if it's Thursday Russia unleashes a barrage of missiles pummeling Ukrainian cities and piercing its air defenses with the rarely used Hypersonic weapons as Washington's top intelligence Chiefs testify on global threats for a second day plus new safety concerns and calls for more accountability amid a tense hearing on Capitol Hill featuring the CEO of Norfolk Southern who says he commits to make things right in East Palestine Ohio as he testifies for the first time since that toxic train derailment last month and President Biden unveils his 2024 priorities and sets the stage for a battle with the GOP as he unveils his budget in Battleground Pennsylvania [Music] foreign happy Thursday welcome to Meet the Press now I am Chuck Todd reporting in Washington and we're going to begin with one of the most sweeping aerial bombardments by Russia since the war in Ukraine began more than a year ago overnight the Kremlin launched a new wave of attacks using a powerful weapon it virtually never uses in this war according to Ukrainian officials Russia struck Ukraine with a half dozen Hypersonic missiles they travel at least 10 times the speed of sound of course Ukraine's air defenses were powerless to stop these missiles moscow's supply of those missiles however is quite limited and it raises questions about why it's using them at this point in the war for what they're trying to do how many missiles do they have left and who might they turn to if they need more according to Ukraine's president the widespread missile barrage struck infrastructure in residential buildings in 10 different regions of Ukraine as far west as the city of leave and as far south as the city of Curson all told Russia launched more than 80 missiles and according to the institute for the study of War six different types of missiles were used and deployed in these attacks to ensure that at least some could not be struck down by what has been a fairly effective Ukrainian air defense system now Ukrainian officials say at least six people were killed during the intense nighttime bombardment President zielinski says Russia chose to attack While most ukrainians slept as a means to intimidate civilians all of this of course comes as the top U.S intelligence officials have been testifying this week before Congress on uh the annual worldwide threats uh initiatives and they appeared today before the house Intel committee here was National Intelligence director Avril Haynes the Russians are making incremental progress on bakmut which is not a particularly strategic objective but the otherwise but are otherwise facing considerable constraints including personnel and ammunition shortages dysfunction within the military's leadership exhaustion and morale challenges and even as the Russian offensive continues they are experiencing High casualty rates Putin is likely better understanding the limits of what his military is capable of achieving and appears to be focused on more modest military objectives for now our foreign correspondent Aaron McLaughlin has more from denipro Ukraine hey there Chuck will we awoke this morning in the Capitol key to the sound of what is likely to have been a Hypersonic missile striking a power plant in the Heart of the City a big boom could be echoed throughout the streets of the Ukrainian Capital One of six Hypersonic missiles believed to have been deployed by the Russians today although Ukrainian officials I've been talking to say that it was deployed to very little military effects they see this more as a propaganda tool for the Kremlin to show that it's taking action in Ukraine to a domestic audience still a very scary day for the people of Ukraine especially in the region of zaparisia the largest nuclear power plant in Europe lost power its outside supply of power today forced to rely on backup diesel generators at the time Ukrainian official say they have enough diesel to back up these Apparition nuclear power plant for some 15 days nevertheless very concerning we heard from the iaea director General today sounding the alarm on the situation with the zaparisian nuclear power plant take a listen to what he had to say this cannot go on I am astonished by the complacency yes the complacency if we allow this to continue time after time then one day our luck will run out now that power plant has since been connected to that outside power supply that crisis averted for now but there is no clear answer to the iaea director General's question it is unclear at this hour what is being done to prevent that kind of attack to prevent the zapariesian nuclear power plant from being cut off from its power supply given that the Russian forces continue to occupy the nuclear plant Chuck Aaron McLaughlin on the ground force in Ukraine and that nuclear power plant it seems like we have been playing with matches uh near a place we shouldn't be playing with matches joining me now is our Global Security reporter Dan de Luce Dan I want to talk about the use of these Hypersonic weapons we don't have them China and Russia do this is one of these rare cases where their Technologies ahead of ours on the uh uh on the military front is it not perhaps okay I think the real issue here is that Russia had to use a really sophisticated expensive weapon and for a means they didn't need to for a method they didn't need to use right so they could use a much more simple weapon and it does indicate by all accounts that they're running out of it that's what we think here right that this was sort of like hey we got to use the good stuff we're out of the we're out of the cheap stuff that's the takeaway the other thing is we're now getting into spring and Ukraine kept the lights on just barely the electric grid did survive and I don't think anyone totally expected that even the White House they have managed to keep their grid working they've managed to shoot down a lot of these missiles by the way dozens of the missiles that were fired were shot down this is an air defense system that we help them put together as well right absolutely we've huge we've helped them a huge amount we've given them one way the Israelis have actually helped too uh we don't know that okay no the Israelis have stopped short of that so far because there had been some talk that on this missile defense they have some technology that could be helpful they have tremendous technology and you crane has pleaded for that yes and they haven't gotten what is our stat our status when it comes to these Hypersonic