ServiceNow's $3 Billion AI Bet, Crypto Slumps | Bloomberg Technology
>> A LOT OF THEM ARE AT MULTIPLES THAT HAVE NOT BEEN TRADED FOR A LONG TIME HERE THAT SPEAKS TO AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE PEOPLE START TO GET MORE POSITIVE, NIBBLE AT THE BOTTOM. THERE'S SO MUCH UNCERTAINTY IN THE BROADER ECONOMY. IF WE DID SEE A REBOUND FROM HERE, I DON'T THINK THAT WOULD BE TOO SURPRISING. IT'S NOT THE FUNDAMENTALS HAVE CHANGED THAT DRAMATICALLY. >> THAT'S RYAN GOSS STELLA. THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.
LATER TODAY, PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP IS SET TO MEET WITH CEOS OF MAJOR TECH COMPANIES INCLUDING IBM, INTEL, QUALCOMM AND HP. THE MEETING COMES AS THE WHITE HOUSE CONSIDERS POLICY CHANGES INCLUDING TARIFFS AND STRICTER EXPORT RULES THAT COULD IMPACT THE TECH INDUSTRY GLOBAL SUPPLY CHAINS AND OPERATIONS. MIKE SHEPARD JOINS US TO DISCUSS MORE. WHAT ARE THE STAKES OF THIS MEETING TODAY? >> WE ARE SEEING THE STAKES OF THIS MEETING PLAY OUT IN THE MARKET. WE ARE SEEING THE UNCERTAINTY
THAT IS GRIPPING INVESTORS AS REALLY A REFLECTION OF WHAT THESE COMPANIES ARE GOING THROUGH. THE TARIFFS, WHETHER THEY ARE IMPOSED OR NOT, ARE THROWING AN ELEMENT OF WHAT HAPPENS NEXT FOR THEM AND THEIR SUPPLY CHAINS. AND ALSO WHAT HAPPENS TO COST THAT THEY MAY HAVE TO BEAR AND MARKETS IF THEY MAY BE TRYING TO SELL TOO. NOT ONLY CONSUMERS WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT ENDPOINT BUYERS BUT ALSO FOLKS, OTHER COMPANIES THAT MAY BE LOOKING TO MAKE ACQUISITIONS ALONG THE WAY FOR THEIR OWN SUPPLY CHAIN. THERE WILL BE A LOT TO SAY AT THIS. IT IS UNCLEAR WHETHER THERE
WILL BE JUST A BIG ANNOUNCEMENT FROM THE PRESIDENT. IT'S NOT SIGNALING THAT WAY WHEN WE THINK ABOUT THE TSMC ANNOUNCEMENT FROM A WEEK AGO OR THE SOFTBANK ANNOUNCEMENT ON STARGATE WITH OPENAI AND ORACLE. THIS DOES NOT HAVE QUITE THAT VIBRATE NOW. WE WILL HAVE TO SEE WITH THE PRESIDENTS US. THE MEETING IS CLOSE TO PRESS BUT MAYBE THEY WILL OPEN IT UP.
>> IS A GREAT POINT YOU BRING UP WITH STARGATE. AS WE HAVE SEEN IN THE BROADER START OF MARKET, IT IS HARD TO RAISE MONEY. ESPECIALLY IF YOUR LATER STAGE. DID SERVICE NOW GET A GOOD DEAL HERE? >> IT IS A PRETTY GOOD OUTCOME. IT HAS BEEN A TOUGH MARKET FOR VC BACKED COMPANIES. 2.1 TO 3 THAT IS A PRETTY LARGE DEAL. WITH SERVICE NOW, IT'S FUNNY. THEIR CEO HAD A REPUTATION FOR
HUGE DEALS. HE CAME IN AT SERVICE NOW AND SAID THESE DAYS ARE BEHIND ME, WE ARE GOING FOR ORGANIC GROWTH. IT SEEMS LIKE TODAY, THE FLOODGATES MAY BE OPENING. IT MIGHT SEND THE MESSAGE THAT SERVICE NOW MIGHT BE THE BIG ACQUIRER. >> IT DOES NOT SEEM AS THOUGH THE MARKET IS THAT JUBILANT.
THE MARKET IS DOWN ACROSS THE BOARD. SERVICE NOW IS DOWN BY MORE THAN 6% WHICH IS MORE THAN THE SLUMP OF THE NASDAQ 100. ARE INVESTORS NERVY ABOUT THESE OUTGOINGS AT A TIME WHERE SERVICE NOW HAS A LOT OF GOVERNMENT EXPOSURE IN TERMS OF CONTRACTS? >> THE QUESTION IS HOW QUICK ARE YOU TURNING THE AI MOMENT INTO REVENUE. FOR SERVICE NOW AND THE MOST RECENT EARNINGS, THEY SHOWED THAT WE ARE PRIORITIZING ADOPTION RATHER THAN REVENUE. SPENDING $3 BILLION TO
ESSENTIALLY BUY SOONER REVENUE RECOGNITION, THAT COULD BE A SIGN OF WE CERTAINLY. >> YOU ARE FRONT RUNNING THE OFFICIAL ANNOUNCEMENT WITH A SKIP OVER THE WEEKEND, BRILLIANT. THANK YOU. BITCOIN SLUMP CONTINUES TO'S -- TWO SLUMP. MORE ON THE BITCOIN SPACE. SHARES OF TESLA IS WHERE WE FOCUS IN. BITCOIN UP BY 3.7%. CHECK OUT WHAT THIS NAME IS DOWN BY. 8.6%.
IT'S LEAVING AND TERMS OF THE SELLOFF, WE ARE SEEING FROM A POINTS PERSPECTIVE. APPLE, NVIDIA CONTRIBUTING. WE ARE WORRIED ABOUT CHINA. MORE BROADLY, MORE ABOUT VALUATIONS FOR A COMPANY THAT'S UBS IS SAYING THE AI TRADE IS TOO LONG TERM FOR THIS PARTICULAR ONE. THEY DOWNGRADE THEIR VIEW ON SALES FOR THE FIRST QUARTER.
