>> FROM THE HEART OF WHERE INNOVATION, MONEY AND POWER COLLIDE, IN SILICON VALLEY AND BEYOND, THIS IS "BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY" WITH EMILY CHANG. PLUS, GRAYSCALE CLAPS BACK AT THE SEC AFTER REJECTING A BITCOIN ETF. I WILL SPEAK WITH ITS CTO ABOUT THEIR LEGAL CHALLENGE AND ONGOING FRIENDSHIP BETWEEN CARRIE GANSLER AND THE CRYPTO COMMUNITY. ANDREW YANG JOINS US TO TALK ABOUT THE STATE OF TECH ENTREPRENEURSHIP IN A DOWNTURN. PLUS HIS OUTLOOK FOR PRESIDENT IN 2024. ALL ABOUT IN A MOMENT. FIRST LET'S GET A LOOK AT THE
MARKETS. WE WERE SO CLOSE YET SO FAR. THE NASDAQ 100 FALLING IN THE LAST FIVE MINUTES OF TRADING TO CARRY ON A HORRID STREAK OF LOSSES. BLOOMBERG'S ED LUDLOW HAS THE MOVERS. ED, JUST LAST COULD NOT CLOSE THE DOOR. ED: THEY SAY IT IS THE HOPE THAT KILLS YOU. WE ARE DOWN THREE TIMES 1% ON THE S&P 500, JUST FLAT.
-- THREE TENTHS OF 1% ON THE S&P 500, JUST FLAT. WE ARE BRACING FOR A CPI PRINT ON THURSDAY, OR INFLATION DATA FOR THE MONTH OF SEPTEMBER. THAT WILL GIVE US AN INDICATION OF HOW MUCH FURTHER THE FED WILL GO WITH RAISING RATES AND HOW MUCH MORE PAIN THIS MARKET CAN TAKE. CONTINUING TO SEE SELLING IN SOME CONDUCTOR STOCKS, WHICH HAVE SUFFERED AMID TENSIONS BETWEEN U.S. AND CHINA, BUT ALSO CONCERNS ABOUT SLOW DOWN, THE END USE CASES FOR THOSE SOME CONDUCTORS. YIELDS PULLED BACK THIS
WEDNESDAY. INTEL HAS BEEN AN INTERESTING STORY. A BLOOMBERG SCOOP, YOU SEE THE PAIN IT HAS SUFFERED OVER THE LAST SIX SESSIONS. IT ROSE SLIGHTLY ON WEDNESDAY. INTEL WILL LAY OFF THOUSANDS OF
PEOPLE, AS SOON AS THIS MONTH WE COULD GET AN ANNOUNCEMENT, IN AREAS LIKE SALES AND MARKETING, WHERE ACCORDING TO SOURCES THEY WILL REDUCE HEADCOUNT BY 20%. THEY HAVE EARNINGS ON OCTOBER 27. THAT IS WHAT WE ARE PAYING CLOSE ATTENTION TO. THE S&P 500 FALLING FOR THE LOWEST LEVEL SINCE NOVEMBER 2020. THERE WAS NOT A LOT OF BIG MOVEMENT AND IT CAME TO TECH. NETFLIX UP 3%. NO NEWS BEHIND IT. THE MEGA CAPS, THERE WERE MUTED
DECLINES. NOTHING PULLING IN EITHER DIRECTION. TWITTER CONTINUES TO BASICALLY TRADE SIDEWAYS AS WE WAIT TO SEE WILL THIS DEAL WITH ELON MUSK CLOSE BEFORE NOVEMBER 28. WE ARE AROUND A DOLLAR $.50 A SHARE. EMILY: WILL THE DEAL BE SEALED BEFORE THAT DATE? THANK YOU. THIS BLOOMBERG BUSINESSWEEK
COVER STORY FOCUSES ON THE ROLLER COASTER RIDE THAT HAS BEEN THE MUSK TWITTER DEAL. KURT WAGNER WRITES THAT FOR TWITTER THERE ARE NO GOOD OUTCOMES NO MATTER WHAT PATH A DEAL WITH ELON TAKES. MUSK PUBLICLY TRASHED TWITTER'S TOP MANAGEMENT AND ALIENATED THOUSANDS OF ITS EMPLOYEES, VOWED TO SLASH RULES AND WANTS TO MAKE TWITTER THE EVERYTHING APP BUT CAN'T REALLY EXPLAIN WHAT THAT MEANS. HERE TO DISCUSS, BLOOMBERG'S KURT WAGNER. THE HEADLINE IS TWITTER ONLY FACES BAD OUTCOMES IF THIS DEAL CLOSES. WHY DO YOU SAY SO? KURT: THERE IS TWO OPTIONS HERE. ONE, THE DEAL FALLS APART AND ITS STOCK THAT HAS BEEN ARTIFICIALLY INFLATED IS GOING TO CRASH.
EMPLOYEES WHO HAVE SPENT THE LAST SIX TO NINE MONTHS IN THIS TOTAL STATE OF UNCERTAINTY WILL HAVE TO PICK UP AND PRETEND LIKE IT NEVER HAPPENED, OR IF THINGS GO THE WAY TWITTER WANTS, THEN THEY GET THE GUY IN CHARGE WHO FOR THE LAST THREE MONTHS HAS BEEN SAYING TWITTER HAS BEEN LIGHTING ABOUT ITS USER BASE -- BEEN LYING ABOUT ITS USER BASE. IT FEELS TO ME THAT THERE IS NOT REALLY A LOT OF GOOD OUTCOMES HERE. I GOT A LOT OF FAN MAIL AFTER THIS STORY CAME TODAY FOR PEOPLE WHO DISAGREE, THAT THEY THINK THE FREE SPEECH VISION THAT MUST KEEPS TALKING ABOUT WILL MAKE TWITTER A MUCH BETTER PLACE VERY SHORTLY.
EVEN THAT I WOULD PROBABLY ARGUE WILL CREATE A LOT OF OTHER HEADACHES FOR THIS PLATFORM VERY SOON. EMILY: MUSK DOES HAVE MILLIONS OF FANS. THAT IS NOT OUT OF THE QUESTION THAT SOME FOLKS WILL BE VERY HAPPY IF THIS DEAL GETS DONE. YOU USED THE WORDS "VERY SHORTLY." SAY THE DEAL GETS DONE BEFORE OCTOBER 28, COULD ELON MUSK MAKE SIGNIFICANT CHANGES TO THE PLATFORM BEFORE THE MIDTERM ELECTIONS, BEFORE NOVEMBER 8? KURT: THE DEAL IS SUPPOSED TO CLOSE BY THE 28TH.
TO ME, THAT MEANS ELON MUSK WOULD BE IN CHARGE. [INDISCERNIBLE] IT IS POSSIBLE, BUT HOW MUCH OF AN IMPACT IS NOT GOING TO HAVE? I DON'T REALLY KNOW. I THINK THERE COULD BE CHANGES TO SOME OF THESE POLICIES. THEY COULD SAY ALL THE FOLKS WHO HAD BEEN LOOKING FOR MISINFORMATION OR HATE SPEECH OR VOTER MISINFORMATION, STANDDOWN, DON'T DO YOUR JOB.
