Do Transmissions Ever Need to be Serviced?; Inflation Reduction Act and EV/Hybrid Tax Credits
[Music] hi and welcome back I'm Mike Quincy I'm Mike Monticello and I'm John linkove so back by popular demand or maybe not popular demand but it doesn't really matter we're gonna do an all questions episode we love getting your questions here at Consumer Reports talking cars podcasts keep them coming text 30 second videos send them all to talking cars at icloud.com that's talking cars at icloud.com and we're going to get right into it we have a question first up this is from Believe It or Not Another Michael Michael writes I need a new car after my Subaru Outback was totaled in a crash with a deer I'd settled on a Hyundai Tucson plug-in hybrid as a replacement but now with the inflation reduction act it seems I won't be getting the 7 500 tax credit which is essential to making this vehicle affordable for me so what mid-size SUV would you recommend that is fuel efficient and would qualify for the tax credit I considered the Ford Escape but it's rated poorly help so you know fuel efficient good test scores hey you know they're obviously Consumer Reports fans uh I'm guessing you know around forty thousand dollars something like that but before we give uh the picks to Michael John maybe you can fill us in and fill our audience in on exactly what is the inflation reduction Act yeah so there the inflation reduction Act was a big tax package um the spending Bill tax package but as part of it there's new rules on the vehicles that can uh that do and and will qualify do now will qualify in the future for the federal tax credits for uh alternative fuel vehicles so it get a got a certain amount of money depending on the size of the battery and once a manufacturer sold 200 000 units of uh or any any combination of the vehicles then the credits would phase out over the next two quarters and the credit would drop down by by a quarter the the new inflation reduction act changes that um the credits would be based on where the vehicle is manufactured where the batteries are sourced from as well uh it'll take away the 200 000 vehicle cap however it also takes away the credit eligibility for expensive EVs and plug-in hybrids so the Hummer the new GM Hummer won't be uh won't qualify Lucid air uh EVS won't qualify Tesla Model S and X won't qualify again at the same time it also will offer four thousand dollar tax credit a one-time tax credit for someone who buys a used EV there's a lot going on it's short that was easy to follow yeah I mean you know and it's and the the issues you have going on are that there's a lot of well you know what vehicles if you had an order in for a vehicle prior to the ACT being signed then it was okay if you wanted to get the vehicle after the Act was signed all of a sudden that qualified vehicle went away like case in point with Michael's uh Hyundai Tucson plug-in hybrid a couple other things to think about is that as a tax credit this is the only way it really affects the buying price is that if you're leasing the vehicle so your leasing circle is getting the money back right then is what you're saying it's not like they just give you 7 500 bucks or 7 500 bucks off the price that is not at all how it works and there's no guarantee right John that you're for if say you're buying it said at least that you're going to actually see the full benefit of that 7 500 you're going to want to talk to your accountant because it's actually not only is that confusing but of course what you are just the the whole inflation reduction act itself is crazy confusing it it totally is and you're and you're right I mean if you're leasing the vehicle and the manufacturer takes or the dealer takes the 7 500 that you would qualify for off of the sales price when they're figuring it out what you're going to pay for the leased vehicle great that's because the dealership and the automaker will end up getting the 7500 credit if you're buying it it's not like you're getting a check it's not like you're getting a discount only if you owe up to 7 500 or more on your taxes as a federal tax payment will you then get a credit that will wipe that out so in no way you're getting cash money in your pocket so to speak you know I'll stop there we you know with the the lesson on the tax credit so we could go forward you know Mike it's almost like like John knows someone that knows a lot about accounting and taxes and stuff like that right yeah like maybe his wife right and and even this is baffling I think on her end it's it's so crazy yeah I was gonna say if if John is slightly baffled and his wife is maybe a little bit baffled by all this this tax credit stuff I mean how are you and I gonna handle this coins we got no shot right it's so I I mean Mike you you've heard you've heard the scenario you know what advice do you have for you know the fellow Michaels out there I think that first of all just you know Michael mentions that he's looking for a mid-sized SUV just to clarify the Tucson is actually us we would consider