THIS IS "BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY." >> BITCOIN'S SLIDE CONTINUES, BELOW $80,000 FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE NOVEMBER. THE ASSET CLASS IS CONSUMED BY MACRO CONCERNS RATHER THAN THE SLEW OF PRO-CRYPTO RHETORIC HE GOT FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP'S CRYPTO SUMMIT. LET'S BREAK IT DOWN WITH SONALI BASAK. THERE IS THIS UNDERWHELMED FEELING FROM THE CRYPTO SUMMIT BUT IT IS MACRO FRONT AND CENTER. SONALI: FIRST AND FOREMOST, THE RISK APPETITE IS TOUGH OUT THERE.
YOU HAVE A HIGH CORRELATION STEEL FOR BITCOIN TO STOCKS. IF YOU ARE SELLING OF RISK ASSETS, YOU ARE NOT BUYING IT GOING TODAY. WHAT IS REMARKABLE IS NOT EVEN JUST TODAY'S DECLINE, AND YOU ARE NOW FLIRTING WITH THAT $80,000 LEVEL. WE HAVE DROPPED BELOW IT. BUT IT IS TRYING TO KEEP THAT MARK. YOU HAVE BITCOIN DOWN MORE THAN 25% SINCE THE HIGHS WE SAW.
IF YOU BOUGHT BITCOIN AT 110 -- $110,000, YOU ARE FEELING THAT PAIN TODAY. ON A 70 BASIS, BITCOIN IS DOWN MORE THAN 11%. SO TOO IS THEORY -- IS A THEORY. ONE THING THAT IS IMPORTANT IS THE STRATEGIC BITCOIN RESERVE THAT THE WHITE HOUSE HAD BEEN TALKING ABOUT.
IT IS NOT THE IDEA THAT THEY WILL BE BUYING MORE CRYPTO ASSETS. THEY WOULD BE TAKING ASSETS FROM WHAT IS ALREADY FORFEITED, FROM WHAT THEY HAVE SEIZED. IF YOU ARE NOT BUYING FROM THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, THEN IT REMAINS THAT BITCOIN NEEDS THAT EXTRA MARGINAL BUYERS STORY HERE AT A TIME WHERE AS WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT, RISK APPETITE IS QUITE LOW. >> CRYPTO IS ALMOST SYNONYMOUS WITH VOLATILITY. HOW MUCH OF THESE SWINGS ARE ACTUALLY UNPRECEDENTED? HOW DOES IT COMPARE TO WHAT WE HAVE SEEN IN THE PAST? SONALI: THINK ABOUT IT THIS WAY, ON ONE HAND, IT IS SOMETHING THAT BIG INVESTORS WHO HAVE BEEN IN BITCOIN A LONG TIME HAVE BARED BEFORE. YOU HAVE TO BILLIONAIRES IN THE
CRYPTO INDUSTRY USED TO LOSING ONE BILLION OR A FEW IN A SINGLE YEAR. IF YOU ARE A RETAIL BUYER WHO MAY BE GOT IN AT THE END OF LAST YEAR WHEN THE PRICES WERE STILL HIGH, THROUGH THE FORM OF AN ETF, IT IS TOUGHER TO BEAR. IF YOU'RE THINKING OF THE LOOKAHEAD AS WELL, THERE ARE A LOT OF MEAN COINS AND ALTCOINS PEOPLE HAVE BOUGHT INTO IN ADDITION TO BITCOIN. EVEN MORE OF A DROP IN BITCOIN TODAY IS FOR EXAMPLE, DOGE. MANY OF YOU MAY NOTICE OVER THE WEEKEND, THERE WAS CRITICISM AROUND DOGE IN THE PLANS FOR IT BOTH BY JUDGES AS WELL AS MEMBERS OF THE ADMINISTRATION, ACCORDING TO DIFFERENT REPORTS OUT THERE. IT'S NOT JUST BITCOIN. THEY SAW THIS BIG RALLY WHEN PRESIDENT TRUMP INITIALLY HAD HINTED THAT CAR DOWN OH, X RP, COULD BE CONSIDERED FOR THIS RESERVE BUT THEY WERE NOT IN THAT EXECUTIVE ORDER NECESSARILY OR PURCHASE FOR THIS STRATEGIC BITCOIN RESERVE.
OR CRYPTO ASSET RESERVE. YOU DO SEE PAIN THERE BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT'S PLANS ARE SOMEWHAT UNCLEAR EVEN AFTER THAT BIG WHITE HOUSE SUMMIT ON FRIDAY. >> THAT'S BLOOMBERG'S SONALI BASAK THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. WE CAUGHT UP WITH WHITE HOUSE AI AND CRYPTO DAVID SACHS AHEAD OF THE CRYPTO SUMMIT ON FRIDAY. HERE'S WHAT HE HAD TO SAY ABOUT THE CREATION OF THE BITCOIN RESERVE. DAVID: THE REASON WHY WE NEED A BITCOIN RESERVE IS THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ALREADY OWNS SOME.