ALL OF A SUDDEN WE COULD HAVE A DIFFERENT LEVEL OF CONTENT ON THE PLATFORM VERY SOON. EMILY: WHAT IS THE LATEST ON NEGOTIATIONS BETWEEN THE TWO PARTIES? WHAT ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW? KURT: THERE HAS BEEN SOME STUFF THAT WE REPORTED AT BLOOMBERG THAT DESPITE THE FACT THAT BOTH SIDES WANT THE SAME DEAL PRICE, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME HANGUPS. IT SOUNDS LIKE ELON MUSK WANTS TO RESERVE HIS RIGHT TO POSSIBLY SUE SOME OF THESE EXECUTIVES ONCE THE DEAL CLOSES TO GO AFTER PEOPLE PERSONALLY AS A WAY TO SAY, HEY, YOU HAVE BEEN MISLEADING INVESTORS AND ME THIS WHOLE TIME. TWITTER DOES NOT WANT TO HAVE THAT. THEY ARE ALSO WORRIED ABOUT
THIS DEBT TO CONTINGENCY THAT ELON WILL ADD TO THE NEGOTIATION. I IMAGINE AT THIS POINT BOTH SIDES ARE TRYING TO IRON THROUGH THOSE DETAILS. THEY CLAIM THEY WANT THE SAME PRICE. THE DEBT IS FOR THE MOST PART LOCKED UP.
THEY ARE GOING THOSE VERY MINUTE ELEMENTS WITH THE DEAL. EMILY: KURT WAGNER, THANKS FOR KEEPING US UPDATED AS ALWAYS. CHECK OUT THAT STORY AND THE LATEST EDITION OF BLOOMBERG BUSINESSWEEK. COMING UP, JUST HOW BIG WAS THIS LATEST PRIME DATE? WE WILL HEAR FROM THE HEAD OF AMAZON PRIME, NEXT.
THIS IS BLOOMBERG. EMILY: THIS WEEK'S AMAZON PRIME SALE MAY NOT BE ALL IT IS CHALKED UP TO BE. THIRD-PARTY RESEARCHERS ARE SAYING THE PRIMED A SALE IS GENERATING THE SAME TRAFFIC AS ANY REGULAR DAY. ED LUDLOW ASKED JAMIL GHANI ABOUT THE DATA. JAMIL: I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS THE ACCURATE READ.
WE HAVE BEEN IMPRESSED WITH HOW MANY PRIME MEMBERS ARE SHOWING UP, HOW THEY ARE ENGAGING WITH THE EVENT AND HOW THEY ARE SHOPPING. THEY ARE SHOPPING ENTIRE STORES. SOME OF THE FAVORITE CATEGORIES SO FAR ARE ELECTRONICS, TOYS, HOME, APPAREL, HEALTH AND PERSONAL CARE. TOP BRANDS LIKE APPLE, HP, SHARK, AND MANY OTHERS, INCLUDING ITEMS OFF OUR CURATED TOP 100 LIST. WE HAVE BEEN
REALLY HAPPY WITH THE EVENT SO FAR. OUR MEMBERS CAN ENGAGE THROUGH MIDNIGHT TONIGHT. I ENCOURAGE THEM TO CHECK IT OUT. ED:
WHAT IS AMAZON TRACKING TO DO FOR THIS OCTOBER WINDOW IN DOLLAR TERMS RELATIVE TO JULY? CAN YOU GIVE US SOME GRANULAR ITY? JAMIL: PRIME DAY THIS YEAR WAS THE LARGEST WE HAVE EVER HAD, $1.7 BILLION IN SAVINGS FOR OUR MEMBERS AROUND THE GLOBE. WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO WITH THIS EVENT IS GIVE OUR PRIME MEMBERS YET ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY TO SAVE. WE KNOW OUR MEMBERS ARE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR SAVINGS, BUT NO MORE SO THAN NOW WHERE THE MACROECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT HAS EVERYBODY TRYING TO MAKE THE DOLLAR STRETCH A LITTLE FURTHER. THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR 48
HOURS FOR OUR MEMBERS TO GET AN EXCLUSIVE JUMP ON THEIR HOLIDAY SHOPPING. SO FAR THE ENGAGEMENT HAS BEEN REALLY STRONG. IT IS TOO EARLY TO TELL, BUT I EXPECT THERE WILL BE DEALS THROUGHOUT THE EVENT. THAT IS SOMETHING WE LEARNED IN PRIME DAY, THAT ARE MEMBERS LIKE TOP BRANDS. YOU WILL CONTINUE TO SEE THAT
THROUGH MIDNIGHT TONIGHT. ED: THIS WINDOW WILL NOT BE AS BIG AS THE JULY WINDOW. JAMIL: IT IS TOO EARLY TO TELL. WE ARE EXCITED BY THE EARLY ENGAGEMENT.
IT IS A KICK OFF TO THE ENTIRE HOLIDAY SEASON. WE WILL HAVE DEALS AND DISCOUNTS THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE PERIOD. BLACK FRIDAY, CYBER MONDAY CONTINUE TO BE INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT. WE WANT TO TAKE CARE OF OUR MOST IMPORTANT CUSTOMERS FIRST, OUR PRIME MEMBERS. THIS IS THE KICKOFF TO THE SEASON. ED: THAT IS INTERESTING, THE IDEA AROUND THE POLE FORWARD IN HOLIDAY SPENDING.
-- PULL FORWARD IN HOLIDAY SPENDING. CAN YOU TALK ABOUT HOW THAT MIGHT CLEAR OUT INDUSTRY AHEAD OF THE HOLIDAY SEASON? JAMIL: THIS EVENT IS NOT ABOUT INVENTORY. WE BUILT THIS EVENT ON THE TOP BRANDS THAT WE KNOW OUR MEMBERS ARE LOOKING FOR INTO THE SHOPPING SEASON. THIS IS AN EXCLUSIVE 48 HOURS FOR PRIME NUMBERS TO GET A JUMP ON HOLIDAY SHOPPING, ENSURE THEY GET THOSE MUST-HAVE ITEMS, GET SOME OF THE HOLIDAY RUSH OUT OF THE WAY EARLIER IN THE SEASON.
WE WILL CONTINUE THE DISCOUNTS FOR ALL OF OUR CUSTOMERS, INCLUDING PRIME MEMBERS GOING INTO BLACK FRIDAY AND CYBER MONDAY. ED: WHAT ARE YOU LEARNING ABOUT THE CONSUMER-BASED ON WHAT THEY ARE BUYING? IT SEEMS LIKE THEY MIGHT BE GOING FOR THIS CHEAPER END OF THE SPECTRUM. IS THERE ANY SENSE THAT THE CONSUMER IS FEELING THE PAIN OF INFLATION? JAMIL: I THINK ALL OF US AS AMERICANS ARE FEELING THE PINCH OF INFLATION. ALL OF US WANT TO STRETCH OUR DOLLAR AS FAR AS WE CAN. WHAT WE SAW IN PRIME DAY WAS MEMBERS ENGAGED ACROSS ALL SALE PRICES, FROM CONSUMABLES ALL THE WAY UP TO ELECTRONIC DEVICES.
