ABRSM Composer mentee Andrew Shen in conversation with Lincoln Abbotts - Executive director

hi andrew thanks for making time to uh talk to us today it's great to see you um this series of films is very much about getting to know the composers that we're working with here at abrsm so why don't we launch straight in and uh andrew just tell us a little bit about yourself what do we need to know well uh thank you for having me here today lincoln um i suppose i'm here to to chat in a way about about myself and kind of my time leading up to and on the uh aprsm composers scheme new for this year and so you know i i sort of um came into composition a bit by accident i mean i grew up in i guess what you could call a quite musical household i had a brother and a sister who were both very very good at music and they're around a similar age so they always were kind of improvising making up tunes that kind of stuff on the piano amongst themselves that kind of thing and for the longest time um i mean i learned piano as well myself um but for the longest time that was all i knew about composition was kind of through what they were doing maybe through kind of what what my teachers were saying about like oh you can you can noodle and make tunes and that kind of stuff but um it never really clicked and then this is the thing i mean i don't think i was as uh as um proactive or or curious maybe as i am now back when i was however many years old um and i sort of never uh i guess never bothered to really to really look further afield um and it was only in in my sort of high school years um i was inter introduced to a lot more kind of varied music not only you know kind of within the classical sphere but also world musics um and also that allowed me to make links with with the kind of stuff that i was listening to anyway like you know jazz blue note albums various you know indie things from from the 80s that kind of thing um it was through that basically um i started to to sort of tinker let's say with um with kind of the idea of composing um and one thing led to another had some really really supportive and encouraging teachers who basically just asked for pieces or suggested you know if you were to write something for this you're writing it for an assignment anyway why not give it to us to play um and that sort of just build momentum and then um next thing you know i kind of figured out this is actually what i want to do you know this is this has been my calling my entire life and i've kind of been not blinkering myself but like kind of a bit blind to the fact that it is really something that i could have pursued and it is really something that can be fulfilling both to myself but as well as like you know players audiences um younger people especially um and i suppose you know bringing it back to the abrsm thing that's that's kind of why i'm so excited to be part of this really um you know it's the idea it's again cliches but it is really about the idea of like kind of giving back i feel you know i've i've been incredibly fortunate um to be able to get where i am now and it was sort of all really just a culmination of various coincidences and and positive things kind of happening at the right moments you know um and can't help but think i mean this isn't this isn't only tour of music either but like i can't help but think there are countless people out there who you know have haven't had those chances or how things haven't lined up for them in the same way or you know like me when i was younger never even realized it was a thing that they could go for in the first instance even if they had kind of the the spark or the talent or what have you so um that's that's why i'm i'm really excited to be back great now thanks andrea i think there's a couple of things to pick up on there i like the idea of tinkering and playing around and exploring because you know in many ways sometimes the idea of being a composer feels like a bit of a dark art you know how do i become one you know what is it how do i do it and actually you've described the idea of noodling around trying experimenting listening learning that's how you get started you know actually and then you realize you think okay this is for me i wanted to learn some more yeah absolutely and this this is the thing it's you know we we grow up learning about music and seeing music as the finished article so we think of you know the masterworks by say say mozart i i'm ashamed to say like i i grew up on a diet of mozart's greatest hits compilation albums when i was like seven or eight and i thought that was the beal and then all of music um you can edit that out of the video if you want okay i was about to say so did i you know that's okay you know no no but um you know this this is this is the thing it's like we regardless of era even songs on the radio we see them as the finished article and it's so easy for us to think of like our own practice and see that and be like well i'm i'm not writing things first time off the bat that are perfect like that um so obviously i'm not cut out for it but you don't what you don't see when you see or hear these compositions being performed is you know the hours of proverbial blood sweat tears and and just hard graft that that has gone into them um and also the idea that like like we were saying about like tinkering people are trying things out and seeing if they work quite a lot of the time and then going back revising and then you know kind of two steps forward one step back sort of approach and that's there's nothing wrong with that i think um we can we can all afford to you know um actively encourage ourselves to make mistakes sometimes i think that's a really important message isn't it yeah absolutely try fail try it again succeed i'm kind of interested andrew from that about you know in the world we're in now here we are 2021 global influences huge amounts of music that you