THE STRATEGY HAS BEEN SIMPLY TO SELL IT IN AN AD HOC WAY WILLY-NILLY. THAT COST AMERICAN TAXPAYERS SOMETHING LIKE $17 BILLION IN LOST ALL YOU. WE WANT TO HAVE A LONG-TERM STRATEGY. >> FOR MORE ON THE CRYPTO LANDSCAPE, STACY RALL AND FOUNDER JOINS US NOW. WHY DID THIS CRYPTO SUMMIT FALL
FLAT BECAUSE HOPES WERE PRETTY HIGH. STACY: I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO REALIZE THAT UNLIKE MARKETS THAT REACT INSTANTANEOUSLY, POLICYMAKING REQUIRES PATIENCE. IT IS A SLOW PROCESS. YES, THE BALL STARTED ROLLING ON FRIDAY WITH THE PRESIDENT'S CALL FOR THE CREATION OF A STRATEGIC RESERVE AND DIGITAL ASSETS. THERE ARE A LOT OF DETAILS AS WE HAVE BEEN TAUGHT -- THEN DISCUSSING. THERE IS STILL A ROLE FOR CONGRESS TO PLAY. CAROLINE: WITH THE WORK YOU HAVE DONE
WITH THE GOVERNMENT RELATIONS YOU BUILD, THE ADVISORY WORK YOU HAVE BEEN DOING, IS THERE CONSISTENCY ENOUGH? I THINK THE FACT THAT YOU ARE SAYING IT IS DAY ONE AND TAKES A WHILE TO DIGEST WHAT A STRATEGIC BITCOIN RESERVE MEANS. BUT THE LEAD UP TO THE STRATEGIC RESERVE WAS LONG, AND MANY ANTICIPATED THERE WOULD BE BUYING. THAT MAY IT WAS NOT JUST THE BITCOIN. WE WERE ALLOWED TO GET OVER THESE HE ASKED ABOUT WHAT THE ANNOUNCEMENT WOULD BE. STACEY: IT'S A GREAT QUESTION. I THINK ESSENTIALLY, MORE CONVERSATIONS WILL HAVE TO HAPPEN. CONGRESS WILL HAVE TO BE INVOLVED. THESE ARE LONG DISCUSSIONS. I DO THINK LOOKING AT THEY
DETAILS, ONE THING THAT I THINK IS INTERESTING IS THE PART THAT THE PUBLIC WAS ABLE TO SEE. THERE WERE INTERESTING COMMENTS MADE, ESPECIALLY BY THE TREASURY SECRETARY, WHERE HE SUGGESTED THAT TREASURY WAS GOING TO BE PLAYING A ROLE IN ASSESSING THE TAX CODE AND LOOKING AT RISK WAITING. I THOUGHT THAT WAS A REALLY INTERESTING HINT. I'M VERY INTERESTED TO SEE WHAT TREASURY DOES WORKING WITH THE OCC AND IRS AND WHAT THE SECRETARY HAD PROMISED WAS LOOKING AT APPLICABLE REGULATIONS AND AMENDING OR RESCINDING AS NECESSARY. I'M INTERESTED IN SEEING
WHETHER HE IS LIMITING THOSE COMMENTS JUST TO THE STRATEGIC RESERVE OR WHETHER HE WAS SUGGESTING SOMETHING BROADER AND THERE IS MORE TO COME. CAROLINE: YOU SERVED WITH THE SECRETARY DEPARTMENT, SO YOU ARE SOMEONE WHO SHOULD KNOW ABOUT THESE TAX PERSPECTIVES. THANK YOU FOR HOLDING ON FOR THIS MOMENT. I'M INTERESTED IN WHAT IT MEANS IN TERMS OF THE FUTURE OF ON RAMPS. WE TALKED ABOUT STABLECOINS
GETTING REGULATORY CLARITY. THAT IS SOMETHING INVESTORS WANT , NOT JUST FLAT -- NOT JUST TAX CLARITY TOO. STACEY: THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT. THERE ARE CALLS FOR CLARITY ACROSS THE BOARD.
THOSE ARE LARGELY IN CONGRESS'S PURVIEW. THIS WEEK IN CONGRESS IF WE CAN TAKE A QUICK SHIFT TO LOOK AT WHAT IS GOING ON ON THE OTHER SIDE OF PENNSYLVANIA AVENUE, THIS WEEK, WE WILL HAVE ACTION ON STABLECOINS AND ON INFORMATION REPORTING AND TAXES. WE ARE GOING TO SEE IT IS A VERY BUSY WEEK IN THESE AREAS, BOTH COMING OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE, REACTIONS TO THAT, AND ACTUAL POLICYMAKING ON THE HILL.
>> DIMENSION CONGRESS WILL HAVE TO BE INVOLVED. WHAT KIND OF BIPARTISANSHIP DO WE SEE AROUND CRYPTO? STACEY: INCREASING. I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT FOR PEOPLE TO REALIZE, ESPECIALLY IN THE WORK THAT I DO, THAT EVERY CONGRESS IS DIFFERENT. LAST YEAR, WE DID SEE A SHIFT OVER THE YEARS FOR THIS ISSUE TO BE INCREASINGLY PARTISAN. AND A LOT OF THAT WAS LARGELY TO DO WITH THE POLITICAL REALITIES. YOU HAVE THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION SIGNALING SKEPTICISM. SOME WOULD SAY HOSTILITY TO
SOME AREAS OF DIGITAL ASSETS. AND HEADING INTO A CONTENTIOUS ELECTION YEAR, DEMOCRATS WERE GOING TO DIFFER TO THEIR PARTY LEADER. NOW, POLITICAL LENSES HAVE SHIFTED. WE HAVE A REPUBLICAN-CONTROLLED CONGRESS, POLICYMAKING WILL BE HAPPENING IN THIS SPACE. THAT MIDDLE, THAT OPPORTUNITY
FOR BIPARTISANSHIP IS MUCH BROADER THAN IT EVER HAS BEEN. >> THAT IS STACY -- THAT IS STACEY ROLLAND OF 01 STRATEGIES ARE THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. SOFTBANK ACT THEY'VE SAYS IT IS NEARING A COMMERCIAL DEBUT FOR ITS DRIVER ASSISTANCE SYSTEM IN THE U.S. AND GERMANY. MORE ON THAT NEXT. CAROLINE: JUST KEEP AN EYE ON WHAT IS HAPPENING IN THE PUBLIC MARKETS.
WE ARE OFF BY 3.25% ON THE NASDAQ 100. ITS WORST DAY SINCE TO SUMMER 18TH. ITS LOWEST LEVEL SINCE SEPTEMBER OF LAST YEAR.
WE ARE SEEING IT IS ALL THE MAC SEVEN, TESLA, META, AMAZON CODA -- AMAZON, GOOGLE, ALL DRAGGING THIS LOWER. CAROLINE: TIME NOW FOR TALKING TECH. SHARES OF REDFIN SURGING TODAY. THEY ANNOUNCED A DEAL TO BUY THE REAL ESTATE LISTING SITE, PAYING $12.5 A SHARE AND AN ALL
STOCK TRANSACTION. THE CEO JOINED BLOOMBERG AND HAD THIS TO SAY ABOUT THE DEAL. >> WE ARE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS DEAL. TWO OF THE BIGGEST GROWTH OPPORTUNITIES FOR ROCKET WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT ARE REALLY GROWING IN PURCHASE AND AI.