IT IS NEEDS THROUGH WANTS. THAT IS WHY WE BUILT PRIME EARLY ACCESS SALE SO THAT MEMBERS CAN MEET THOSE NEEDS AND WANTS. WE HAVE TOP BRANDS IN HEALTH AND PERSONAL CARE ALL THE WAY TO TOYS, HOME, APPAREL AND ELECTRONICS, WHICH ARE CLEARLY A MEMBER FAVORITE EVERY HOLIDAY SEASON. WE ARE SEEING THE SAME IN ENGAGEMENT NOW. WE EXPECT THAT TO CONTINUE OVER THE NEXT SEVERAL HOURS TO MIDNIGHT TONIGHT. EMILY:
AMAZON'S HEAD OF PRIME, JAMIL GHANI, WITH OUR OWN ED LUDLOW. FOR MORE ON THIS I WANT TO BRING IN OUR BLOOMBERG REPORTER WHO COVERS AMAZON. LET'S TALK ABOUT A POTENTIAL DISPARITY IN WHAT THE THIRD-PARTY FOLKS ARE SAYING AND WHAT AMAZON IS SAYING. JUST HOW GOOD HAS THIS PRIME DAY ACTUALLY BEEN SO FAR? SPENCER: WHAT WE ARE HEARING IS WE ARE GETTING SOME REVISED DATA FROM WHAT WE HAD EARLIER. SLIGHT LIFT FROM THE TYPICAL
DAY, BUT NOT NEARLY THE SAME AMOUNT OF LIFT AS WE HAD IN THE SUMMER PRIME DAY. I AM NOT SURE WE ARE THAT FAR OFF. IF YOU LISTEN CAREFULLY TO WHAT THE AMAZON EXECUTIVE SAID, HE USED WORDS LIKE SHOP AND ENGAGEMENT. HE DOES NOT USE WORDS LIKE "BUY" AND "SPEND." ENGAGEMENT CAN BE A CUTE WAY TO SAY THEY ARE LOOKING AT THIS, THAT AND THE OTHER BUT ARE NOT BUYING A WHOLE LOT. EMILY: WHAT DOES THIS TELL US ABOUT
THE STATE OF THE CONSUMER, POTENTIALLY LEADING INTO THE HOLIDAYS, OR DOES IT TELL US SOMETHING MORE ABOUT AMAZON? SPENCER: I THINK IT IS A LITTLE OF BOTH. CONSUMERS ARE PULLING BACK, THEY ARE DEALING WITH HIGHER FOOD AND FUEL PRICES, THINGS THEY HAVE TO BUY AND HAVE LESS MONEY TO SPEND ON THINGS THEY WANT TO BUY. ON AMAZON WE ARE SEEING SOME OF THE TOP CATEGORIES ARE HOUSEHOLD ESSENTIALS AND PANTRY ITEMS. THEY ARE SPENDING TO
STOCK UP ON THINGS THEY WOULD OTHERWISE BUY AND NOT NECESSARILY SPLURGING ON THINGS LIKE ELECTRONICS. IN TERMS OF AMAZON, THEY FIGURED WE WILL DO ANOTHER SALE. YOU SAID IT WASN'T ABOUT INVENTORY, IT IS ABOUT INVENTORY. THAT IS WHY AMAZON IS ABLE TO
SPIN THIS THING UP SO QUICKLY. A LOT OF MERCHANTS, THE INVENTORY IS ALREADY THERE. EMILY: MEANTIME, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME DEVELOPMENTS IN UNIONIZATION EFFORTS AT AN AMAZON WAREHOUSE IN CALIFORNIA. WHAT IS THE LATEST ON THAT? SPENCER: THIS IS INTERESTING TO WATCH. THERE IS ONE WAREHOUSE IN THE INLAND EMPIRE. THAT IS A REAL STRONGHOLD FOR AMAZON. THAT IS WHERE THEY HAVE
PROBABLY THE MOST CONCENTRATED NUMBER OF FACILITIES AND EMPLOYEES. ONE OF THEM JUST SUBMITTED SIGNATURES TO PUSH FOR AN UNION ELECTION AFFILIATED WITH THIS AMAZON LABOR UNION WHICH WON APPROVAL FOR A UNION IN STATEN ISLAND. THERE IS ANOTHER VOTE COMING UP IN ALBANY. STARTING TO LOOK LIKE THIS THING IS SPREADING. AMAZON IS HAVING A HARD TIME CONTAINING IT. EMILY: SPENCER SOPER, THANK YOU.
COMING UP, WEEEKS AFTER THE MASSIVE -- WEEKS AFTER THE MASSIVE ADOBE DEAL, ANOTHER AT SOFTWARE ENTERPRISE STARTUP HAS NEWS. EMILY: THE COLLABORATION SOFTWARE STARTUP AIR TABLE ANNOUNCED ITS BIGGEST LAUNCH OF THE YEAR AT ITS INARGUABLE LEADERS FORUM. -- ITS INAUGURAL LEADERS FORUM. COMING UP WITH A NEW CONNECTED APP PLATFORM THAT WILL HELP COMPANY'S LIKE NETFLIX AND LINKEDIN SHARE DANA, MANAGE WORKFLOWS -- DATA, MANAGE WORKFLOWS AND MORE. CEO AND COFOUNDER HOWIE LIU JOINS US NOW FOR MORE ON THIS. TALK ABOUT THE TRENDS YOU'RE SEEING IN ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE AND WHY THIS ANNOUNCEMENT IN YOUR MIND IS IMPORTANT.
WHAT PROBLEMS DOES THIS SOLVE? HOWIE: 10 YEARS AGO, WE CREATED AIR TABLE TO EMPOWER THE TEAMS CLOSEST TO THE WORK IN EVERY COMPANY TO BE PART OF THAT DISRUPTION, TO BUILD THE APPS FOR THEMSELVES THAT THEY NEEDED. NOW WE ARE SEEING IT IS NOT ENOUGH TO HAVE INDIVIDUAL APPS, BUT THOSE APPS NEED TO BE CONNECTED AND ALLOW THE ENTIRE ENTERPRISE TO SHARE TRUTH WHILE ENABLING THOSE INDIVIDUAL TEAMS TO BE FLEXIBLE AND AGILE. IT IS THE NEXT FRONTIER OF AIRTABLE, COMBINING WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE DONE LITERALLY AND THESE CONNECTED APPS ACROSS THE ENTERPRISE. EMILY:
AIRTABLE BENEFITED FROM SOME OF THOSE PANDEMIC TAILWINDS, THE SHIFT TO HYBRID WORK. HAS THAT KEPT UP? WHAT SORT OF WORKPLACE TRENDS ARE YOU SEEING NOW? HOWIE: THERE IS THIS HUGE NEED TO RETHINK HOW WORK IS BEING DONE, ESPECIALLY IN TODAY'S ECONOMY, IT IS NOT ABOUT JUST THROWING MORE PEOPLE AT EVERY PROBLEM. YOU CAN JUST DOUBLE YOUR HEADCOUNT TO GET MORE OUTPUT. -- CAN'T JUST DOUBLE YOUR
HEADCOUNT TO GET MORE OUTPUT. IT IS ONLY SHOWING UP IN HOW WE SEE OUR CUSTOMERS ADOPT AIRTABLE , IT IS REALLY ABOUT ENABLING MORE AGILITY AND MORE OUTPUT. WE TALKED ABOUT THIS CUSTOMER CASE STUDY DURING OUR EVENT EARLIER TODAY, OF EQUINOX ACCELERATING CONTENT PRODUCTION EFFORTS BY 400% WITH THE SAME TEAM. THEY WERE ALL WORKING FROM HOME, NONETHELESS USING AIRTABLE AS CONNECTED APPS. EMILY: HOW DO YOU SEE COMPETITION SHAPING UP? THERE ARE OTHERS VYING TO BE THE PROJECT MANAGEMENT TOOL OF CHOICE. WHAT IS AIRTABLE'S ADVANTAGE? HOWIE: I THINK THE WHOLE IDEA BEHIND DECLARING OUR NORSTAR OF CONNECTED APPS IS WE ARE ELEVATING OURSELVES OUT OF THAT WORLD OF PROJECT MANAGEMENT. WE DON'T CARE AS MUCH ABOUT THE
TASK MANAGEMENT SMALL TEAM USE CASES THAT I THINK A LOT OF THE OTHER PRODUCTS ARE GOING AFTER. INSTEAD WE ARE TRAINED TO SOLVE THIS BIGGER PROBLEM ACROSS AN ENTIRE ENTERPRISE WHERE YOU NEED THESE HIGH-VALUE GOLDEN -- FOR EXAMPLE, NETFLIX WANTING TO MANAGE ALL THEIR MARKETING, THEIR LEGAL RIGHTS MANAGEMENT, WORKFLOWS ACROSS THAT DATA SET. IT IS US TAKING ON MORE COMPANIES, EVEN SALESFORCE WITH THEIR APP EFFORTS, NOT JUST DOING PROJECTS OR TASKS. EMILY: I THINK SOME PEOPLE ARE STILL RECOVERING FROM THE SHOCK OF THIS BIG ADOBE DEAL, $20 BILLION. I'M DYING TO HEAR YOUR THOUGHTS ON IT GIVEN AIRTABLE IS ONE OF THE FEW "HOT" ENTERPRISE STARTUPS MENTIONED IN THE SAME BREATH AS SIGMA.
