpass that is experiencing it live and I think there was a there's always going to be that need there's always going to be um that time for for people to kind of come together and and live those moments you know uh certainly I think it was a matter of when not if um and we were all very clear on on on the path that sort of needed to to happen to safely sort of bring that that back yeah um to add to that I think also like yeah during the pandemic and we all remember it you know it was uh crazy days you know now looking back at it's almost surreal but the um I think it's it's like the people were starved for human interaction and also for like experiences and we touched on it a little bit before the panel that there's obviously this um especially in 23 24 coming out of the pandemic we saw this we had back toback the two craziest touring years we've ever done right like the I mean you know more stadium shows than ever before right more you know like I mean like fans just going out there spending money and wanting to be at these shows you know and um which kind of shows us too there's more of an experienced culture now where you know people are like hey I I need to be there I need to experience this you know and I think that's that's sort of been coming out of the pandemic has been like sort of the maybe like a psychological effect of why people are so hungry for more content and more more life experiences you know yeah one thing that we were talking about too was sort of this need to to to be there you know even if you know you can just say that you if it's not if it's not on your timeline you know like it's didn't exist you know so yeah people are definitely you have to be there um getting back to sort of the artists themselves we've seen so many Global careers and especially with Latin artists and um artists who have transcended borders we've mentioned Bad Bunny we've mentioned Carol G we've mentioned kuchi I wonder if you can talk a little bit about how these artists have created these International fan bases and and what the demand for them looks like um all over the all over the world really I mean maybe I start with Kelly and then you can talk a little bit more about beani and um I mean with Kelly it's an interesting you know case because Celly is um you know sort of like the The Best of Both Worlds you know where she you know was born and raised between Colombia and the United States and I think the um you know like the there's an ever increasing you know like World especially in North America where you know hey here's second third generation kids you know they came from you know like Mexico other Latin places and they are now living in the United States you know like and this this this whole idea of like you know hey this is Spanglish right like Kelly's music is you know like it's Indie it's English but it's also like very heavy Latin and I think that is um that is been interesting for us you know we see the growth in that kind of world and the demand you know when we go to our shows we see how kids are kids are you know older fans are just singing along to every song and we see like that's sort of the the trick that does it for us at the minute you know it's really like that's you know hey this is like a hybrid of uh the best of Latin the best of what the US has to offer you know and it's just like this amalgamation of cultures that come come come into play and like the authenticity right of of those of those artists especially we talk about the like Latin music in in the US authenticity I think is is key to connecting right and cie is is a great example um Becky G has a a great video on how how her album talks about this idea of 200% which is something that I relate to right um you know born in Miami Venezuelan Spanish German kind of mix um you go to Spain you're not Spanish enough you go to Venezuela you're not Venezuelan enough out here you're not American enough right but I sort of identify with all all three and that's the the concept that Becky talks about is the 200% I'm 100% this 100% that in her case Mexican-American and I I I think those things right especially an artist like C an artist like Becky War they come from these different worlds in the US is having a tremendous impact because we see ourselves in them right we see ourselves in them not just as an artist but we see them themselves as who we are and and in the identity of our culture Our Roots are shared sort of social um values um I want to talk about one particular moment uh that uh we were talking about before but a big sort of watershed moment I think in what's happening today really felt like it was when lukis went on tour uh in 2021 and did Stadium tours um Hans I know that you were really pivotal to making that happening happen and to Champion that and to um really kind of prove that Latin artists were incredibly Global could sell out stadiums and since that happened I mean we've seen Carol g sell out 50,000 person shows two nights in a row uh we've seen Bad Bunny sell out you know Yankee Stadium two two times in a row um talk about that initial moment of of kind of championing that and and seeing the vision there I mean with buies it was such a special such a special moment because it it was it was a cultural importance that either you knew it was there right there was was nothing in socials there wasn't these big you know social media numbers or streaming numbers that was going to tell you this like obvious story that unfolded it was really about going back again like right you you you are what you live and the people that you share it with and understanding who who those buies were to to my friends to generation who never got to see them live because they grew up listening to them because their parents listened to them in the house but they never had the opportunity it a band that was gone for 30 year 25 30 years um and the conversation was always they're never getting back together so you know these things I knew we going to we're going to have a huge impact not on the people who lived it but the generation afterwards as well I mean one one of the biggest examples we had is the the those Bukis on sale was trending on Tik talk because people were were actively going and buying tickets and you know know Hey Dad it's Happy Father's Day and capturing that moment of Tears laughter like Joy um you know our our employees my colleagues all all lived it like we all we understood what was going on and so we took a bet and we took a swing I believed it was it was possible and it seemed it seemed very realistic there's a great um story about the for Four 