BY BRINGING TOGETHER THE LEADING HOME SEARCH WEBSITE WITH THE LEADING MORTGAGE FINANCE COMPANY, WE EXPECT TO ACCOMPLISH >> FOR MORE, DANA WOLLMAN JOINS US. AUTONOMOUS VEHICLES ARE HAVING A MOMENT HERE. HOW DOES WAVE STACK UP TO WHAT IS ALREADY ON THE MARKET AND WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR? >> FOR LISTENERS WHO ARE UNAWARE, WAVE IS NOT A CONSUMER FACING PRODUCT. IT SPECIALIZES IN AUTONOMOUS
DRIVING SOFTWARE. IT IS AI POWERED AND THAT SOFTWARE GOES INTO VARIOUS AUTOMAKERS VEHICLES. IT MAY NOT EVEN BE BRAIDED AS WAYVE IN FRONT OF CONSUMERS. IT IS NOT SOMETHING CONSUMERS CAN PURCHASE BUT IT MAY BE SOMETHING THEY EXPERIENCE DEPENDING ON WHAT CAR MODEL THEY PURCHASE IN THE COMING YEARS. CAROLINE:SO THE COMPETITIVE THREAT IS TO TESLA, TO AUTOMATED -- OFFERINGS WE ARE ABOUT TO BE CONSUMING.
>> WHAT I FOUND FASCINATING ABOUT THE SPACE IS THERE ARE A LOT OF FREM NEMIES. A PARTNER CAN ALSO BE A COMPETITOR. THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN UBER AND WAYMO IS FASCINATING IN THAT REGARD. >> WHAT DOES THIS MEAN FOR THE MARKET IN THE UNITED STATES. DOES IT MEAN IT IS GETTING CROWDED WHEN IT COMES TO WHO IS OUT THERE? ONE THING YOU MENTION IS IT CAN ADAPT TO U.S. DRIVING BEHAVIORS. ARE WE JUST BAD DRIVERS HERE?
>> THAT STRUCK ME AS INTERESTING, ALONGSIDE US PROVIDING NEWS ABOUT THE COMPANY TIMELINE AND A VAGUE TIMELINE. THE COMPANY PUT OUT DATA TODAY SUGGESTING IT HAS A NEWER AND MORE EFFICIENT APPROACH TO ADAPTING ITS ALGORITHMS AND AI MODELS TO BASICALLY U.S. SIGNAGE AND ROAD RULES.
THIS HAS BEEN FASCINATING. IT IS SOMETHING THE NVIDIA CEO BROUGHT UP AT THE COMPANY KEYNOTE AND IN THAT KEYNOTE HE TALKED ABOUT HOW DIFFICULT IT IS FOR COMPANIES TO MAP LOCAL ROADS SAFELY AND EFFICIENTLY AT THE SAME TIME WITHOUT IT TURNING INTO THIS COST BALLOON. GIVEN THAT CONTEXT, IT WAS INTERESTING THE WAY IT CAME OUT AND THEY WERE TRAINED IN EUROPE BUT WE CAN REALLY ADAPT THEM QUICKLY AND EASILY TO THE UNIQUENESS OF U.S. ROADS. >> NO COMMENT ON U.S. VERSUS EUROPEAN DRIVING. >> COMING UP, THE CEO OF REFLECTION TALKS ABOUT BUILDING RELIABLE SUPER INTELLIGENCE. WE LOOK AT THE AI TRADE >> WELCOME BACK TO BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY.
WE CHECK IN WITH THESE MARKETS THAT ARE IN SELL OF AGAIN. WE ARE QUESTIONING VALUATIONS OF THE AI TRADE. NASDAQ 100 IS BOUNCING OFF OF LOWS BUT NEVERTHELESS UNDERWATER. AT ONE POINT, BITCOIN WAS SUB
$80,000. WE ARE STILL HIGHER THAN THE DAY OF THE U.S. ELECTION. WE ARE TRADING AT THE LOWEST LEVEL ON THE NASDAQ 100 SINCE LAST YEAR. IT IS THE WORST ON THE MARKET SINCE DECEMBER OF LAST YEAR. WE ARE DRIVING LOWER INTERNS -- TERMS OF POINT PERSPECTIVE THERE THERE ARE ZERO CELL RATINGS ON A NUMBER OF THESE NAMES. MICROSOFT, ZERO CELL RATINGS, BUT STILL WE GO LOWER AS WE CANNOT FATHOM WHEN PEOPLE START TO BUY THE DIP. TESLA IS DRAGGING US THE MOST.
WE WORRY ABOUT A FUTURE OF AI. BUT MICROSOFT AND ALL THESE NAMES ARE IN THE RED BUT THERE IS MORE NEWS WHEN IT COMES TO MICROSOFT. >> MICROSOFT CREATED ITS OWN IN-HOUSE AI MODELS IT THINKS CAN GO TOE TO TOE WITH INDUSTRY RIVALS LIKE OPENAI. ACCORDING TO SOURCES, MICROSOFT HAS BEEN DEVELOPING A FAMILY OF MODELS TO PERFORM A VARIETY OF TASKS.
MICROSOFT HAS POURED BILLIONS OF DOLLARS INTO OPENAI. WHY IS IT DEVELOPING ITS OWN MODELS NOW? >> MICROSOFT ONCE A HEDGE AT SOME POINT. THEIR AGREEMENT WITH OPENAI ONLY RUNS THROUGH 2030. THAT COULD BE EXTENDED, BUT AT SOME POINT MICROSOFT WILL NEED TO SHOULDER THE BURDEN FOR ITS OWN AI SERVICES. THE COMPANY BELIEVES AI IS THE FUTURE. EVEN THOUGH THEY HAVE BEEN PARTNERING WITH OPENAI, EVERY TIME THEY OPEN THEIR MOUTHS ON THE SUBJECT THEY ARE STILL WORKING ON THEIR OWN.