HOWIE: I THINK SIGMA IS AN INCREDIBLE PRODUCT, COMPANY, HAS A GREAT TEAM. THEY STARTED AROUND THE SAME TIME AS US. WE BOTH STARTED AROUND 2012. BOTH SPENT YEARS BUILDING A TECHNICALLY INTERESTING PRODUCT. THESE WERE NOT PROJECTS THAT WERE BUILT OVERNIGHT, BUT A DELIBERATE TAKING ON OF A LARGE MARKET OPPORTUNITY. ULTIMATELY I THINK THE TREND
THAT HAS BENEFITED BOTH OF US IS FOR THE FIRST TIME ON THE WEB WHEN WE BOTH STARTED, YOU COULD BUILD THESE RICH DESKTOP EXPENSES. YOU COULD NOT BUILD THAT LEVEL OF EXPERIENCE IN THE WEST, NOR COULD YOU BUILD AIRTABLE. I THINK WE ARE BOTH AT THE RIGHT PLACE RIGHT TIME TO TAKE ON LARGE MARKET OPPORTUNITIES AND DISRUPTING SOME INCUMBENTS AS A RESULT. EMILY: IS GETTING ACQUIRED LIKE THAT SOMETHING THAT IS ATTRACTIVE TO YOU? ARE YOU ON THE IPO PATH INSTEAD? HOWIE: I THINK THE BEST COMPANIES HAVE TO THINK ABOUT HOW TO BUILD AN INDEPENDENT BUSINESS. WHEN YOU LOOK AT SIGMA, ONE OF THE REASONS WHY IT WAS SO ATTRACTIVE AS A BUSINESS IS BECAUSE THEY COULD NOT GO IT ALONE. IT IS GROWING QUICKLY, IT IS AN
AMAZING BUSINESS. IT IS TRULY A DISRUPTIVE AND THE LIGHT FOR PRODUCT. IF YOU CAN GO OUT AND BUILD A COMPANY THAT IS CAPABLE OF BEING A STAR ON THE IPO PATH, THAT RAISES YOUR ATTRACTIVENESS. WE HAVE BEEN SQUARELY FOCUSED ON BUILDING THE BEST PRODUCT AND COMPANY THAT WE CAN.
WE ARE NOT OPTIMIZING FOR AN ACQUISITION. EMILY: WE HAVE SEEN VALUATIONS OF TECH STARTUPS FALL ACROSS THE BOARD. YOU RAISED AT AN ALMOST $12 BILLION VALUATION AT THE END OF LAST YEAR. DOES THAT NUMBER HOLD UP IN DOWNTURN OR IS AIRTABLE IN THE RARE CATEGORY OF STARTUPS LIKE SIGMA POTENTIALLY WHERE THAT NUMBER POTENTIALLY GOES UP? HOWIE: THE WAY I HAVE ALWAYS THOUGHT ABOUT IT IS THE SHORT-TERM VALUATION IS A POINT IN TIME. WHAT REALLY MATTERS FOR US AS TEAM MEMBERS WORKING ON THIS COMPANY, FOR SHAREHOLDERS INVESTING IN AIRTABLE, WHAT IS THE LONG-TERM EXPECTED VALUE OF THIS BUSINESS? ESPECIALLY SINCE WE ARE PRIVATE AND DON'T HAVE A PUBLIC LIQUID VALUE, WHAT DO WE THINK THIS COMPANY WILL BE WORTH IN ONE OR THREE YEARS? WHAT CAN WE DO TO DRIVE THE BEST POSSIBLE RESULT? AS WE PUSH INTO CONNECTED APPS AND BIGGER POSSIBILITIES OF SOLVING A PROBLEM FOR ENTERPRISES AT LARGE, GENERATING MULTIMILLION DOLLAR CONTRACTS REPEATEDLY, I THINK WE FEEL VERY GOOD ABOUT THE CLEAR PATH WE CAN GET TO BUILDING A REALLY EXTRAORDINARY BUSINESS THAT IS HIGHLY DIFFERENTIATED, HAS THE ECONOMICS TO SUPPORT A PREMIUM MULTIPLE.
WHETHER THERE IS OVERALL MULTIPLE COMPRESSIONS OF THE MARKET IN THE NEAR TERM, I THINK THE GREAT BUSINESSES THAT ULTIMATELY GO AFTER AND HAVE GROWTH POTENTIAL CAN OUTGROW THAT DEPRESSION BECAUSE THEY KEEP GROWING AND GROWING. EMILY: INTERESTING RESPONSE. AIRTABLE CO-FOUNDER AND CEO HOWIE LIU. GOOD TO HAVE YOU BACK ON THE
SHOW. THANK YOU FOR STOPPING BY. COMING UP, OUR CONVERSATION WITH FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE AND TECH ENTREPRENEUR ANDREW YANG. HIS OUTLOOKS ON HOW STARTUPS SURVIVE IN A DOWNTURN, CRYPTO, TECH REGULATION AND MORE, COMING UP NEXT.
LATER IN THE SHOW, THE GRAYSCALE LEGAL CHALLENGE WITH THE SEC OVER A $12 BILLION ETF. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. ♪ EMILY: WELCOME BACK TO "BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY." I'M EMILY CHANG IN SAN FRANCISCO. GLOBAL SELLOFF AND SEMICONDUCTOR SHARES CONTINUES, BUT ONE NAME IN JAPAN IS BUCKING THAT TREND.