4minute Mile Roger Bannister British uh marathon runner right 1956 nobody thought it was possible to break uh to run under under 4 minutes 1956 this guy does it right sh just shy like 357 359 something something right below it after that the years follow it just sort of opened up the floodgates right it became this sort of self because I I go back that these are like self-limitation self-limiting beliefs um and once we're able to break that barrier down then you sort of see that like others can fall and others can do and I think we've seen that right that was that was I think the moment of bukies was breaking the four-minute mile in the US because then Carol came groupo F came Ventura came um bunny came and there's going to be more there's definitely going to be more now it's just it's I I believe it's just open the gates yeah what's it been like seeing that gate open for for you with your artist I mean we've also seen G do some incredible things and you know playing Latin American Giant festivals and and reaching audiences everywhere yeah I mean you know we again you know this this I hate the term but like you know the Spanglish you know thing has really opened up and as as you see it growing and growing you know like it just uh you know as the Latin space is ever evolving you know from these traditional bands that we just talked about you know Kelly is sort of maybe like a Next Generation artists you know that also in a weird way embodies this kind of American journey right like with you know immigrant parents and then kind of being raised in between you know two very different countries and uh bringing that kind of you know okay hey here here's the Spanish side you know the Spanish speaking here's the English speaking and the two different cultures that are meshing more and more the um we just saw again going back to the pandemic and the pandemic was really like a pivotal moment because while everything was shutting down and many people had like really it was really hard for promoters for you know for for artists who kind of hey what are we doing right now you know we're losing all these revenue streams and you know nothing seems to be connecting but at the same time you know like Cali had uh you know with telepatia which is the epitome of that kind a Spanglish song you know we had a completely in an organic way we had this huge moment that just kept growing and growing you know great I remember seeing it like oh here's a 100,000 kids that kind of put videos together to to to that song and then eventually became a million and you know at one point you see you know middle-aged soccer mommies you know like kind of doing cookie cooking videos to it you know like or you know just the most absurd stuff but people are using that sound you know and eventually becomes like sort of this game-changing experience so for us kind of then coming out of the pandemic you know the demand for touring was so you know huge that yeah I mean we literally like I think in the shortest amount of time and also Hans and I have worked on this closely together you know like quickly moved it from you know bigger slots at festivals you know where we saw her commanding huge crowds and then into you know and also like always tapping into these into both kind of crowds right so Kelly functions at a you know like as well as a at a Coachella and Lala as well as she does at um yeah correct any kind of Latin specific festivals you know so the you know like yeah that is definitely like the like one of the trends that we've seen you know and the um yeah at this point you know like we we then took it from literally like big theaters where we knew we're going to do an underplay right into the Arenas where we kind of got to a place where we put the Hollywood Bowl on sale and sold it out I guess in 10 minutes or something you know which is 17,000 tickets and and you see it especially in these strong holds of and where you have strong Latin communities in the United States you know like anywhere from Texas to California you know but like also Chicago and uh you know like I mean business is just exploding you know and I think you feel that too on other yeah and the markets are expanding right I mean it would be very common to be you know a 15 15 City 15 20 City tour in the US for a Latin tour right I mean we're now hitting somewhere in the 40s uh 40 to 60 dates right over different legs um smaller markets but emerging markets that are definitely important significant and you're seeing big growth right places I mean you know Greensboro North Carolina used to be no Latin shows right we went to Rogers Arkansas and like Soul it was the biggest show that Rogers Arkansas had ever seen with peso pluma it was bigger than Foo Fighters it was bigger than any General market um show that they had in the past and part of it is right is is serving under served markets right right like nobody nobody would go to Rogers and then all of a sudden it was the biggest thing it was like oh this a great um it's a great market right so I think that's also allowing for for artists to go a little bit deeper um not have to necessarily repeat their their the same markets over and over year and year again um you know which some some artists do fall into that so this allows you to sort of strategically build your touring career over the course of multiple years and not burn out your markets what do you those Emerging Markets to do you think that's demographic changes is it just the power of these bicultural artists who have been able to connect is it just the fact that they have these communities haven't been served before is it a mix of all three I yeah I I think mostly a lot of it is is is people moving around right I mean over you know you got to look at this over the course of like 25 years to sort that so you see sort of the impact and where things have been moving right a lot of the Mexican-American Community has has been pushing further east further North right as opportunities um open up and like different communities are looking for for for population in general like come into their into their cities into their growth and we're a huge growth of the economy um and so I I do think that that has reshaped what the US has looked like specifically the US has looked like over the years but we we spoke about it as well even even for like Europe for Spain right there was a huge influx of for example Ecuadorian back in 99 that sort of started to reshape what Spain looks like and the idea of what Spain looks like um um you know obviously Venezuelans there's been a huge Spike of Venezuelans that now live