can get access to at the click of a a finger or a or a mouse or a tablet it's there for you um how'd you go about finding a an authentic voice how do you find andrew's voice when you are you're listening to mozart you're listening to traditional african you're listening to uh you're listening to the latest contemporary uh hit that's coming out of the states now it's all there it's everywhere how do you find what you want to say it's an interesting question and to be honest i think it's one that i'm still trying to figure out for myself um you know quite quite rightly i i think especially nowadays you know you can you can go onto youtube search up a composer and you'll have basically all of their compositions listed out or you go into spotify and you find like a band or other streaming service that kind of thing so it's so immediate and in a way like um i definitely found it easier to compose when i was younger because there wasn't all that stuff floating around and i could i could be i could feel like i was free from its influence but at the same time like i do think having all that there in a way can be a real boon to oneself and their creative practice because it gives you a taste of everything that's out there things that you could never have dreamed of yourself or things that you know are really kind of specific to other cultures or other worlds um that you can now immerse yourself into dive dive into like head first um and i think the idea of finding your own authentic voice from amongst that it's it's a personal process to everyone everyone kind of does it differently um yeah but the the main thing is that you should be i mean i i feel this about myself and and i'm sure many composers feel the same ways but you should be trying to write something that you know you you feel like you are you're enjoying writing and and you you would enjoy hearing yourself you know and i think if you start with that as your base kind of uh master or axiom that kind of thing that's you know it almost doesn't matter past a certain point if your if your work isn't like kind of your voice because that's something that's a constant process of discovery isn't it again the idea of you try not not say you fail but you make you make things that maybe you're not happy with and then you try again um and i think it's that that process of sort of being self-reflective and kind of just aware of what you're doing in your own practice like in a sort of thoughtful way i think that's what guides you ultimately and it's a good one to store up i'm going to hang on to that one myself if i ultimately write something that you yourself would like to play would like to hear would like to engage with it's a really good thing to hang on to for anyone i'm interested andrew in the in this world of kind of possibility that we've just been playing around with there it's great to have you as uh part of our initial cohort of mentees on the abrsm program and in many ways the first task we've set you to write a great one piano piece which i know you've uh you've written and i've enjoyed having a look at it's about narrowing down the possibilities in many ways to say what you can do but actually also what you can't use because of the nature of of the composition task how does that feel as a composer that actually is that is that restricting you or is that actually quite a fun thing to do because it's so such a different task see i personally speaking i love the kind of restrictions but i'll i'll get back to that like i just want to say first you know the this whole thing of you know your creative ideas colliding with the with the very physical practical reality of what can and can't be done like not just within a grade one piano piece but let's say for a string quarter or an orchestra that kind of thing i think that's like the fundamental sort of um i guess challenge of composition is sort of you know you you have your ideas and they're strong and you know what you want to do with them but there are just some things that certain groups certain ensembles certain instruments can't do and i think one thing you learn um as a composer you know as you develop your craft and your style your taste what have you is um how to sort of negotiate those individual sort of feelings with the demands and and expectations and practicalities of writing for all these other other ensembles so in the case of a grade one piece i mean there are things that grade one beginner pianists can do and there are some things that obviously they can't i mean like if you've only been learning to a grade one standard um you know that's that's kind of a given but that doesn't mean that you can't create something that's fun that's engaging that feels you know really really um i i guess involved in the same way that like you know i i'm saying this hypothetically i can't play the rackman and off camera concerto but like if i was playing recommended three or something like that i would feel deep and kind of consumed with the music and i think you can do the same thing with a a grade one piece for a beginner learner that kind of thing so um i i sort of enjoy the the challenge of paraphrase of stravinsky that i'm gonna butcher but it's kind of about how sort of restrictions in music are sort of the mother of invention it kind of forces you to be more creative and think about what the limits and uh sort of extents of possibility are and kind of what you're creating um and for me that that was that was really fun um uh and it it provides a nice alternative to having a blank sheet of paper and being told yes write whatever you want i'm interested it's interesting there that you talk about that that relationship between a composer and performer it might be whether again that the grade one pianist or the professional string quartet uh player or an orchestra actually you as a composer you're kind of you're writing for them you're wanting