a small SUV so that's the way Consumer Reports so I think he can broaden his range you know don't just be focused on what would be classified as a mid-sized SUV is actually looking at the smallest if you also want to classified in the Ford Escape he's right that it's rated poorly but you have to look closer at how it's rated poorly it's rated poorly by Consumer Reports I don't want to know if it's rated poorly but it's not recommended because of its below average reliability not well below our average reliability but below average reliability we actually liked quite quite a lot about the Ford Escape Hybrid in fact if you look at uh of the 20 small SUVs that are rated above it uh only five actually have better road test scores and the road test scores folks are kind of give you an example of what the vehicle really is like to drive what it's like to live with on a daily basis so of those 20 small SUVs that are rated higher than it five have better road test scores and it's tied with two others but let's just say you don't want that I could really only come up with 2023 Chevrolet bolt euv that is within the price range right it's not a plug-in hybrid it's a pure EV so these are for distance and thank you for clarifying that and so honestly if it were me I would say because there's no guarantee I just go with a reasonably fuel efficient small or mid-sized hybrid which are going to get like 35 37 miles per gallon overall something like you know a Hyundai Tucson or you know uh which 100 Tucson hybrid the non-plug-in that's what I would probably go with right I just kind of went off the rails on this one I just I said no yeah I think I think Michael should get a Ford Broncos sport so I thought at least I'm sort of in the ballpark I feel like I'm back in school I get partial credit here Michael uh check back with us let us know what you finally decided because I'm at the edge of my seat next up let's move on here next up is Daniel I recently had my 80 000 mile 2016 Mazda 6 serviced when the shop tried to tack on a 200 transmission fluid service because the fluid was dirty I immediately became suspicious I've heard of these types of scams and sure enough transmission fluid isn't even a listed item on my car's maintenance schedule as Mazda listed as a lifetime fluid however I've seen things online that should say it's really about the lifetime of the transmission warranty and that the fluid should be changed every 50 to 60 thousand miles which is correct well we're gonna transition into this transmission question and throw it to Mr Monticello what do you got hilarious Quince uh so yeah we could probably spend uh this podcast talking about the last question and answer this question and then our producer uh Andrew Balise will kill us but um so the short answer Daniel is after talking to our CR mechanics you did the right thing by not doing it okay but there there are some nuances to that answer most new transmission emissions these days are filled or sealed for life according to our mechanics which means they're not intended to be serviced so as long as as long as they're not leaking any fluid then you're go you can go ahead and just not do it but here's the thing um and here's why Daniel did it right because there are instances where let's put it this way there's nothing wrong with having your transmission serviced especially if you started early in the cars lifespan but if your vehicle owner's manual doesn't outline a service interval for your transmission which it appears your Mazda 6 does not and you already have more than 50 to 60 000 miles on your car which you do then you're just better off at that point honestly just leaving it alone this is what our mechanics say now let's say you don't already have you know that 80 000 miles on your car um our guys say there's no harm in changing the trans changing the transmission fluid with Factory fluids if you plan to service it on a regular basis so once you start that service interval you want to keep that service interval going maybe it's 30 000 miles um and the another reason to now again you don't have to but another reason why you might want to do it is let's just say you bought a car and you find out after the fact maybe even knew ahead of time but you found out after the fact that this transmission doesn't have um it's known to fail early and that would be considered before 140 000 miles or so okay then you it's possible that having these transmission services done could actually prolong the lifespan of that transmission it could help it you know uh it could help it uh to not fail down the road and and so of course we have all that information folks at consumerreports.org