overseas that's allowed now other artists to go out and and tour right we take Mar Antonio sis doesn't have to be Bad Bunny doesn't have to be Carol g mark Antonio siss going to Milan going to Zurich going to Spain right when traditionally it was not really there so I I think It's a combination depending on the artist some of it is uh crossing over and some of it is people moving around also like you see it on festivals right like I mean this year Coachella you know like you know with peso headlining you know like and I mean there's just such a I think like yeah promo everybody's kind of you know things are crossing over and people are more open to it and I think why you and I are not both crazy on data you know data is a big part of it right we have to look at things you know and then you see the shift that you described you know but like also like if we take the simplest form of data that we have to sometimes use you know is like hey what are the strongest markets the biggest streaming markets on Spotify right and you'll always discover like on the last Kelly run you know like you know what kept the data kept pointing to Sacramento right and Sacramento is by no means like a massive like it's not your favorite touring Market but no disrespect to Sacramento but the you know it's like it's not La it's not San Francisco you know like it's not Oakland you know but the there's an arena and there's a good Arena right like you know and we kept kind of think think like again we've never played in Sacramento before and uh kind said like okay let's try it out because clearly the biggest stream biggest streaming Market seems to be Sacramento like these last couple of years and we go to Sacramento of course and we Crush you know so yeah that helps too I love the I love call is such a great example of like what's happening in the US and I think the future of Latin music um in the US because I and I again we all we we refer to Latin music as if like if it was a genre and it's not it's it's really happens to be Latin music is um it's a language it's it's in Spanish it's music that's in Spanish is really sort of the the the more clearly defined um definition of of what Latin music is but that also feels like it's changing right and cie is really at the Forefront of what what is Latin music now right cuz she's a Latin artist you know she's also an American artist she sings in English she sings in Spanish so where do you sort of draw the line and where does that line become you know feels like that line is becoming more blurred and sort of redefining in the next 10 15 years you know the next cuchis the next Becky G's the next artists that are born here and really do live in both worlds and embrace that right because we've seen in the past without you know I specifics but there are artists that have just said no I'm going to go the traditional General Market in English sh rout because that was their dream and that's fine right and there was there was also a time period which I think is important where Latin wasn't cool like uh no you know let's we're going to go do it this way and then there was a there was a change there was a change in a year I mean around 17 I feel like is when it really started to the conversation started to shift and people were all of a sudden like CL my grandmother's Latin right and and more hands were raised as to as to where your roots and where your your identity all of a sudden was important into that background that is I think going to be the the interesting shift over the next 15 years of what does it sound like yeah you're speaking my language because this idea of of Latin music is a you know such a such a conflicted term because we're really talking about dozens of genres from dozens of countries and now we have this intergenerational element to it too where you know it's not just Latin artist specifically it's Latin American Artist Latin you know Dash American my name is Hans schaer so that's that's already John liberg here so I think a lot of what we're talking about is really powerful in terms of the the power of these Latin artists that we've seen the power of a bicultural consumer I do also want to talk about some of the challenges involved here because a more Global you know touring economy also has some like pretty big logistical steps and and there's a lot of things that it takes to really get these things to happen I wonder if you can speak a little bit to that kind of what the challenges are of the moment that we're in right now and how we keep scaling this I mean volume right I mean the obvious one is is volume Manpower um lights available you know equipment trucks buses Logistics is is definitely I think probably the number one challenge right which is forcing I think the conversation where you need to plan better right you need to plan a little bit more further in advance if you want things to you know run a certain way or have the best available dates or have better budgets right everything becomes a driver um for planning I think that's the biggest thing so you know for me having a global partner obviously on what we do having boots on the ground having access to production companies globally or contacts with those that allows us to feel be a little bit more Nimble and react to those to to those challenges I think that's that's probably the number one challenge in terms of going out touring there's only certain amount of dates that you find in in the Arenas and the venues that you go to and there's only a certain amount of of equipment and people who are um who have the the the background and the expertise in those in those areas I don't know if you see any other challenges from yeah I mean you know there's only only so many hanzas you know who can actually like do the job good well you know and the I mean that's why it's great to work and maybe I'm biased because I'm a ex life Nation guy you know so the um I was also focusing on on International touring for a long time the Live Nation as much of a behemoth and huge company as it is you know it obviously brings benefits huge benefits to it because as H said you know it like truly operates on a global level and um you have you know there's promoters and staff in every single territory and the Very season staff you know because Live Nation has literally aligned himself themselves Years Ago by identifying the best independent promoters in every market right and so through through this vertical vertically integrated system you know of like hey we have the promoters we have the production crew we you know we have the ticketing we got the venues you know we