ED LUDLOW IS BACK AT A LOOK. ED: WE DON'T OFTEN TALK ABOUT JAPAN BUT LET'S LOOK AT THEM IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS BIG SELLOFF WE HAVE SEEN IN GLOBAL CHICK STOCKS. -- TIP STOCKS. JUMPING 15%. A LOT OF INVESTOR INTEREST GENERATING AROUND ¥67 BILLION OF PROCEEDS. WHAT IS SO INTERESTING ABOUT THIS NAME, IT IS A MAKER OF SISTERS ON A CHIP OR LOGIC PROCESSORS FOR ONE OR -- FOR WANT OF A BETTER DESCRIPTION. THERE IS A LOT OF APPETITE FOR WHAT IT IS OFFERING IN A MARKET WHERE WE HAVE A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT GLOBAL CHIP DEMAND.
THIS WAS THE BIGGEST IPO IN JAPAN SO FAR THIS YEAR ON A GROSS PROCEEDS GENERATED BASIS. THE FOURTH IPO FOR A CHIPMAKER OUT OF JAPAN THIS YEAR. IT IS REALLY INTERESTING TO SEE THAT NAME BUCK THE TREND.
ALSO GETTING DATA POINTS OUT THIS WEDNESDAY THAT SEE RETAIL INVESTORS TAKING A KEEN INTEREST IN THE CHIP SPACE EVEN IF WE SEE INSTITUTIONAL MONEY SITTING ON THE SIDELINES OR PULLING OUT BECAUSE WE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT A GLOBAL SLOWDOWN. SPEAKING ABOUT THOSE CONCERNS, WE LOOK AT THIS TERMINAL CHART, INVESTORS ARE PULLING BACK EARNINGS EXPECTATIONS FOR THE CHIP SECTOR. WE HAVE HAD BAD NEWS FOR A BROAD RANGE OF NAMES. WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT A SLOWDOWN IN DEMAND FOR CONSUMER ELECTRONICS, MEMORY CHIPS, AND THE PEC MARKET. THAT SCOOP OVERNIGHT FROM BLOOMBERG THAT INTEL IS GOING TO CUT THOUSANDS OF JOBS BECAUSE OF THE PCE SLOWDOWN.
THIS IS THE RESULT, THE MARKET PULLING BACK EXCITATIONS. ONE NAME IN JAPAN, SOCIONEXT, BUCKING THAT TREND. EMILY: ALL RIGHT, ED, THANK YOU. APPRECIATE IT. I WANT TO ZOOM OUT NOW A CHIP STOCKS AND GET BACK TO THE BROADER MACROENVIRONMENT WITH RISING INFLATION AND A FALLING MARKET. THE STATE EVALUATIONS, VENTURE CAPITAL, STARTUP INNOVATION, ALL TOP OF MIND AT THE GREENWICH ECONOMIC FORUM. OUR NEXT GUEST, ANDREW YANG, JOINS US FROM THERE NOW. SO, ANDREW, OBVIOUSLY SO MUCH
TALK ABOUT WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN WITH THIS ECONOMY. ARE WE OR ARE WE NOT GOING INTO EVERY SESSION? GIVEN YOUR VENTURE FIRM AMERICA BACKGROUND, I AM CURIOUS WHAT YOUR OUTLOOK IS, IS YO -- IF YOU ARE AN ENTREPRENEUR, TRYING TO GET STARTED IN A DOWNTURN. ANDREW: IF YOU LOOK AT THE TRACK RECORD OF HIGH-GROWTH COMPANIES, EMILY, AND YOU KNOW THIS WELL, MOST OF THE REALLY MEANINGFUL COMPANIES GET STARTED IN A DOWNTURN LIKE THIS ONE, FOR A HOST OF REASONS. THE FACT IS AN ENTERPRISE THAT SUCCEEDS IN THIS TIME WILL BE POISED TO REALLY MUSHROOM AS SOON AS THE CLIMATE STARTS TURNING MORE POSITIVE.
SO I DO THINK THIS WILL BE A VERY TOUGH TIME BUT GUARANTEED WE ARE GOING TO SEAT TONS OF MEANINGFUL FIRMS COME OUT OF THIS PERIOD. EMILY: WHAT IS YOUR SENSE OF HOW THIS TOUGH TIME WILL COMPARED TO, LET'S SAY, THE FINANCIAL CRISIS, OR EVEN THE DOTCOM BUST? IS THERE SOMETHING DIFFERENT ABOUT IT? ANDREW: I THINK WE HAVE A WAYS TO GO ON THE DOWNSLOPE. MYSELF, WE CAN ALL SEE VERY CLEARLY THAT THE FED WILL BE JACKING UP INTEREST RATES FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE.
THERE ARE A LOT OF VALUATIONS THAT DO NOT MAKE AS MUCH SENSE IN THAT ENVIRONMENT. SO WE ARE ALL GOING TO FIND OUT TOGETHER HOW THIS COMPARES TO SOME OF THE TOUGH TIMES OF THE PAST. BUT I CERTAINLY THINK THAT FOLKS SHOULD TRY AND KEEP SOME POWDER DRY. MAKE SURE THAT YOU HAVE ENOUGH CASH TO MAKE IT THROUGH FOR A LITTLE BIT LONGER THAN YOU MIGHT HELP. -- HOPE. EMILY: SAN FRANCISCO IS ONE CITY THAT IS HAVING A TOUGH TIME RECOVERING FROM THE PANDEMIC, AND NOW THERE IS THIS DOWNTURN.
YOU HAVE COMPANIES GOING REMOTE, YOU HAVE COMPANIES MOVING TO AUSTIN OR MIAMI. DO YOU THINK THE CENTER OF INNOVATION, THE FUNDAMENTAL CENTER OF GRAVITY IS ACTUALLY GOING TO SHIFT AND BECOME MORE DISTRIBUTED, OR IS IT TOO EARLY TO SAY THAT? ANDREW: YOU AND I BOTH HAVE FRIENDS WHO HAVE DECAMPED TO AUSTIN OR MIAMI. I AM A BIG BELIEVER THAT INNOVATION AND GROWTH WILL FOLLOW WHEREVER THE TALENT GOES. SO, IF YOU HAVE PEOPLE WHO HAVE PERMANENTLY SETTLED IN AUSTIN, I THINK YOU ARE GOING TO SEE A PERMANENT SHIFT, TRULY. NOW, THE BAY AREA, IN MY VIEW,
STILL HAS THE HIGHEST CONCENTRATION OF TECH TALENT, SO IT'S STILL GOING TO BE THE ENVY OF MANY OTHER CITIES. BUT I DO THINK WE'RE IN A PERMANENTLY DIFFERENT TIME WHERE TALENT IS GOING TO BE MORE DISTRIBUTED AND BECAUSE OF THAT YOU ARE GOING TO SEE B MORE DISTRIBUTED AND GROWTH COMPANIES COME OUT OF PLACES WHERE THEY MIGHT NOT HAVE OTHERWISE. EMILY: CONGRESS HAS BEEN TRYING TO REIN IN BIG TECH AND BIG TECH HAS RETALIATED BY SPENDING A TON OF MONEY TO KILL ONE OF THE MOST AGGRESSIVE OVERSIGHT BILLS IN YEARS. WHAT IS YOUR THOUGHT ON WHETHER THAT BILL POTENTIALLY NEEDS TO BE REVIVED, AND WHETHER STRONG REGULATION IS REALLY NEEDED? ANDREW: IT IS INTERESTING, EMILY, THE POLITICAL CLIMATE HAS CHANGED SUCH THAT TECH NOW IS A BIT OF A PUNCHING BAG FOR BOTH PARTIES. AND I'M OF THE BELIEF THAT THERE HAVE BEEN SOME EXCESSES THAT REGULATION WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR, AND A LOT IS GOING TO HINGE ON WHAT THE POLITICAL CLIMATE IS AFTER THESE MIDTERMS. RIGHT NOW, THE SENATE IS A TOSSUP, BY MOST ACCOUNTS.