because we do these annual Auto survey surveys and that's when we find out which cars are reliable and which ones aren't and again Daniel you did the right thing because you bought a 2016 Mazda 6 which it has above average reliability when it comes to what we call transmission major transmission Miner and drive system that's the bottom line um is that Daniel you did the right thing but this is part of how they make money and like I said as long as although there is this weird thing though if you've had it for like 80 100 000 miles you just want to keep it sealed at that point and so there are these just nuances to the whole transmission servicing debate well Daniel thanks so much for that question I have this sinking feeling we're gonna hear some more about transmissions in the next few minutes but Hang on we're gonna we got a question now from Lynn I'm interested in buying a new EV with the best mpge possible I find that all the EVS on the market mention very fast acceleration but I don't want that is it possible to buy an EV that gets an mpge better than a Tesla Model 3 or a Prius plug-in hybrid in EV mode something that would get 200 mpge or better I'm thinking that the numbers used to calculate mpge are no longer accurate with the fluctuating Gas and Electric prices what's the best way of thinking about this um great question certainly timely Lynn with all the the buzz going on these days about hybrids and EVs and uh luckily for you we have John linkoff here is going to give a good explanation to exactly what is mpge yeah so dissertation number two of the episode um so mpge a formula that was created in the 2000s and introduced in 2010 may have been it was actually worked on earlier but introduced in 2010 by the Environmental Protection Agency the EPA um to come up with a electric equivalent to miles per gallon miles per gallon equivalent um it's basically 33.7 kilowatt hours of energy equals a gallon of gas so think of it that way um so at the basic sense it allows a comparison of and this is key tank to wheel costs for vehicles so it's not well to wheel which you do hear about the cost of getting gas getting oil out of the ground and how it how it affects costs but it's just really the cost tank to wheel um and it's really key for plug-in hybrids because plug-in hybrids are rated with both their electric only time which is when you'll see a 100 something or 60 something or 80 something mpge rating and then you'll see when they're driving as a hybrid which is using the gas engine um and then you'll see it as a 35 45 or something like that miles per gallon um and it also allows you know to rank EVS um a couple interesting things they the ratings come into play with the Department of Transportation corporate average fuel economy you may have heard that that's the fleet for a corporation and as well as the IRS collecting gas guns or taxes but that's only for obviously gas using vehicles um and big ones so you know anything that's really a plug-in or a hybrid is not going to fall into that realm anyway and Cafe the corporate average fuel economy program doesn't use the exact same fuel economy estimates um that you'll see on a window sticker so taking all that in the best way to see about mpge ratings is to go to fueleconomy.gov and they will explore explain not only all that stuff about the tax credits before that we talked about um but it'll also show you the vehicles ranked with mpge and it'll let you see hybrids uh plug-in hybrids with the I'm sorry plug-in hybrids with the um their electric mpge rating as well as their MPG rating so John why does Quincy hate you I mean first he asks you to explain the inflation reduction act and then explain what the heck mpge is I mean I guess he was like well you know of the two of us I guess I got to give it to John you know yeah exactly Mike he's the smartest guy here so he hasn't used to do the heavy lifting but we didn't answer the question the question is do any have 200 MPG and John correct me from wrong answer is there's nothing even close at this point right now there's no there's not a 200 MPG e vehicle um the top is a uh 142 mpge combined um is a Tesla Model S I I get what Lynn is asking and and what she's but since there aren't any that are 200 mpge at this point I mean you can still be efficient with your electric vehicle you know yes these thing you know you floor an EV it's gonna go like stink because they they get all give all of their torque immediately which a gas engine does not but you don't have to drive it that way just because it can give you you know max power as soon as you step part on the you don't have to step hard on the throttle pedal and you can do things like turn it to an eco mode which typically uh in vehicles uh makes the throttle pedal a little less sensitive so it makes it honestly feel a little heavier so in an effort to you know make you not drive so aggressively and then of course it's not push through yeah exactly and then of course with an EV and they vary here but they they you know all have some kind of regenerative braking system and a lot of them have several different settings you know so you can do uh aggressive regen braking and you know that's gonna uh not only slow the car but it's going to send energy back to the battery you know so that you're not just wasting it and if you set it to its most if if it's nav that has a very aggressive regen setting