got the festivals you know like you do as an artist you know and as an artist manager you know there's huge benefits that come with that full service and um yeah huge challenges obviously is again ever since the pandemic you know seems to be my favorite reference today the pandemic you know it's like you know but the I mean you know what I mean right like the pandemic is still we're still suffering from stuff like you know shortages on you know like a also the staff you know like touring has always been a lot of Freelancers you know like and you had these iconic I I I would call them Road Warriors you know guys who have been touring for 20 30 years you know straights and I've jumped on tour and tour and tour you know like and it's like it's a profession you know it's like a almost like a cultural thing right like I'm on tour you know and the these guys have been out of a job for a really long time you know so now the you know there's a you know like I think there's shortages in the service industry we all feel it right in restaurants and here and there and you know just like season expertise kind of staff and we have that in touring now too so you know as as an artist based in Latin America or in North America trying to kind of successfully tour in Europe you either need to have a really solid foundation fan based business that can kind of sustain it obviously you're not feeling the pains if you're playing Arenas in Europe or in South America it's fine but you know if you're at the CP of like anywhere theater 1500 cap to 5,000 cap I think it's really hard you know like and that's where the touring experts need to come in where you need to have you know like hey there's more I mean myself as a manager with my touring background you know comes easier to me but you know like again budgets you know the uh having the right staff like a production manager a toour manager these guys that can kind of save you cost make smart decisions you know the uh also reigning in the artist shows right because you know like you look at a lot of these shows and everybody you go to a concert and you're expecting an LED screen and you're expecting pyro and you're expecting all these things but um yeah good good luck taking that to Europe for like five shows you know like you're going to you're going to struggle you know financially and that's why you see more and more you see these articles of like artists having to cancel the European dates you know having to cancel Latin shows like you know that's where like I think you know the the one of the biggest you know entry into Latin America is I think we would agree is the laas right so laa paloa you know know where you do have the expertise of a company like C3 Austin based right you know like and these guys have it dialed in you know like and they provide a safe framework to for a lot of smaller bands to successfully tour out there you know so I think yeah those are the hurdles you know the cost supply chain issues you know like Freight you know shipping stuff all the boring stuff that nobody wants to deal with execution admin stuff you know becomes you know becomes crazily expensive if you don't plan it accordingly and just to add I mean you touched on it but I kind of want to like emphasize it where like yes and it's great because John you know talks about Live Nation and how wonderful like having that Global infrastructure and local resources and boots in the ground and yes 100% but that also works better when you have a great management team when you have their team is also like locked in dialed they have experienced people they know what they're doing like they're running a whole separate line of other budgets to make sure that they're they're they're profitable right cuz you can sell all the tickets but you spend all of it then you're got you at some point you got to tell the artist you is this a marketing tour you're going to make zero money do you want to do that or do you want to make some money then okay we want make some money then you got to have people that understand how to reduce that budget what can you cut what can you sacrifice what can you make it a little bit more lean or we're saying no it's fine we're going to go out and we're going to spend all this money because I want to invest my career for the next three years and I want to make it into stadiums I want to give the best show possible that LE people you know some something that should be in a stadium and you're throwing it into an arena or into a theater or into a theater happens too but I think I think it's important to to emphasize that as well maybe like one example that everybody knows about right the the we all look at Las Vegas and the sphere right like you too and we have we've all seen the clips on social media and it looks it blows your mind you know the but the like how many artists can actually afford to do that you know like the you know and again not that I have confirmed costs but like the numbers that are swirling around are you know insanely high and you know there's only maybe like if you think about like what are these aess bands that can actually play there you know so the content creation alone to kind of for these big screens is so expensive you know it looks like oh yeah there's some visuals on stage like we have beautiful visuals here you know but like you know to kind of once you get into 3D visuals or like you know moving you know like it becomes I mean again there's a lot of Manpower behind it you know creative directors l these you know months and months of planning and rehearsal so by the time I mean you see like somebody like Drake Drake goes out on tour you know and I think he spend so much money that he needs to you know like play the first 10 15 shows he probably has to recoup what he's what he spend on the tour right before he's in in profit right and that is a lot that's the new Norm that we have you know where it's kind of like okay you got to spend all this money and then you got to play at least x amount of shows to kind of break even before you're in in in profit you know so yeah so a lot of challenges it's a lot of fun a lot of challenges I do want to talk about um sort of on the what this means for the artists themselves if you are seeing sort of more Global careers artists like G who all of a sudden can play Anywhere what does that mean for the artists themselves how have you seen that feeding an artist like G who throughout her career I think we've seen an evolution of you know connecting more with her Colombian Roots her last album moas I think was a really big example of that um how has