REPUBLICANS ARE SLIGHTLY FAVORED IN THE HOUSE. AND I THINK THAT MIGHT CHANGE THE PROSPECTS OF SOME OF THE BILLS THAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. EMILY: YOU HAVE BEEN VERY VOCAL ABOUT DATA COLLECTION. YOU LAUNCHED THE DATA DIVIDEND, PRODUCTS TO HELP AMERICANS TAKE CONTROL OF YOUR DATA. HOW ARE YOU FEELING ABOUT HOW TECH COMPANIES ARE HANDLING THAT DATA RIGHT NOW, AND ESPECIALLY GOING INTO AN ELECTION? ANDREW: YOU KNOW, IT IS FASCINATING, EMILY.
AS YOU KNOW I CHAMPIONED THE CPR A AND DATA PRIVACY REGULATIONS IN CALIFORNIA WHERE YOU ARE. AND BECAUSE CALIFORNIA HAS NOW SET A HIGHER BAR, NATIONAL LEGISLATION IS INCREASINGLY LIKELY AND ON THE TABLE IN PART BECAUSE TECH COMPANIES WANTED TO SUPPLANT AND REPLACE THE RULES IN CALIFORNIA. OUR DATA IS BEING USED NOT TO OUR BENEFIT. IT'S $200 BILLION-PLUS A YEAR INDUSTRY.
IT IS ERODING OUR DEMOCRACY, OUR KIDS' MENTAL HEALTH. I'M SOMEONE WHO THINKS WE SHOULD OWN OUR DATA, AND NOT ONLY HAVE IT USED MORE TO OUR BENEFIT, BUT IF THERE IS GOING TO BE MARKET VALUE GAINED, THEN WE SHOULD JOIN IN THAT BENEFIT. SO, THAT'S WHERE I WOULD LIKE THE NATIONAL APPROACH TO GO.
EUROPE HAS NEW RULES THAT ARE COMING ONLINE IN 2024, WHICH IS RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER, AND I THINK THAT WILL INCREASE PRESSURE ON THE STATES TO HAVE A MORE MODERNIZED APPROACH. EMILY: YOU HAVE BEEN BRANCHING OUT INTO CRYPTO AND WEB 3.0, AND I AM CURIOUS HOW MUCH OF A ROLE YOU THINK CRYPTO WILL PLAY IN FUNDRAISING GOING INTO 2024, AND IF YOU THINK DEMOCRATS OR REPUBLICANS HAVE MORE OF AN ADVANTAGE. ANDREW:
I THINK THE SINGLE GUEST DONOR OF THE LAST CYCLE IS -- WHO YOU PROBABLY KNOW WELL. WEB 3.0, IN MY VIEW, IS GOING TO BE A VERY FASCINATING CLINICAL FORCE TO BE RECKONED WITH. RIGHT NOW, THEY ARE CONCERNED OBVIOUSLY WITH THE REGULATION OF CRYPTO ITSELF. I THINK YOU ARE GOING TO SEE MORE PEOPLE PUSHING INTO POLITICS BECAUSE NOW THE INTERACTION WITH D.C. IS GOING TO BE ONE OF THE MAIN DRIVERS OF WHETHER ENTERPRISES ARE ABLE TO GROW AND OPERATE SUCCESSFULLY ANYWHERE, BUT CERTAINLY WHETHER THEY ARE GOING TO BE HEADQUARTERED HERE IN THE U.S. EMILY: YOU ALSO LAUNCHED LOBBY THREE EARLIER THIS YEAR.
HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE BOUGHT INTO THE TOKENS, AND WHAT POSITIONS IS LOBBY THREE GOING TO BE ADVOCATING FOR? ANDREW: LOBBY THREE HAS BEEN A GREAT, ENERGIZED COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE WHO WANT TO PUSH FOR COMMON SENSE REGULATION OUT OF D.C. THAT IS INTELLIGENT, SOPHISTICATED, AND IS NOT TRY AND THROW DIFFERENT TYPES OF ASSETS TOGETHER THAT HAS ONE REGULATOR INSTEAD OF KIND OF A HODGEPODGE. AND IT'S BEEN AWESOME GETTING TO KNOW PEOPLE WHO WANT THE BEST THINGS FOR CREATORS AND ENTREPRENEURS IN THIS SPACE.
ANY TIME I GO TO A WEB 3.0 GATHERING THERE ARE SOME FOLKS WHO ARE PART OF THE LOBBY THREE COMMUNITY AND IT HAS BEEN A LOT OF FUN. EMILY: AS A FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE AND THE CO-CHAIR NOW OF THE FORWARD PARTY, I WOULD LOVE TO SEE INTO YOUR CRYSTAL BALL. DO YOU THINK A BIDEN/TRUMP FACEOFF IN 2024, IS THAT INEVITABLE? ANDREW: IT IS THE MOST LIKELY MATCH UP RIGHT NOW. THE ODDS ARE THAT TRUMP DECLARES AT THE END OF THIS YEAR AFTER THE MIDTERMS AND THEN BIDEN DECLARES EITHER Q1 OR Q2 NEXT YEAR. I WILL SAY THAT THOSE TWO
CANDIDATES WILL HAVE A COMBINED AGE OF 159 IN 2024, AND 58% OF AMERICANS ARE NOT EXCITED ABOUT ANY OF THEM. SO THE QUESTION IS WHETHER UNITY TICKET OR SOME INDEPENDENT EFFORT ARISES. IN A GROUP CALLED NO LABELS HAS BETTER -- HAS VERY PUBLICLY INVESTED $53 BILLION IN BALLOT ACCESS FOR A POTENTIAL UNITY TICKET.
I THINK THERE'LL WILL BE A LOT OF ENTHUSIASM FOR SOME ALTERNATIVE AFTER THE PEOPLE FACE THE REALITY IT IS A REMATCH IN 2024 BETWEEN TRUMP AND BIDEN. EMILY: SO, LET'S SAY BIDEN DOES NOT RUN. DO YOU THINK THE DEMOCRATS HAVE A STRONG ENOUGH BENCH? WHO IS ON THAT BENCH? WOULD YOU CONSIDER RUNNING AGAIN? ANDREW: I THINK JOE BIDEN LIKELY DECLARES BECAUSE HE FEELS HE IS THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN DEFEAT DONALD TRUMP BECAUSE HE DID IT ONCE. AND YOU CANNOT ARGUE WITH THE FACT THAT HE DID DEFEAT TRUMP WANTS. BUT IS ALSO TRUMP TO S -- ALASO
TOUGH TO SLOT IN ANOTHER DEMOCRAT YOU HAVE THE SAME CONFIDENCE IN NECESSARILY, IF YOU ARE JOE OR EVEN ANYONE, BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT IS UNCLEAR WHO THE DEMOCRATIC NOMINEE WOULD BE. I THINK THAT IS ONE REASON WHY JOE IS GOING TO RUN AGAIN, HONESTLY. EMILY: SO, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO SPEND THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS IF YOU ARE NOT RUNNING AGAIN? WHERE ARE WE GOING TO SEE YOU PLACE YOUR ENERGY AND EFFORTS AND PRIORITIES, GIVEN THE VERY CRITICAL ELECTION COMING UP? ANDREW: THE FORWARD PARTY HAS ENDORSED A NUMBER OF CANDIDATES AROUND THE COUNTRY, INCLUDING A U.S. SENATE CANDIDATE IN UTAH. I THINK WE NEED TO CHANGE THE UNDERLYING INCENTIVES FOR OUR LAWMAKERS AND LEADERS BY DOING AWAY WITH CLOSE PARTY PRIMARIES AND REPLACING THEM WITH PRIMARIES WERE ANYONE CAN VOTE FOR ANYONE THROUGH RANKED CHOICE VOTING.