>> WE WERE TALKING ABOUT FRENEMY'S. ARE THEY COMPETITORS OR PARTNERS? >> BOTH. MICROSOFT SINGS THEIR PRAISES ANY TIME THEY CAN, BUT THEY ARE ALSO REALISTIC ABOUT IT.
THEY HAVE WORKED ON A SMALLER SET OF LANGUAGE MODELS, DESIGNED TO BE SMALLER THAN CHATGPT, BUT I THINK BOTH PARTIES ARE REALISTIC THAT THEY ARE GOING TO WORK TOGETHER BUT ALSO BUILD THEIR OWN. >> OPENAI TECHNOLOGY UNDERPINS A LOT OF EXISTING TECHNOLOGY THAT MICROSOFT IS ALREADY SOLD TO ENTERPRISE CUSTOMERS. DOES THIS RISK SPOOKING THAT BASE? >> IT MIGHT, BUT WE ARE EARLY ON THAT. MICROSOFT HAS ONLY JUST STARTED TESTING WHETHER THEY COULD USE THEIR OWN MODELS.
WHICH WAS MICROSOFT'S MAIN GO TO FOR ITS USER BASE. WE ARE EARLY FOR THAT. RIGHT NOW, MICROSOFT WILL TELL FOLKS WE STILL USE OPENAI. THAT IS THE INDUSTRY STANDARD, THE STATE-OF-THE-ART.
>> LET'S TALK ABOUT MORE ON THE GENERATIVE AI SPACE. A START UP FROM TWO FORMER RESEARCHERS HAS RAISED $130 BILLION FOR A NEW COMPANY TO CREATE AI POWERED SUPER INTELLIGENCE. THE COFOUNDER AND CEO OF REFLECTION AI JOINS US NOW. THIS IS AROUND CODING AND THE FACT THAT CODING CAN BE DONE BETTER THAN A HUMAN AND NOT JUST AS SOME SORT OF COPILOT BUT ACTUALLY GOING OFF AND BUILDING THE CODE ITSELF. MISHA: THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME. TO TAKE A STEP BACK, WE ARE A TEAM OF RESEARCHERS AND ENGINEERS FROM FORMERLY FRONT TIER LABS WERE WE CONTRIBUTED TO SOME OF THE BIGGEST BREAKTHROUGHS IN AI OVER THE LAST DECADE. THE MISSION OF THE COMPANIES TO BUILD SUPER INTELLIGENCE AND WHAT WE BELIEVE THE STARTING POINT IS IS WHAT YOU SAID, BUILDING INCREDIBLY RELIABLE AUTONOMOUS CODING SYSTEMS SO THAT IS WHAT WE ARE FOCUSED ON.
>> WHY DID YOU HAVE TO SET UP YOUR OWN COMPANY? >> IT IS IMPORTANT TO BE CLOSELY COUPLED TO PRODUCT AND CUSTOMERS. THE ONLY EVAL THAT REALLY MATTERS IS THE REAL WORLD. WE FELT BY BEING CLOSE TO CUSTOMERS WE WOULD SEE THROUGH THE MISSION BETTER. >> WHEN I THINK ABOUT CODING ASSISTANCE, I THINK ABOUT MICROSOFT, EXTREMELY POPULAR AMONG THE CODING COMMUNITY AND I'M CURIOUS WHAT KIND OF REACTION YOU HAVE SEEN FROM YOUR CUSTOMER BASE WITH THE NOTION THAT YOU WANT YOUR TOOL TO BE ABLE TO DO IT ON ITS OWN VERSUS HAVE THIS HUMAN INTERVENTION ALONGSIDE IT. MISHA: THAT IS A GOOD QUESTION.
WE HAVE FOUND THE TOOL INTERNALLY AND THE WAY OUR CUSTOMERS USE IT IS EMPOWERING BECAUSE IT ALLOWS ENGINEERS TO FOCUS ON THE STUFF THAT IS HIGH-PRIORITY AND THEY WANT TO WORK ON AND WE KIND OF TAKE THE TEDIOUS WORK OFF THEIR PLATES, SO WE THINK OF EVOLVING OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS AND BECOMING BASICALLY AN ARCHITECT THAT HAS AN ARMY OF THESE AI ENGINEERS HELPING THEM SEE THEIR VISIONS THROUGH. >> WHEN I HEAR SUPER INTELLIGENCE, I REMEMBER A LOT OF THE EXISTENTIAL CONCERNS COMING UP AT THE BEGINNING OF CHATGPT TAKING THE WORLD BY STORM. LAST YEAR, WE SAW A WAVE OF AI SAFETY FOCUSED RESEARCHERS LEAVING OPENAI. I'M CURIOUS HOW YOU ARE GOING ABOUT THE SAFETY CONVERSATION. MISHA:
THAT IS ALSO A GOOD QUESTION. SAFETY IS ONE OF THE THINGS WE CARE ABOUT A LOT. A LOT OF THE WORK AND SAFETY IS TRACED BACK TO REINFORCEMENT LEARNING FROM HUMAN FEEDBACK, WHICH IS WHAT OUR TEAM LEAD AT GEMINI. WE THINK ABOUT SAFETY FROM A PRACTICAL PERSPECTIVE. WE BELIEVE SUPER INTELLIGENCE CANNOT BE BUILT IN A VACUUM, SO IT IS IMPORTANT THAT YOU ITERATE WITH CUSTOMERS AND USERS AND MAKE SURE SYSTEMS ARE ALIGNED FROM DAY ONE THAT THEIR NEEDS AND ARE PUT ON THE RIGHT GUARDRAILS. CAROLINE:
MANY ARE WORRIED ABOUT WHETHER THIS DISRUPTS THE LABOR FORCE. YOU ARE SAYING YOU WILL JUST FREE UP ENGINEERS TO DO MORE BUT WHAT TALENT DO YOU NEED NOW AND IN THE LONGER-TERM WILL YOU NEED AS MUCH TALENT? >> THE CHALLENGING THING TODAY AND IN THE FUTURE IS HOW TO ASK THE RIGHT QUESTIONS AND DESIGN SYSTEMS SO THAT YOUR AI ENGINEERS DO THE WORK FOR YOU. TODAY, A LOT OF THE TALENT IS AROUND RESEARCH AND DISTRIBUTED SYSTEMS ENGINEERING AND COMPLEX ENGINEERING TASKS. AI ENGINEERS MIGHT HELP OFFLOAD SOME OF THAT IN THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE, BUT I THINK ASKING THE RIGHT QUESTIONS WILL STILL BE A VALUABLE SKILL. CAROLINE: IT IS QUITE BUSY IN THE WORLD OF GENERATIVE AI CODING ASSISTANCE. THE LATEST WAS A $10 MILLION VALUATION. WITH INK ABOUT POOLSIDE.