to challenge them but also respect where they are it's that dynamic isn't it which is really important composer and performer working together that's ultimately what we're looking for yeah absolutely and that's that's you know it's it's an interesting thing because certainly in my kind of um early stage professional practice that's something i'd really love to do is engage directly and collaboratively with individuals or small ensemble groups that kind of thing i i am i recently was writing a piece um for and kind of with um uwe the uh the shin player um this chinese mouth organ really interesting ancient instrument but um that was incredible because there was just this back and forth on ideas and possibilities and that kind of thing of course it's a completely different thing when you're sort of trying to write for the the every man as it were for this anonymous kind of uh both idealized and completely vague kind of version of what a what a grade one pianist let's say is um and that was that was i i found that to be something i never really experienced before because i think i think up to now like i've made a point of you know treating music as a as a very literally sort of collaborative thing but at the same time i think there are ways that you can do that even within these more like i guess anonymous or open access kind of uh pieces is you know there are ways to really give a performer license and freedom and ownership ultimately over that piece and what they create from the piece because at the end of the day like what we do as composers really is just provide very specific kind of road maps just dots on a page that kind of thing and the actual creation of the music only to my mind anyway you can you can argue the semantics of this all day but to my mind the music happens when it's being played right and and it's really it's a really interesting one for abraham because i think we're with you and you know again with the new performance grades that we've got uh going out to the blocks now that is about performance that is about taking a piece of music realizing what you want to say through it and performing it presenting it telling your story through it it's really important absolutely andrew i i just you you've mentioned a few things uh as we've gone along there but uh beside the grade one piano piece and various other collaborations what what else are you working on at the moment what what does uh professional life as a as a composer look like right now so i've only just finished up my master's degree at the royal college of music in london um so in a way i mean i do have a fair bit of professional work on i mean i just finished up this uh this solo project with as i mentioned um but for the moment it's kind of me you know looking into the future and and seeing what plans i have already and then how i work my other plans around it that kind of thing because there are all these sort of nice vague um i guess like dream projects that i want to do that i can sort of i guess if i find the time and the sort of will i could probably put together myself but it's it's more just finding a practical way to do that so the big one on the horizon um is uh recently i i was quite lucky to get a um commission through the rps composers scheme or the rps prize um and that was i mean it came as a a bit of a shock i'll be honest but like you know very a very like positive surprise good shock yeah yeah that's it um and for that i'll be writing a new still some details tbc um but possibly not by the time actually this this goes to air as it were but um it's for the uh cheltenham festival and it will be a chamber work not sure who it's for quite yet but i'm really looking forward to that but the thing about that right is because that takes place july next year so there's this big gap now kind of um for me to sort of figure out what to be doing with myself in the meantime so of course you know a few bits and bobs that i can't really talk about yet that hopefully might might play out um and then also things almost separate i guess to to my call it separate it's separate but related to my compositional life so i also actively perform as a jazz pianist so i've been doing a bit of that um i mean you know the the gig's life performance is back which is quite nice to have fantastic yeah i've been trying to develop my ability to sing and play at the same time as well that's kind of a fun one because i'm not a very good singer but um don't tell anyone who's don't tell anyone no we won't the voice of chet baker basically so i'm trying to put that to good use um and then there's also a quite you know very exciting i can't talk too much about it thing but it's um it involves a group of my colleagues some who've graduated some who are still at the royal college who are into partly improvised contemporary performance and with live electronics which i may or may not be facilitating we have some really interesting things coming up for that not only just performances but also things in different settings things involving like direct live workshops with young people which i'm really looking forward to so keep you know keep your eyes no no it's good there's a nice smattering there of dream projects some projects you can't talk to us about and things that are very specific it's great and in many ways you know it's a reminder isn't it that this you know in part what we're doing through these films is trying to bust a few myths about what it is to be a composer and you've just described there it's about being a musician you know who is writing who is performing who's experimenting who's maybe working with young people who's maybe working with communities who's collaborating with with colleagues all of those things make up that kind of portfolio of who and what you are as you move forward i think andrew i'd be really keen for you to uh to share any nuggets if you like with someone