which which these days we call one pedal driving because it is you know just a little bit after you let off the gas the throttle pedal I shouldn't say yeah throttle pedal it starts slowing the car very abruptly almost um to the point that you can actually come to a complete stop without ever using you know your regular brake pedal you can you know gain some efficiency back with your EV so there's ways to be more efficient and to be to not be inefficient let's put it that way but listen uh it's it's a it's an interesting question it's complicated it's not easy there's no easy answer between EVS plug-in uh hybrids uh it is question that a lot of people are having these days and we're going to be studying more and more as Consumer Reports continues to buy these vehicles testing them and Reporting back to you our loving and faithful audience which brings us to Joel from Long Island I never miss an episode keep up the good work yeah yes there's frequent verbiage about the number of gears in automatic transmission I've driven everything including six eight and ten speed transmissions including cvts which I know most enthusiasts loathe each car has driven beautifully in its own way but I'm not sure if I was supposed to detect any differences regarding the number of gears in each vehicle in other words if someone enjoys how a car drives handles and is happy with the gas mileage why should they care about the number of Gears Joel man I am totally with you on that uh you know the the some of the thought is is more is better 6 8 10 speed uh automatic transmissions dual clutches cvts everything and luckily the these card Geeks and Consumer Reports have also driven them all and I and I think uh Mike and John probably agree with me it really isn't the number of Gears it's the application it and in that uh you know what that means is some cars with with multi-speeds automatics perform well some don't some cvts are pretty good and some aren't um some dual clutch uh applications uh are pretty good some are totally awkward I mean I don't know if you guys remember the Smart car it was a single clutch automated manual so and it was an early you know that was still early times for that and right there were I mean there pretty much weren't any great single clutch automated manuals but that was like maybe the worst one it was probably the worst transmission I've ever driven and just to give a quick synopsis when you're at a stop sign in the Smart car and you go out you you press the gas pedal you start accelerating when the car goes to shift everything on the motor was like shut down there would be this lot this lag and then it would kick back in and it would keep going and and it was just it was crazy and what's funny is Monty you brought up the Mazda 6-speed uh uh automatic transmission in your earlier answer and and I checked in with with super smart data guys Steve Alec and he's like yeah I mean it's it's not a fancy transmission it's a six-speed but it's proven to be super super reliable so not only should you not worry about how many gears you have uh it isn't indicative on the type of transmission about how reliable it's going to be well and that's the funny thing with Mazda because at this point you could kind of you know basically other than a couple of models with that have the availability of a manual transmission uh every Mazda product uh for sale in the US has a six-speed automatic okay no cvts no seven eight nine ten speeds and yet uh with the cx50 being the only exception and that's more that's more transmission software tuning I think with that has some kind of abrupt just for the most part we've been really happy with the way these six-speed automatics for Mazda shift they're a great example that if you have a good shifting transmission it works well you don't need to have eight nine ten speeds you know yeah I think Toyota kind of showed that as well with their six-speed gearbox and their five and six-speed gearboxes they ran for a while um it really was I mean in my opinion was the 80s to 90s that it made a big difference you know you think of cars that ran with four speeds for a while and you know and then maybe matriculate to a five-speed um or a lot of three-speed automatics you know and then eventually they got a five speed and we're like oh my gosh you know they got two more gears but it doesn't matter if you like it and it drives well and it gets decent mileage it's reliable who cares about the size of the gearbox exactly exactly we've had all this discussion on Transmissions no one has said save the manuals but oh let's move on okay um thanks for that question now we've got one from Susan conventional wisdom says to never buy a car in the first model year does this way of thinking still apply with all the new hybrid and electric vehicles being made Mike Monticello another EV question come on what do you got for Susan okay so um I I think what Susan's implying or asking is you know just naturally related to their you know powertrain especially an EV that they're less complicated