it sort of changed in terms of the Evolution for the artists themselves I mean Kelly always had that kind of you know she like she she's obviously very proud of her Latin Heritage you know and she always played on it but like I think initially Cali started out as a you know like and uh you know I like hope she's not going to be upset with me when I word it like that but like you know an indie R&B type of you know Indie you know like artist and um the that then kind of quickly evolved into if you look at our like the the last four records that we put out you know we put out uh isolation which is predominantly you know like English speaking then the next record that we put out is you know like heavily that's where we kind of make the transition into more of a SP Spanglish but also like heavily more Latin driven record you know and we we saw that this is actually like there's a demand for her Latin audience to listen to songs that are more regon or Bachata or you know like or even you know just beautiful 70s inspired Latin cring you know like you know there's all these different genres that Kell's blending and it's kind of like also speaks for this you know like you knew how how the Latin space is ever evolving you know the music that Cali is making is very different from the music that uh bad bunny is making you know but like you see a lot of cross you know crossover you know you see you know like the um you know people like Carol G you know Kelly and Carol you know like collaborating R Alejandra and Kelly you know so there is you know this kind of world that is while it's expanding you know like there's a lot of sim like a lot of common common ground and I think that works you know so you know for us it works really well like last year we put a two records we had red moon and Venus that crushed you know like and then was more of a english- speaking record you know and then we just put out the oras you know which is very much you know we have rul Alejandra and we have you know L Alpha but we also have JT from the city girls you know like and you know and um so it's it's we see it expanding and we see it's working you know like yeah that's really what it is Hans I wonder if you can talk about I mean we've seen these incredible Stadium tours with artists like lukis who are you know Mexican music we've seen Rong with Bad Bunny um are there certain genres or or sounds or types of artists that you see as kind of the kind of the next Frontier I think we're I think we're seeing it now right the like this this Regional Mexican this is this is another one that's also diff difficult to Define and I I you know I think it's always best that the artists Define it themselves but this um Urban Regional music that's that's kind right the PES Plumas for Juniors natas that that is been a huge shift in sound and what they talked about but you clearly you know where that's coming from right where that where those roots are coming from the the the elements are there from from the Heritage the the way it sounds the way it's shaped the way it's formed is their own and I and I think now the the the interesting to see thing to see is how that music is crossing over into the the the non-mexican community commities right so how you're seeing that music penetrate into Spain how you're seeing that go into Argentina that that wave is a clear Trend that I'm seeing that we're living now the collaboration between uh those artists and traditional Urban regon artist right is not something that you saw until Bonnie and Nat right um exactly that that opened that opened and changed the conversation right somebody said this is cool like I identify this and respect you as like as an artist and your sound and what you're doing and now that's been that's just continue to grow right and then bunny did it again with with uh um frona different sound not not that but Kia yeah kumia but it's it's it's definitely getting bigger and you had and you had seen moments of artists doing this but never with an impact that's created sort of like a trend right I think that was the first the first moment where you're where you're saying I think that that that's the interesting thing to kind of keep an eye on um is where where that music is going to hit globally we'd also we touched on this a little bit in the in the beginning but um there is this amazing cross-pollination also between the Ang Anglo artists who are going to Latin America and John you were you were talking a little bit about having seen this in in your experience um and it has so much to do with the globalization of music and the changes and and sort of these linguistic barriers that we've thought were there um I wonder if you can talk a little bit about that and what the demand has looked like uh in Latin America for for Anglo artists I mean there's always I've been to Argentina maybe I don't know six seven times you know like and the also like even remember going to Argentina 15 years ago and um there's always been this huge appetite for like randomly in Argentina like for rock music right have you seen that I mean you it's like that like every every time I would go there and they would like they would ask me like yeah Mexico too you know the the like where you from and I was like oh Germany I was like oh and they would name these obscure German rock bands and I was like okay wow it's like all the way to buir and Beyond you know like the so there's always been all like last time I was there you know like last year you know like I saw that kiss was on the global tour and it was like you know playing like some M massive Stadium you know so there's always been that kind of you know I guess intercon you know like this Global kind of you know exchange but um yeah going back to the festival circuit you know like and it's also like you know in some way you know like not crazy but like it's interesting that these companies like you know like American based companies team up with local promoters in South America to set up these huge festivals right like it's I think one is Lola and then the other one what's what's the other one they launched last year is uh brck and Rio and Brazil no rock and Rio and Brazil but the um last year there was uh I guess was it Prima Vera and sou exactly yeah so you know like and that is mostly designed for and if feel like again St picnic yeah like which is like a Coachella of of Colombia but you see like that the the lineup there is very much you know like English-speaking artists you know and I think because again you know like you tap into like in any other country you would tap into two different