who's watching this who thinks actually i think i'd like to be a composer you know it might be because they're a youngster in a school it might be because there's someone later in life who's engaged in music but hasn't yet set their ideas down you know how do you get started or any kind of top tips if you like for composing and being a composer i guess the the first one is is that you can compose this is this is the thing um it's it was kind of like we were saying before you know i mean people sort of see existing music and expect themselves either i can do that straight off the bat create these fully formed masterworks or great songs that kind of thing or i don't have it in me whereas it's it's really the result of a long time of development and and kind of hard work and persistence you know and i think anyone anyone who has even any tiny musical inclination has the potential within them to be a composer i think just remember to hold on to that because and i forget who said this but there was this great quote about how you know the reason we uh unsatisfied with our music sometimes is because the um the development of our own taste out like is is outpacing the development of our own technique but that's kind of what also drives you forward to keep creating keep making better stuff so um just have the confidence to do it and also you know the the again i think it's to do with sort of preconceptions about composers kind of the idea that a composer is someone who writes and does nothing else or is completely separate from the players until the day that they walk into the rehearsal hall and then and then get lots of questions that kind of thing um you know being a composer can be what it means to you and that can involve an intersection of your own playing it can it can involve working with other people it can be that private thing that you do it can be even you know like working in your in your door and on your um like electronics kind of stuff like it can really be anything but the thing is it's like everyone has that potential to to be creative and create something really special and something that can be impactful that's great i mean i think you know take from that sense of confidence belief a reminder that you need people around you it might be parents it might be family it might be colleagues who say yep you can give it a go try it and i'll go back to something earlier in the chat about uh that sense of writing things that you care about that means something to you that you would enjoy playing or listening to or sharing are probably a pretty good things uh to take forward um andrew is just slightly off script i just wanted to ask just because you've mentioned sort of electronics and digital and uh and all that a little bit through the conversation just what's your prediction of the future you know in terms of you know we we've lived over the last 18 months or so in particular where making musically making music remotely and through digital means has risen to the fall and i suspect would share a view that ultimately music is a live visceral subject that it you need to be in the same room as the performers to to really appreciate what where are we heading with all this you know how are we going to bring these worlds uh together or are they set to to collide and be thought of as different i i think they're see i i take the view that they're complementary to one another um because just for example i mean i um of course i i mean maybe we're a bit fatigued by the number of remote recordings we're seeing out there but i think say for a young composer who wants to hear their work performed in a live kind of setting like the ability and the fact that it's now kind of acceptable to just go out there and ask your friends can you multitrack this to a click that kind of thing i think that's that's really really valuable to to individuals in a way where it would normally be like a logistical nightmare to set up a rehearsal trying to you know doodle polls and all this kind of thing um but yeah i i agree i think the there is an importance to sort of making sure these things stay interconnected and this is this is kind of my my sort of view on a lot of aspects of music and just art generally is that we sort of that there's a tendency or it becomes quite easy for us to view specific things within say music as kind of self-contained and unrelated to so even even like when i was growing up i mean um i i did my piano grades with a a certain other competitor to abrsm back in australia who i shall not mention but um they you know i never made the connection between you know doing piano as this and then the people who are out there doing it as their career and it was just things like that you know it feels often at times that the the world of music say in education or on the radio or in the conservatoire or in the concert hall they feel like all these kind of separate things when really they do feed into one another and my hope you know with the sort of digital explosion as it were is that kind of this opening up of access and kind of interest in in the arts can feed back in you know in a complementary way into you know what's happening in the room what's happening that that electricity is as you're kind of referring to so um [Music] yeah i think that's that's kind of my take yeah that's great i think you know take from that that sense of connectivity and collaboration really important look andrew thank you for the conversation really really enjoyed it we look forward to uh hearing new music through abrsm uh grade one piano piece and beyond and staying in touch with uh your projects uh dreamlike and secret unknown as they move forward so thanks again for your time andrew and we look forward to getting to know you and your music even better thank you for today lincoln it's pleasure you

2021-11-14 12:00

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