and therefore uh instantly more reliable and first of all it's not really always true um if just take the Chevrolet bolt for example it's had a multitude of reliability issues over the year over the years because it's been in you know being built for several years now and that includes the powertrain so what I think you need to do is you need to look at the automaker and guess what guess what Consumer Reports does we rate the automakers we make the we have brand reliability that comes out every year with our again with our annual Auto but is that based on our annual Auto surveys John as well is that it is yes it is and so Professor Lincoln I'm sorry and so I think so I think you've got to look at the the automaker if it's a reliable automaker you have a better chance there let's just take the the uh Toyota Sienna right for it was all new for 2021 and only comes as a hybrid right so you know is it reliable is not reliable well it turns out it was uh above average or well above average in almost all categories except for like two where it was I think above just average because Toyota has been building hybrid powertrains for a long time so you if you go with an automaker that already is doing that first of all is reliable and second has been doing this for a while then you can take a risk on a brand new product like the Sienna minivan in 2021 and you're probably going to be fine um so that's why I mean you're when you're talking about reliability you're talking from Brands you're talking Lexus Mazda Toyota Infinity Brands like that and then when you're talking about the ones that maybe you're a little on the fence do I want to trust this all new EV or or hybrid from from this one well then you're looking the ones that aren't so reliable Lincoln Tesla Jeep and Volkswagens are those are the ones that maybe you do want to wait a year or even a bit longer when that new product comes out to just so they can work those bugs out so to speak right but but I mean John that like the question specifically is like you know does this apply to to new hybrid and electric vehicles made almost implying that it has to do with the the reliability of the powertrain it it applies to all vehicles whether you're talking about a Honda Pilot you're talking about a Toyota Corolla you're talking about Toyota Corolla hybrid you're talking about a Tesla Model 3. because the first year of any vehicle is a learning process yes they've been testing it they've been setting up the factory they've been running pre-production capture Vehicles off the line and and making sure that the build process is is working smoothly and that the vehicles are assembled correctly but once it's real and the lines moving at full speed things happen you know or a part that they had from A supplier all of a sudden isn't manufactured properly or that part was manufactured properly but they learned that it fell apart you know it degrades or something or the bolt you know whatever the problem could be it it rears its head once the line is moving at full speed and they're delivering the vehicles so that's why we see in our data is that all first year vehicles actually take a drop compared to the previous generations final year the most reliable one to buy is the final model year final version of the previous model here you know it's like when you know that the car you want to buy is being redesigned by the current one you know before it comes out to the new one comes out uh so whether it's a hybrid an EV a new car particularly something all this new technology and it's a new car that's never been built before yeah you know if you're concerned about reliability stay away for a year stay away for two years look at our data you know look at the at the reliability uh survey that we have that comes out every fall um and it you know gets updated in the the following spring you know see how the vehicles are um because it effect it does affect everyone it affects some more than others as Monty was uh talking about right and John I love the way that you described the complexities of what goes into a mass Market production vehicle I mean this isn't just you know the Ford assembly line in the 1910s and 20s or something like that it's really hard to to build a new vehicle and uh but what's interesting to me though is a lot of the the issues that we see in consumer reports reliability surveys to have have don't have as much to do with powertrains as they do with in-car electronics and things like that so so that might be the thing to worry about in a first model year uh car as opposed to to the to the drivetrain uh we're gonna wrap up this this awesome episode of talking cars with a question from Rochelle I'm a huge fan of your show I'm in need of a new car as I was recently offered a job that will require me to drive 100 miles in a day I'm currently driving a 2005 Nissan Altima that I love for its Comfort space and at one time speed I think I should go with a hybrid but I'm unsure if the extra cost of a hybrid is really worth it I'd really like a sedan