things right you want to see when we did the last year was Billy ish it was Cali you know was um Drake you know and um little Naz X you know like and plenty of more but like the majority of them were you know like sort of English-speaking American artists you know and the or I remember when I saw like when I went to a stereo picnic a couple of years ago one of the big Headliners was Florence and the Machine and uh I think Liam manol Gallagher one of the other and it was huge you know I was like I I've not seen a big crowd for Liam Gallagher like that in in a long time you know like in in in bota you know and so the um yeah you have um yeah the these festivals are designed I guess you know like to kind of cater to that audience but even there you know like it's transitioning more into we saw like you know like the the more Latin our set was right you know in Spanish we also saw like a huge appreciation for that and fans singing along and really like getting into it but then again you see Billy coming in and kids are I mean Billy was in huge you know it's like I mean you couldn't have you know I mean couldn't have been any bigger yeah um Hans so we talked a lot about Latin America obviously I wonder if there's other uh regions or other parts of the world where you see a particularly big demand for for these Global superstars that are now kind of in the in the cultural lexicon yeah EUR Europe obviously is the is the obvious um but still has work right that it hasn't it it's sort of survived I guess really with using Spain as an anchor um especially with with Urban regon uh there was an explosion in Spain where where it wasn't really working I guess if you'd say from like a radio perspective at least the feedback that you would get is like no that doesn't really work here and all all of a sudden there was again there was this this this moment in time where it started to explode you started seeing these ratone festivals start popping up all over Spain same brand and they had 10 festivals in the country smaller than the size of Texas so to give you some some some perspective of how big that became that has become obviously a very important anchor as well as a lot of of these sort of more General market or M multi- genre festivals across Europe wanting to get in into into Latin you're starting to see more support um in Europe across many of our festivals and and and some of that are non ours as well and that's going to give again that anchor where it's like it's soft ticket it gives you got it gives them an opportunity to get in front of a lot of a lot of people without necessarily carrying the responsibility of selling those tickets and then we can build off of that and and and mix in right again what we were talking about some of the logistics issues the your ability to sell tickets in a certain Market when you may be an arena Market in the US and then all of a sudden you got to go into to Europe and you're like I'm not sure if I sell 2,000 tickets or 12,000 tickets and and taking a risk at 12,000 tickets is very risky for for an artist's career outside of the financials for a promoter for anybody else like you know what the the damage it can do of going out and like not having a successful show you never want to do so the the obviously what we're doing with Carol has shown I guess the high endend of the reach in now in in several different markets where it's been hugely successful mostly sold out almost nearly every show uh on the on sale we're doing two o2s you know two Belgium two in in Germany um you know cologne in Berlin sort of non-traditional right like your OB your obvious sort of go-tos were always like Milan you know Paris but London and all these other countries are starting to really show incredible amount of traction it's very exciting you know how how deep that goes is what we're sort of developing and we want to work with artists at all sizes to see how far we can go and use that with with festivals Australia is is is going to be a a huge Challenge and also a very successful tour uh market for Latin there's been a few things that have gone that you've seen that have had success we're trying and you know and and you know being very transparent and honest it's very difficult to get an artist to go down there not because they don't believe that the business is there or because we don't believe the business there is because it's very expensive to get there you know it's limited probably amount of shows they have a very specific Vision that they want to take with their with their show and it's difficult for an artist to deviate off of that sometimes um and so trying to figure out right you could you could talk to to a little bit about that as yeah I mean to add to that withholding tax in Australia is insane we were talking about Australia and New Zealand before um Australia before you even hit Australia you got to already like you know Supply submit gazillion forms to kind of you know like to really kind of reduce the tax you know and uh and it's yeah it's constraining you know between the flights the Visas you know everything else you know like shipping your your gear out there once you're there you know touring in Australia is to to say like I love I love touring in Latin America but like it's easier to tour in Australia and um but like yeah getting there is is a huge obstacle but like yeah when you so what's what's easier about it um I mean it's like like just a little bit like the you know the you have they have it dialed in now like you know Australian touring sounds so crazy but really what it is is like you narrow it down to five six markets right so infastructure and the infrastructure you know like and it's an english- speaking country right so if most of your crew is English speaking you know like you know it just makes everything much easier but the um and they have it like I think maybe historically I feel like between artists going deep into like let's forget Mexico you know like and you know maybe Colombia but like going deeper into South America right like Peru and you know like the like markets where you know I feel like it's easier for artists to kind of tour Australia you know yeah I mean look there's there's markets in Latin America that don't have Arenas yeah right there's it's just it's like all of a sudden you're going to go and you're going to go onto a green field yeah which is fine right and that's and that's that's thing but it it comes in with a whole other set of challenges because your show is built to rig your show is is is built for an arena um so it's possible to do it but usually create there