HOW ARE YOU THINKING ABOUT STANDING OUT FROM THE CROWD AND CONTINUING TO RAISE SIGNIFICANT AMOUNTS OF PRIVATE MONEY? MISHA: WHAT WE ARE BUILDING IS DIFFERENT FROM THE EXISTING SUITE OF CODING PRODUCTS TODAY. WE THINK ABOUT EXISTING CODING PRODUCTS IT IS AKIN TO CRUISE CONTROL FOR ENGINEERS. THIS IS USEFUL, BUT THE ENGINEER STILL DOES MOST OF THE DRIVING. WE ARE BUILDING SYSTEMS THAT ARE FUNDAMENTALLY AUTONOMOUS FROM DAY ONE.
YOU GIVE THEM THE TASK AND THEY TAKE YOU FROM POINT A TO POINT B. TO DO THAT YOU NEED TO DRIVE FUNDAMENTAL BREAKTHROUGHS IN INTELLIGENCE AND THAT IS WHAT OUR TEAM IS FOCUSED ON. >> THAT IS THE CEO OF REFLECTION AI. COMING UP, THE FUTURE OF SOCIAL COMMERCE. >> WE CHECK BACK IN ON PUBLIC MARKETS. WE ARE OFF OF OUR LOWS, DOWN BY 2.6%, NOT AS MUCH AS WE SAW BUT
STILL THE WORST DAY SINCE DECEMBER OF LAST YEAR. STAY WITH US. THIS IS BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY. ♪ VENTURE INVESTING IS ON TRACK TO BE AT ITS HIGHEST LEVEL SINCE 2021. MUCH OF THAT FUNDING IS GOING
TO START UP POWER HOUSES, OPENAI AND ANDREW -- ANDURIL. THREE FUNDS, GENERALISTS GENERAL EARLY STAGE. >> THERE'S SO MUCH HAPPENING WITH AI LARGE AND I THINK IT HIT SO MANY VERTICALS. WE ARE VERY THESIS DRIVEN. WE HAVE HAD A THREE-YEAR THESIS WE HAVE BEEN THOUGHTFULLY EXECUTING SO THAT IS HOW WE LIKE TO DO OUR WORK. CAROLINE: WHEN YOU ARE THINKING ABOUT A THESIS SUCH AS SOCIAL COMMERCE, THAT IS HOW AI CAN INTERWEAVE WITH SOCIAL EXPERIENCE. >> AND OUR POINT OF VIEW, YOU WILL HAVE THE HUGE PERPLEXITIES OF THE WORLD BUT THERE WILL BE AN AI APPLICATION LAYER ABOVE THAT. FOR EXAMPLE, A COMPANY THAT
GETS TO KNOW YOU EXACTLY, HOW ANY CHILDREN YOU HAVE, AND SERVES THEM UP FOR YOU. IT TAKES DISCOVERY FROM GOING TO GOOGLE AND HUNTING FOR THAT BIRTHDAY PRODUCT, IT ALERTED ME HERE ARE PRODUCTS YOU SHOULD THINK ABOUT BUYING AND SHOULD WE BUY THEM? VERY CUSTOMIZED AI BASED ON WHO YOU ARE AND THEN RECOMMENDING PRODUCTS. >> WHAT HAVE YOU SEEN FROM CONSUMER BEHAVIOR STUDIES? DO PEOPLE ACTUALLY LIKE THAT? WHEN I THINK ABOUT SEEING A LOT THESE TARGETED ADS, THE FIRST THING THAT GOES THROUGH MY MIND IS HOW DO THEY KNOW THIS? AM I GIVING THEM PERMISSION TO SCRAPE WHATEVER DATA TO GIVE ME THIS WONDERFUL RECOMMENDATION FOR SHOES OR WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE? WHAT ARE WE SEEING FROM THE CONSUMER SIDE OF THINGS? >> FOR EXAMPLE, DUCK BILL IS A PLATFORM YOU GIVE INFORMATION TO SO IT IS ALL STUFF YOU HAVE DOWNLOADED IN TERMS OF YOUR BUDGET AND WHAT YOU LIKE TO SPEND AND WHERE YOU LIKE TO BUY FLOWERS FROM AND THEN FROM THERE RECOMMENDATIONS KEEP GETTING BETTER BASED ON AI INFRASTRUCTURE OF THINGS YOU HAVE ALLOWED. THAT IS ALL OPT IN AND INCREDIBLY SIMPLE AT MAKING YOUR LIFE BETTER IN TERMS OF EXECUTING ON PRODUCTS.