IF THERE IS ANYTHING YOU REMEMBER FROM THIS INTERVIEW OUT THERE, RANKED CHOICE VOTING IS THE WAY OUT OF THIS MESS. IT IS THE WAY ANYONE CAN VOTE FOR ANYONE WITH NO SPOILER EFFECT AND IT REWARDS MORE MODERATE, REASONABLE, COLLABORATIVE CANDIDATES WHO ACTUALLY COME THROUGH FOR 51% OF VOTERS. SO I AM GOING TO BE TRYING TO MAKE RANKED CHOICE VOTING THE LAW AND AS MANY PLACES AS POSSIBLE, AND I AM HAPPY TO SAY IT IS SPREADING AROUND THE COUNTRY. EMILY: ALL RIGHT. ANDREW YANG, ALWAYS GREAT TO HAVE YOU WITH US. ENTREPRENEUR, FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE, COCHAIR OF THE FORWARD PARTY. COMING UP, THE LATEST SALVO COMES FROM GRAYSCALE VERSUS THE SEC. THE GRAYSCALE CEO JOINING US NEXT TO TALK ABOUT THE CASE
FOR A BITCOIN ETF. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. ♪ EMILY: CRYPTO ASSET MANAGER GRAYSCALE INVESTMENTS SAYS THERE IS NO JUSTIFICATION FOR THE SEC'S REJECTION OF A BITCOIN ETF EARLIER THIS YEAR. THE FIRM SAYING THE RATIONALE RAISES MORE QUESTIONS THAN ANSWERS AND WILL UNDERMINE TRUST IN CRYPTO. HERE TO EXPLAIN IS GRAYSCALE CEO MICHAEL SONNENSHEIN. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.
WHERE DOES THE LAWSUIT WITH THE SEC STAND AT THIS MOMENT? MICHAEL: LAST NIGHT, WE FILED OUR OPENING BRIEF FOR THE LAWSUIT. THIS LAYS OUT OUR INITIAL LEGAL ARGUMENTS TO THE COURT AND IS REALLY THE FIRST SUBSTANTIVE DOCUMENT AS PART OF THE LITIGATION PROCESS. IT IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THIS IS A CASE ABOUT BITCOIN BUT WE ARE PUTTING IN FRONT OF THE COURT SYSTEM STRAIGHTFORWARD COMMON SENSE ARGUMENTS. ONE OF THE NEW ARGUMENTS LAID OUT HERE HAS TO DO WITH THIS IDEA OF A SIGNIFICANT MARKET TEST WHICH THE SEC HAS APPLIED TO BITCOIN ETF APPLICATIONS. THEY HAVE APPLIED THIS VERY
STRINGENTLY TO SPOT ETF APPLICATIONS LIKE GRAYSCALE AND OTHER SPOT BITCOIN ETF'S THAT HAD BEEN DENIED, BUT VERY LENIENTLY. THERE'S BEEN NO JUSTIFICATION AS TO WHY THIS TEST IS THE ONLY TEST THAT THE SEC SHOULD BE USING. AND WE HAVE ALSO NEVER SEEN HIM USE A TEST LIKE THIS BEFORE WHEN IT COMES TO EVALUATING NEW PRODUCTS TO BRING TO MARKET. EMILY:
HAVE YOU SPOKEN AT ALL WITH GARY GENSLER DIRECTLY? MICHAEL: YOU KNOW, WE HAVE REGULAR DIALOGUE WITH REALLY EVERYONE IN D.C. MY LEGAL TEAM AND MYSELF ARE DOWN IN D.C. ALMOST WEEKLY THESE DAYS, SO WE SPEAK WITH ALL DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE SEC AND OTHER REGULATOR. EMILY:
NOW, LOOK, RECENTLY THERE HAVE BEEN A TON OF CASES, FRAUGHT, AND BANKRUPTCY IN CRYPTO. TERRA, CELSIUS, THREE HOURS. WHY IS NOW THE RIGHT TIME TO PROVE TO THE SEC THAT THIS MARKET IS NO WORSE IN TERMS OF MARKET MANIPULATION THAN OTHERS? MICHAEL: THAT IS EXACTLY THE POINT. HE SIGNIFICANT MARKET TEST OF SEC HAS LAID OUT THEY BELIEVE PROTECTS INVESTORS FROM FRAUD AND MANIPULATION, AND THEY GOT COMFORTABLE WITH THAT WHEN IT COMES TO BITCOIN FUTURES. THE INTERESTING THING AND THE FLAW IN THAT LOGIC IS BITCOIN FUTURES DERIVE THEIR PRICING FROM THE UNDERLYING SPOT BITCOIN MARKET WHICH UNDERPINS G BTC AND OTHER APPLICATIONS THAT HAS BECOME IN FRONT OF THE SEC AND ULTIMATELY BEEN REJECTED OR DENIED.