there are some other obstacles and this isn't like a blanket statement cuz there great Arenas in some in the major cities some of some of the best some of the best like there's you know for everyone from Brazil and Argentina like there are some spectacular spectacular Seasons but you go to you know you go to you go to some of these markets and you're talking about like one show in in the country and then once you get out of the capital there maybe there's not as many Arenas and there's not as many so like you go to a place like Australia you have you know three five maybe markets that are like topnotch it's great and it's all sort of like controlled there's a lot there's a ton of of local uh Touring that happens there for local artists there's a huge support in Australia for local artists um the other one kind of I mean going back to your question Japan Asia for me is is is also you've seen um you know a few festivals out there have take that opportunity and give artists that um you know an a a platform where they can go and be in front of a much larger uh amount of audience that they'd probably be able to sell on their own but I I do feel like it's untapped it's unproven and for us it's it's certainly a focus of of um of opening barriers in Asia in general not just not just Japan but I'm sure there are three or four markets because we've seen it we've seen it and so it's not it's not if it's when for me um that that music will will will translate over and it'll translate over with with touring yeah and then obviously like I mean talking about Asia right like it's also like the routes of getting there right routing is to us is like a big obstacle right like whether it's North America we have to figure out the Arenas and there's these sporting events right what's the season for the NBA what's the season for hockey you know like all these things that kind of come into play that make our life a little bit more difficult right but the um there's a path like if you go to Australia or something right like yeah like combining Australia with Asia you know like that is you know like an easy Gateway you know and I think uh you know like in you know sou being in Australia too you know like you don't have the you know once you have the Visas you know like you have Australia and like a contained self-contained Market where you hit like Sydney Melbourne Adelaide Brisbane there's a bunch of festivals that you can add and then you do two shows if you really me if you really want to stretch it you do two shows in New Zealand you know that is a very easy kind of run going to South America you know again you know like a lot of flights you know like a lot of kind of different countries visas you know going in and out you know dealing it's just like a little bit like you said by the way the arena is phenomenal what about some of the stadiums in South America I mean insane you know so yeah well yeah I mean the border crossing right cuz we talk about Latin America like if it sometimes like one country drive straight through you got yeah you got a there's a whole set of challenges with of flying with te again visas all that stuff it's different staff so yeah there's 100% more challenges that's why you see like a lot of us are touring in Mexico right because like Crossing into you know like you kind of then route it in and out of Mexico you know makes it you know a little bit easier and if you wanted to you know like again Mexico Colombia right like that is sort of the easy I always feel like that's the easy fix but then going deeper it becomes kind of like okay I really need a solid plan in order to make it work yeah but we we absolutely it's that was a great point we absolutely um you know Focus as like North America as one route so we don't separate necessarily Mexico as like part of a Latin American run it's very much part of of a North American run so you e very easily just as easily as you put in Canada you also put in Mexico as part of that that um anchor for your North American run see we're getting we're getting a lot of questions yeah I think we're just at about 15 minutes so I'm going to go ahead and ask a few of these questions if anybody else has any please put them in the first one how do artists balance the demands of touring with the need of creative expression and maintaining authenticity in their music um John we talked a little bit about that I wonder if you can get a little more into it I got to got to fully understand that question one more time okay so the balance around of touring I think the question is you know when artists are touring so much I think that sounds like a really exhausting experience how do you keep Ian you're right you know it's a good question I mean it is you know how do they balance it you know I think you know again you know with everything in life you know we all kind of whether you're an artist or you know just a normal you know uh person you know the I think it's like finding that life life life balance you know the you know we have we always think 18 months ahead in any campaign that we do you know and I thinking that we we built in times like for example I know in North America you know like I can do comfortably a five week tour then I have to take a break you know because I feel like or and by the way some artists have the stamina to do you know seven eight weeks you know but like I feel like the max in North American one run is like what do you think like seven and a half weeks right I feel like right like around that eight maybe you know like you know but the um and then you break right like and you try and kind of find find time to recoup you know and and every artist has a different kind of process you know like I mean you look at Kelly Kelly at the minute you know is uh is on a rooll where she literally like we put out two records within a year you know and critically acclaimed records you know like and then the last record you know was you know maybe a year and a half ago and you know we already have you know like you know like you know a new record also in the works right so but then you have other clients and it takes them two three four years to make a record you know so you know the and again you know like the authenticity is also in their music is kind of like how much can you draw on authentic experiences you know if you're constantly so busy you know like and some people can do it and others can't you know I think we've seen a lot of albums too that are inspired also by just the experience of touring and new cultures and and being in New in new places um how do artists is a great question