>> WHEN IT COMES TO WHERE HUMANS ARE LEFT IN THIS SOCIAL COMMERCE THESIS, WHEN I GO ON TIKTOK I LOVE SEEING PRODUCT RECOMMENDATIONS. WHETHER OR NOT THEY ARE SPONSORED BY A HUMAN -- HOW DOES THIS FIT INTO HOW YOU ARE LOOKING FOR COMPANIES IN THIS SPACE? >> ON THE OTHER END OF THE SPECTRUM WHERE AN AI BRAIN IS RECOMMENDING A PRODUCT TO YOU, AND THE LAST FEW YEARS AI CONTENT HAS EXPLODED 10,000% ONLINE. VIDEO SCOTT WRITTEN CONTENT, ETC. THE PENDULUM IS GOING TO SWING BACK TO REALLY TRUSTING BRANDS AND PRODUCTS AND PEOPLE THAT YOU KNOW SO WE BACKED A COMPANY THAT JUST ANNOUNCED A $78 BILLION SERIES B. IT IS A PLATFORM WHERE YOU CAN GO ONLINE AND FOLLOW THE EXACT PEOPLE, YOUR BEST FRIENDS, PEOPLE IN YOUR SPHERE OR INFLUENCERS OR CONTENT CREATORS YOU TRUST, THE ENTHUSIASTS YOU LOVE, AND THEN BUY PRODUCTS DIRECTLY FROM THERE RECOMMENDATIONS. THAT SHRINK THE INTERNET DOWN
TO JUST THE PEOPLE YOU WANT TO FOLLOW THE THINGS YOU ARE INTERESTED IN SO GOOGLE NO LONGER BEING YOUR FRONT DOOR -- IT WILL BE YOUR AI APPLICATION LAYER AND IT WILL BE A COMPANY WHERE YOU ARE JUST BUYING FROM THE PEOPLE YOU LOVE AND TRUST. WHICH IS HOW I BUY OFF-LINE AND NOW IT IS COMING ONLINE. CAROLINE: WHAT ABOUT IF YOU ARE A CREATIVE WHO CANNOT FIND EXACTLY WHAT YOU WANT AND YOU WANT TO MAKE IT AND YOU ARE BACK IN COMPANIES THAT ALMOST GET RID OF THE BRAND ENTIRELY? WE ARE ALL GOING TO BE OUR OWN CREATORS IN SOME WAY. >> ON THE FAR OUT THEIR IDEAS OF OUR THESIS, THE IDEA THAT WE NO LONGER BECAUSE OF GENERATIVE AI -- LET'S PRETEND WE ARE BUYING A WHITE COFFEE TABLE. YOU WOULD TAKE A PHOTO OR START HUNTING ON GOOGLE. MAYBE YOU END UP AT ETSY AND PERFECTED AND BY IT AND IT IS SO MUCH WORK.
THERE IS A COMPANY CALLED ARCATA AI WHERE IF YOU CAN IMAGINE IT YOU CAN MAKE IT. WHAT IT ALLOWS YOU TO DO IS RIGHT IN MARBLE COFFEE TABLE, THREE LEGS, AND DISTRUST TO SHOW IT AND YOU CAN TWEAK THE PICTURE THE WAY YOU WANT. THEN IT SHOWS YOU THE PLACES YOU COULD BUY EXACTLY THAT TABLE BY CONNECTING YOU DIRECTLY TO MAKERS. THAT TURNS ALL OF US EVERYDAY PEOPLE INTO EXPERT CREATORS WERE YOU CAN MANUFACTURE THEIR OWN PRODUCTS, WHICH IS A MORE OUT THERE EDGE OF THE SPECTRUM BUT A BIG IDEA. CAROLINE: YOU ARE ALSO AN EXPERT FOUNDER YOURSELF.
I CAN IMAGINE AT THIS MOMENT WHEN YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT A COMPANY THAT IS BUILDING AROUND A GLOBAL NARRATIVE OF BUILDING GROWN PRODUCTS, YOU HAVE WHAT DO I DO IN THIS SCENARIO? WE HAVE NO CONSISTENCY FROM A GOVERNMENT LEVEL. HOW MANY CALLS DO YOU FIELD FROM FOUNDERS? >> WE OFTEN SEE 50 COMPANIES A WEEK. WE ARE IN A TECTONIC SHIFT AS YOU THINK ABOUT INNOVATION CURVES. WE ARE AT THE EDGE OF THE
BEGINNING OF A NEW INNOVATION CURVE MORE SEISMIC THAN WE HAVE SEEN IN THE LAST 20 YEARS, SO BEING THOUGHTFUL AND PRECISE ABOUT WHERE THE WORLD IS HEADED AND WHERE WE BELIEVE THE WORLD IS HEADED AND HOW YOU MAKE THOSE BETS AND THAT ADVICE WE GIVE TO ALL OUR FOUNDERS AS WELL. >> WHEN I THINK ABOUT SHOPPING, IT IS INTERESTING YOUR COMPANIES ARE A SOFTWARE LAYER. YOU CANNOT SEE IT, BUT IT IS THERE. THESE ARE PRODUCTS THAT HAVE TO ARRIVE AT A DOORSTEP TO KINDA FINISH OFF THE CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE. WE ARE SEEING A LOT OF VOLATILITY WHEN IT COMES TO THOSE WITH EXPOSURE TO MANUFACTURING AND TARIFF CONCERNS. ARE ANY OF YOUR COMPANY'S
GRAPPLING WITH THOSE FEARS NOW? >> AS YOU THINK ABOUT TARIFFS AND WHAT THAT WILL LOOK LIKE AND PRODUCTS BEING MANUFACTURED OUTSIDE THE COUNTRY, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THOSE FOUNDERS IS ASKING. MY COFOUNDER AND BUSINESS PARTNER ADJUSTED CONTENT ON TARIFFS AND HOW PEOPLE THINK ABOUT THEM, BUT I THINK PREPARING PEOPLE FOR THE WORST OF WHAT THEY SHOULD BE PREPARED FOR IS HOW WE OPERATE AND ALWAYS PROVIDING THAT MACRO LENS IS CRITICAL AS PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY EXECUTING IN THE DAY TODAY. CAROLINE: I GO BACK TO WHERE WE STARTED. VC IS HAVING A NICE YEAR IN THE GENERATIVE AI SPACE. YOU MENTIONED COMPANIES GETTING BIG FOLLOW ON FUNDING. IS THAT THE ENVIRONMENT YOU ARE
SEEING >> NOW? I DO NOT THINK IT IS TYPICAL. YOU ARE SEEING COMPANIES THAT HAVE COMPELLING IDEAS. I THINK YOU ARE SEEING COMPANIES THAT ARE WORKING AND DOLLARS ARE THERE AND THEN COMPANIES THAT ARE NOT WORKING IS VERY DRY, SO IT IS A TALE OF THE HAVES AND HAVE-NOTS. THINGS AT THE FOREFRONT OF AI, THE CAPITAL IS NOT ONLY THERE, MANY FUNDS ARE THERE AT THE SAME TIME VERY QUICKLY, SO WHEN TRACTION HAS PROVEN OUT THAT IS WHEN YOU ARE SEEING CAPITAL. >> COMING UP, PRESIDENT TRUMP SAYS THERE ARE FOUR OFFERS ON THE TABLE TO BUY THE U.S. ARM OF TIKTOK.