or small SUV any suggestion would be greatly appreciated so I I love the questions where people want to know which which model that we would buy because quite often we're all over the place but Mike I'm going to start with you and ask ask which which yeah well somebody's somebody's got to go first what what what would you recommend uh Rachelle buys okay so uh I might be reading a bit into what Rochelle is saying there but it sounds to me like Rochelle is looking for a car that excites her a little bit and so when I think about uh a car that's kind of you know fun to drive in sort of that you know uh category I would lean toward a Mazda 3 and because for one thing at CR recommended okay so it's a good car it's definitely fun to drive one of the most fun to drive compact cars I know the ultima's a mid-size but um I just find this Mazda 3 so interesting to drive mostly related to its handling again we talked it has a six-speed automatic you know you can also get it with a six-speed manual but uh it has a six-speed automatic that works very well uh it gets 30 miles per gallon overall in our testing which is decent that's not hybrid levels okay but it's decent fuel economy has one of the nicer Interiors you're gonna find in that category of cars um and I think it's one that down the road you're gonna find you're still going to find it reasonably enjoyable and also you can get it in a hatchback and uh Beauty's in the eye behold of the beholder but the current Mazda 3 hatchback I think is just gorgeous I mean you can't see out of the thing uh it's rear three-quarter vision is not great and that's part of the reason why I think it's so beautiful because it has this huge span on the sides that are that it's all metal instead of uh Windows uh it doesn't make it dangerous it's just a little harder to to see backing up and changing some Lanes but uh I think that uh John's like whatever sounds like this guy's an idiot packing up changing lanes whoever does that I go straight ahead and I got a blind spot warning right what quarter mile At A Time's been diesel yeah uh Mike I actually really like your pick but you know I'm wondering if you know John a car for Rochelle that she can see out of yes I do um so I would I would go with a Hyundai Elantra hybrid it is uh 55 miles per gallon on the highway according to our test so it doesn't plummet it's a high you know some hybrids do really well in the city and then they're their highway is so so um the 48 miles per gallon overall uh 40 miles per gallon in the city so someone I used to drive to Consumer Reports and back 50 miles each way uh totally appreciate that that highway speed you you could just Cruise almost you know just on electricity depending on your speed you know maybe a little slight downhill um it'll cost you about a thousand five dollars a year again depends on gas prices but Apples to Apples that's almost 500 less than you would pay if you bought a regular Hyundai Elantra um I don't have the payoff time for the difference but I would just gather probably two to three years is going to be the difference in uh in fuel savings um it's it's it's just it's a great vehicle I you know I I would get that I would get one with with uh with leather seats just for support and adjustability for that long trip no the the higher trim lines of the Elantra are are really nice but but considering all of her things and what she's looking at I'm going I'm going hybrid all the way and I'm going to Prius I know it's not exciting but you're getting hatchback versatility I mean you talked about the hatchback she mentioned it uh she likes kind of maybe she's looking at a small SUV so it's somewhat practical what I love about the Prius is that we Consumer Reports literally has Decades of Stellar reliability about this car if you're the type of car owner that wants fuel efficiency and reliability man it's tough to beat the Prius and and that magic number of 52 miles per gallon overall in consumer reports testing is really really pretty awesome um as and you guys you know could could say well it's not a really exciting car to drive I get that I totally get that but but it it doesn't really sound to me like you know she's like oh my commute is through the canyons and I'm gonna do all the curvy roads and all that stuff it doesn't sound like that but um that's me trust me my Mazda 3 pick for her is going to bring the it's a good pick that's an inspired pick in fact don't don't patronize me well hopefully Rochelle will tell us what it's like to uh drive her uh Hyundai Elantra definitely want to know how it's going and you can thank me for the great reliability of your Prius anyhow that is going to wrap up this very exciting edition of talking cars um which was produced by Andrew Belize and edited by Anatoly the great shumsky as always check the show notes for more information on the vehicles and topics that we've talked about and reminder keep your questions coming talking cars at icloud.com thanks so much for tuning in we'll see you next week [Music]
2022-10-17 07:05