how do artists translate overnight success on digital platforms into sustainable gloring to into sustainable uh Global touring success in today's live entertainment industry I think Hans if you want to take I think I think it's really and I'd like to say this very clearly like streams do not necessarily translate into ticket sales that is a that is a reality uh it's a misconception that just because you have an overnight success on a digital platform and your streaming numbers are huge that you're going to sell tickets it's also combined like where where those where those streams coming from because maybe you will sell tickets there um or you still sell some tickets there because this this is constantly appears at least to me where it's like I have this artist and they have this massive amount of streams I'm like okay but give me the data of like where none of them are coming from the United States could be an example right and so if you got to be honest with yourself as well and you have to be sort of understand that this is this is this career is really about a journey it is Marathon it should be a long-term plan you should be thinking about how to sustain and how to survive not how to get to the top because you get to the top it's lonely the Air's thin uh you're not really made meant to like stay up there for extended amount of time so the more that you can think about your artist's you know journey and your career on the long path I think then you start to become more grounded and how do you translate the overnight success becomes less important you're thinking really about what what is your authenticity and how do you continue to do the authenticity to build and then those fans will kind of come in organically right you want to build on what people are connected to not necessarily how do I translate this into a a global touring success yeah and I think you know like we all like in this business and you guys can see it whether you're a fan or you work in the industry if something is building real momentum organically where people are pulling in and you're not pushing it onto people right and we all see it you know we see it with influencers where they they're posting a million times of Tik Tok right like they have whatever a million I see all these people on on on social media they have a million plus followers but I don't understand if that doesn't necessarily mean they have a real business you know yes you get them to promote some herbal tea and you know whatever other weird stuff that you can promote and I'm sure you can make a couple of thousand bucks or maybe push it to $100,000 a year but it doesn't equate into like really having momentum or real business and I think Hans like you and I see it like you know we work on on Celly like for a couple of years now you know like you know we saw this kind of transition for like okay wow we are now building into we have an arena type of business you know like you know we knew you know yes the data is great and we see if the streams go up from 10 million to 20 million to 40 million monthly listeners you're like okay this is pretty good data and like I said earlier Sacramento like for years I've been hounding the agent and hounding everybody and talking about Sacramento and and yes we got we made it there in Sacramento but it could have also been a not a disaster but it could have also been like okay hey it was okay but we didn't crush it in Sacramento just because the data is pointing there you know and just to add to that right because we had a very honest conversation about it and also like the goal isn't necessarily they say oh we want to go and and do Arenas like no you want to create this this you know we're we're it's promoters you want to create this sort of image of success with and and the best way to create the image of success is a soldout show which is true success period period right so overshooting yourself and trying to go too fast too soon May create that yeah maybe the Sacramento thing would have been fine and we would have we would have sold it out but maybe not maybe we would and and we would right again like there's no such thing as bad shows there's bad deals you put an artist in a in a place that sell that that fits 12,000 they sell 2,000 it's a [ __ ] show you put it you put it in a club it fits 2,000 you have a soldout show that's a success right so knowing how to how to how to be strategic about your decisions and what you gain from them is really key so going into saying we're going to do a theater show which has you know the benefits again of of your production not overshooting like keeping your your your costs controlled getting out into more markets seeing what the market is testing the market because we're thinking about the next 10 years we're not thinking about the overnight success thata was no you're right I mean look what we did for example like the to finish up there you know but the you know we pushed also like you know we knew that we had an arena business you know that we were getting there but at the same time we opted for on the last tour we we said hey let's do two Radio City Halls because it's a r a passage it's a cool thing two Radio City Halls is basically in Madison Square Garden you know like we sold it out so fast that means we could have also done a Madison Square Garden but then you know you missed the opportunity of these two beautiful shows at Radio City Hall iconic right like you know and then so we we saved the medicine we MSG for you know like the next run right if we would have done it now you know like it would have been a different thing what what are we doing now going back to it you know so you want to build to that and again maybe the last point because we have more questions here is the your data you got to be careful with the data the data is misleading you know what he said earlier too you know you might have you know what does it mean if you have you know especially in Tik Tok you know Tik Tok right now is in in disarray right for artists too right because Universal has taken down all their catalog you know Universal publishing you know so what is actually happening on that platform completely unregulated but the I like people come to me it's like I have a million I have a million uh what is it sounds on or plays on Tik Tok I was like oh that's great you know like that sound is what 30 seconds you know like doesn't necessarily always translate into Spotify players you know like so kind of again you know you accumulate short form content where p

2024-04-03 16:00

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