MEANWHILE, A QUICK LOOK AT PUBLIC MARKETS, OFF BY 5% ON APPLE. WE ARE SEEING IN VIDEO LOWER AND TALKING DOWN THE NASDAQ, >> IS>> THERE GOING TO BE A DEAL ON TIKTOK SOON? >> THERE COULD BE. WE ARE DEALING WITH FOUR DIFFERENT GROUPS, SO THERE COULD BE. CAROLINE: PRESIDENT TRUMP SPEAKING ABOUT EFFORTS TO FIND A BUYER FOR TIKTOK'S U.S. BUSINESS. THE CLOCK IS TICKING. IT IS APRIL 5. ARE WE GOING TO HAVE TO EXTEND? >> IT IS POSSIBLE. THAT COMMENT FROM PRESIDENT
TRUMP WAS MORE OPTIMISTIC THAN THINGS WE HAVE BEEN HEARING BEHIND THE SCENES. IT FEELS LIKE THINGS SORT OF HAVE STALLED. A LOT OF POTENTIAL BETTORS HAVE -- BIDDERS HAVE MADE OUTREACH BUT NOT GOTTEN ANYTHING IN RETURN. THIS IDEA THERE MIGHT BE FOUR
POSSIBLE GROUPS IN THE MIX MAKES IT SOUND MORE OPTIMISTIC AGAIN THAN I WAS FEELING IT WAS 48 HOURS AGO. >> WE HAVE SPOKEN ON THE SHOW PLENTY OF TIMES AND WE HAVE SPOKEN TO SOMEONE WHO MIGHT BE PAIRING UP WITH MR. BEAST BUT CERTAINLY HAS OTHER KEY FOUNDERS ALONGSIDE HIM. WHO ARE THESE FOUR? KURT: PRESIDENT TRUMP DID NOT NAME THE FOUR, SO WE KNOW OF THREE GROUPS THAT HAVE COME OUT PUBLICLY. PERPLEXITY AI HAS SUPPOSEDLY MADE SOME TYPE OF BID FOR TIKTOK AS WELL, SO THOSE THREE HAVE BEEN PUBLIC BUT WE HAVE ALSO HEARD PRESIDENT TRUMP THROW HIS OWN NAMES OUT THERE LARRY ELLISON, ELON MUSK WITH HIS STABLE OF BUSINESSES, SO WE DO NOT KNOW WHO HE IS TALKING ABOUT. BUT THE NUMBERS DO NOT ADD UP. HE SAYS FOUR.
WE KNOW OF THREE, SO SUPPOSEDLY THERE ARE MYSTERY NAMES STILL OUT THERE. >> THE NUMBERS ARE A MYSTERY AS WELL. IS IT WORTH UP TO $50 BILLION IF THEY DO NOT GET THE UNDERLYING ALGORITHMS? >> WHAT MAKES THIS COMPLICATED IS THE RANGE OF PRICES. PROJECT LIBERTY BID $25 BILLION AND ANOTHER GROUP WAS SAYING $20 BILLION. WE HAVE HEARD NUMBERS AS HIGH AS 50 AND IT DEPENDS ON WHAT IS INCLUDED IN A DEAL. DOES IT INCLUDE THE UNDERLYING ALGORITHM? DOES IT INCLUDE THE BRAND USER BASE? WHAT ROLE DOES THE U.S.
GOVERNMENT HAVE? PRESIDENT TRUMP HAS TALKED ABOUT THE U.S. TAKING 50% OF THIS, SO THAT HAS TO FACTOR IN. SO THIS IS NOT TRADITIONAL SO THAT IS WHAT MAKES EVEN BASIC NUMBERS HERE OR RANGES HARD TO PREDICT. >> WHAT IS UNPRECEDENTED IS THE IDEA THAT THE PRESIDENT HIMSELF HAS THE TIME OR BANNED WITH TO NEGOTIATE THIS BUT IT IS A GEOPOLITICAL CONTEXT BECAUSE CHINA GETS RIGHT OF REPLY IN ALL OF THIS. >> I POINT OUT TWO THINGS. IT FEELS LIKE VICE PRESIDENT VANCE HAS TAKEN ON SOME RESPONSIBILITY BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT'S RESUME OBLATE BUSY SO HE HAS PASSED SOME OF THIS OFF TO HIM. THE OTHER THING THAT HAS NOT
BEEN MENTIONED IS JUST BECAUSE PRESIDENT TRUMP WANTS A DEAL DONE DOES NOT MEAN A DEAL IS GOING TO GET DONE. BYTEDANCE HAS TO AGREE AND PUTTING MUCH THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT HAS TO AGREE TO ANY TYPE OF DEAL, SO HE IS REALLY REPRESENTING JUST ONE SIDE OF THE EQUATION. SO I THINK WHEN YOU FACTOR THOSE THINGS IN, THERE ARE FOUR PEOPLE BIDDING AND I HAVE CONTROL OVER THIS, THOSE COMMENTS ARE LACKING SOME MAJOR CONTEXT AROUND THE FACT THAT HE IS NOT THE ONLY ONE WHO GETS TO DECIDE HERE. CAROLINE: THE CLOCK IS TICKING. THANKS FOR THE UPDATE.
MEANWHILE, WE TAKE YOU BACK TO PUBLIC MARKETS. THE MAGNIFICENT SEVEN IS HAVING AN UGLY DAY, UP BY 4.5%. LOOK AT THE EARNINGS COMING UP. THIS DOES OVER THE SEA DISH IN
OF BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY. DO NOT WANT TO MISS OUT ON ORACLE NUMBERS AFTER THE CLOSE TODAY. WE ALSO TALK ABOUT AI IN LAS VEGAS.
2025-03-15 21:41