I THINK WHAT WE ARE SEEING IN D.C. IS THE MOST ENGAGEMENT AND UNDERSTANDING WE HAVE EVER SEEN AROUND CRYPTO. YOU HAVE BIPARTISAN SUPPORT NOW WITH A VARIETY OF BILLS PASSING ACROSS THE FLOOR OF CONGRESS. AND I THINK WE AND OTHER INDUSTRY HEAVYWEIGHTS ARE CALLING ON OUR REGULATORS, CALLING ON OUR LEGISLATORS TO REALLY DEVELOP NEW FRAMEWORKS, BECAUSE OTHERWISE WE ARE SQUANDERING INNOVATION HERE IN THE UNITED STATES. EMILY: THE WINKLEVOSS BROTHERS WERE THE FIRST TO TRY THIS SPOT BITCOIN ETF. IT DID NOT FAIL. THE ROAD IS LITTERED WITH CARCASSES OF OTHERS WHO HAVE TRIED AND FAILED. HOW IS GRAYSCALE, WITH ITS HUGE
SCASLE, IN YOUR VIEW, DIFFERENT? MICHAEL: GREAT QUESTION. TODAY, TICKER GBTC IS THE LARGEST BITCOIN -- IN THE WORLD. A RECENT COUNSELOR THERE ARE MORE THAN 850,000 INVESTORS WHO OWNS SHARES OF GBTC IN THE U.S. ALONE AND THAT REPRESENTS ALL
50 STATES. SO WHEN WE AS AN ASSET MANAGER ARE TAKING A PRODUCT THAT HAS BEEN IN THE MARKET, HAS BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN ASSETS, HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN DAILY TO REALLY -- TRADING VOLUME, AND WE KNOW THAT THE RIGHT THING FOR INVESTORS TO PROTECT THEM, TO PUT ADDITIONAL DISCLOSURES AND SURVEILLANCE IN PLACE BY BECOMING AN ETF IS THE RIGHT THING TO THEM, BUT OUR REGULATOR IS SHUNNING THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO. WELL, WE CERTAINLY TAKE ISSUE WITH THAT. SO OUR TEAM HAS BEEN PUTTING THE ENTIRE RESOURCES OF THE FIRM BEHIND THIS ETF INITIATIVE AND WE ARE AS COMMITTED AS WE HAVE EVER BEEN TO IT. EMILY:
WHAT KIND OF TIMELINE DO YOU SEE FOR A RESOLUTION OF THIS CASE? MICHAEL: WE FILED A LAWSUIT EARLIER THIS SUMMER AND AT THAT TIME WE WERE GUIDED TO BELIEVE IT COULD BE ANYWHERE FROM NINE TO 12 MONTHS, ALTHOUGH IT COULD BE LONGER OR SHORTER. WHAT YOU ARE GOING TO SEE NOW THAT GRAYSCALE HAS FILED ITS OPENING BRIEF IS OVER THE COMING WEEKS YOU WILL SEE A VARIETY OF AMICUS BRIEFS. THESE ARE OTHER PARTIES THAT ARE FILING BRIEFS WITH THE COURT TO PUT IN FRONT OF THE JUDGE PRESIDING OVER THE CASE TO REALLY TALK ABOUT THEIR POINT OF VIEW ON THE ISSUES AT HAND, AND THEN ULTIMATELY YOU WILL SEE A BRIEF FROM THE SEC A COUPLE WEEKS LATER WITH THEIR RESPONSES TO THE ARGUMENTS ARE LEGAL TEAM HAS OUTLINED. EMILY:
WE'RE ALSO IN THE MIDDLE OF WHAT COULD BE A REALLY MASSIVE ECONOMIC DOWNTURN. WE JUST HEARD FROM ANDREW YANG, WHO SAYS HE THINKS WE HAVE A LOT FURTHER DOWN WHERE TO GO. WHAT IS YOUR OUTLOOK, AND WHAT IT MEANS FOR CRYPTO? MICHAEL: WE ARE CERTAINLY IN A CRYPTO WINTER, AND A CRYPTO WINTER IS CHARACTERIZED NOW BY SUSTAINED LOWER PRICES.
WE ARE SEEING FROM THE INVESTMENT COMMUNITY THOUGH THAT A LOWER PRICES ARE NOT CAUSING THEM TO SHY AWAY FROM THE ASSET CLASS. IN FACT, WE ARE SEEING INVESTORS CONTINUE TO DIVERSIFY. A LOT OF INVESTORS NOW HAVE THAT CORE POSITION IN BITCOIN AND A ETHEREUM OR BOTH, AND THEY ARE NOW LOOKING AT OTHER OPPORTUNITIES.
ONE OF THEM IS INFRASTRUCTURE. JUST LAST WEEK OUR TEAM LAUNCHED A TOTALLY NEW OFFERING, GRAYSCALE DIGITAL INFRASTRUCTURE OPPORTUNITIES LLC, A COMPANY INVESTORS CAN PUT CAPITAL WORK IN THAT IS BUYING BITCOIN MINING HARDWARE, PLUGGING IT INTO THE NETWORK AND DISTRIBUTING THAT VALUE BACK OUT TO SHAREHOLDERS. FOR A LOT OF INVESTORS THEY HAD THAT TOKEN EXPOSURE NOW AND NOW IT IS TIME TO THINK ABOUT THE UNDERLYING INFRASTRUCTURE THAT SECURES THE NETWORK. SO THERE IS A LOT OF OPPORTUNITY AND ACTIVITY GOING ON DESPITE THE SUSTAINED LOWER PRICING ENVIRONMENT WE FIND OURSELVES IN. EMILY: SPEAKING OF THE UNDERLYING INFO STRUCTURE, THE ETHEREUM MERGE ENDED UP BEING KIND OF A NONEVENT. WHAT DO YOU THINK THE NEXT BIG
EVENT IS GOING TO BE THAT WILL CATALYZE CHANGES IN POTENTIALLY BLOCKCHAIN TECHNOLOGY? MICHAEL: RESPECTFULLY, AS SOMEONE WHO HAS BEEN IN CRYPTO FOR NINE YEARS, IT ACTUALLY WAS A BIG EVENT. BECAUSE THIS WAS A QUESTION MARK HANGING OVER ETHEREUM FOR A LONG TIME. COULD WE SEE A VERY LOYAL -- VERY WELL KNOWN, VERY WELL TRAFFICKED DIGITAL ASSET MOVE AND MAKE SUCH A MEANINGFUL MOVE FROM PROOF OF WORK TO A ETHEREUM STAKE, AND IF ETHEREUM DID IT. AS WE ARE SEEING THE OUTCOME OF THAT, IT'S VERY EARLY DAYS AND WE ARE STARTING TO SEE THE DEVELOPMENT OF MORE AND MORE STAKING AROUND THE ETHEREUM AND OTHER ASSETS. WHAT'S COMING NEXT IS OTHER UPGRADES TO THE ETHEREUM NETWORK. THINGS LIKE THE ABILITY TO ON STATE ASSETS THAT WERE PUT INTO THE NETWORK FOR STAKING AND OTHER UPDATES THAT WILL COME DOWN THE LINE. I CERTAINLY THINK IT'S AN
ACCOMPLISHMENT FOR EVERYONE WHO PUT A LOT OF TIME AND MANY YEARS OF PLANNING AND ENERGY INTO GETTING THE ETHEREUM TO MAKE THE SWITCH OVER. EMILY: ALL RIGHT, POINT TAKEN. MICHAEL SONNENSHEIN, GRAYSCALE CEO. WE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO FOLLOW YOUR CHALLENGE TO THE SEC. WE ARE GOING TO BE RIGHT EMILY: APPLE IS WITHHOLDING HIS LATEST EMPLOYEE BENEFITS FROM STAFF AT ITS ONLY UNIONIZED RETAIL STORE. THE REASON GIVEN? BUT EXCLUDING UNIONIZED STORES FROM NEW BENEFITS IS NOT A NEW TREND. STARBUCKS ALSO ROLLED OUT A SERIES OF NEW PERKS AT NONUNION STORES INCLUDING RAISES AND STUDENT DEBT COACHING, WHILE SAYING IT CANNOT LEGALLY PROVIDE THEM UNILATERALLY TO SITES WITH UNION ACTIVITY.
SPACEX PLANS TO ANNOUNCE TWO NEW SPACE TOURISTS SLATED TO FLY. THE WORLD'S FIRST-EVER SPACE TO REST IN 2001 AND HIS WIFE. THEY PAID AN UNDISCLOSED AMOUNT TO FLY AROUND THE MOON ON THE VEHICLE IS COMPLETE. THEY WILL TRAVEL WITH 10 OTHER UNDISCLOSED PASSENGERS ON A ROUGHLY WEEK LONG JOURNEY. THE TRIP DOES NOT INCLUDE A LANDING ON THE LUNAR SURFACE, AND IT IS UNCLEAR IF THE OTHER PASSENGERS HAVE BEEN CHOSEN YET. AND THAT DOES IT FOR THIS
EDITION OF "BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY ." ON THURSDAY WE HAVE TRON'S JUSTIN SUN ON ALL THINGS CRYPTO AND WEB 3.0.
2022-10-13