missiles that traveling 10 times the speed of sound uh the administration doesn't like to talk about these things I think there's a it is a big Focus but I mean technology artificial intelligence satellites space all of this is very much on the agenda you're looking at a huge defense budget and now being proposed I was just going to say to see a Democratic president propose the the the jump I mean that is a that is a headline that is not that has been buried by the politics of the budget that says something because that's something there will be bipartisan support and it will it will no doubt get passed as well uh and in some ways having the Russians use this Hypersonic missile probably almost motivates lawmakers to fund this request doesn't it yes yes uh dandeluz uh given us some extra Clarity there Dan thank you let me bring in uh for more on the war and trying to get a better understanding of what this means for the Russia side of things I want to bring in our retired Admiral uh James debris is of course former Supreme Allied Commander of NATO and NBC news's Chief International analyst and Michael mcfaul who's of course a former U.S ambassador to Russia and is one of our NBC News National Security and international Affairs analyst uh Jim let me start with you on do you do you see the use of these Hypersonic missiles as proof as Dan seemed to report as well that Russia may be running out of missiles that's why they had to go to the good stuff possibly uh I'll give you another explanation which is demonstrative Russia likes to Showcase that Hypersonic capability they're in a war here's a chance to do it um but you know keep it in perspective they only have between 50 and 100 of these total from everything I can see so to shoot six of them in a single night says either a they are really running down like you say Chuck B they are seeking to demonstrate the capability and C they really want to go after this electric grid particularly during the winter months because they feel I think quite incorrectly that ultimately that would be a path toward cracking the will of the Ukrainian people I wouldn't bet against the Ukrainian people in that regard well I was just going to say have we already passed the point of where this could have been an effective strategy by the Russians to cut Ukraine Off the Grid like the fact that we're we're you know the calendar marches forward we're getting awfully close to the official start of spring indeed and secondly history shows us when you bombard these populations as the Nazis did to the Brits with the Blitz in the second world war typically it stiffens the resistance I think that's what we're going to see here Mike McFall if Putin is okaying the use of hypersonic missiles should that make us nervous he might okay the use of even more powerful weapons no I wouldn't jump to that conclusion although we should always be worried about him using I think you're implying nuclear weapons right Chuck yeah uh but I gotta say I'm very struck that he used these weapons I remember the speech when he rolled out this it's called the kinjal uh weapon system that you're talking about he rolled it out back in 2018 as part of the the suite of weapons that they have for nuclear weapons Chuck and this was supposed to be to get around our missile defense systems he was very proud of that fact so that he's using it for these kind of Air Raids uh you know killing women and children in Ukraine I think is a sign of desperation you don't use this these kinds of weapons for the kinds of terrorist attacks that he's doing and I just want to underscore what you just were talking about with the Admiral it's not working uh people in in Kiev aren't tariff in Ukraine they're not terrified by Putin anymore I was just talking to people this morning they're used to it they have their generators this is not working it's is not making people more prone to say hey president zielinski maybe we better stop fighting just the opposite yeah eventually Floridians figure out when it rains and in some ways and I just want to add that we were talking earlier about the distant Boom the distant boom is Vladimir Putin's head exploding in frustration at the debacle unfolding in front of him so let's talk about if he's depleting if he's got a missile Gap here and he's got a Munitions problem Jim um could the Iranians North Koreans and Chinese backfill that for them or not in the case of Iran or North Korea yes in the case of china and that's why we ought to be doing absolutely everything we can to send a message to Beijing uh overtly we've done some of that releasing our intelligence suggesting they're considering it but also sub Rosa through our ambassador there Nick Burns a superb Diplomat we need to be flooding The Zone with a message to China that that is going to be crossing a line with the United States if they jump in with weapons to Vladimir Putin uh Mike I am curious do you think Putin had to use this Hypersonic weapon as a way to prove to some of the Hawks that he was willing to do whatever it takes maybe but maybe not I I think we tend to over uh play the Hawks like who are they right Chuck uh the progression you know the chef right isn't he the basically the chief Hawk give me a break uh you know he's uh military operation uh by the way his soldiers and his criminals are dying in buckmouth it doesn't even seem like the generals garasimov supports him uh he has no political movement and it's a dictatorship so so this idea that he's attacked by the Hawks which is you know we we talk about it on TV and lots of commentators talk about it I just think we overplay that I think it's more a sign of desperation as you were alluding to before um and he is running out of weapons the thing that he has more of than the ukrainians have or we have is time he thinks you know if time is on his side if he can just gut it out keep where he's at keep his positions now the ukrainians will run out of soldiers and will run out of of attention and eventually that will play to his advantage Jim do you what do you think he did this last night if he's does it again tonight is it a strategy no um all it is all it is is throwing in this case missiles at the problem and it's not going to fix it and by the way if he does it at the same Pace he'll be out of hypersonic cruise missiles in five to ten days I'd call that not a strategy but a failure um I'm curious how far behind is American Technology on this Hypersonic front Jim not far at all I'll leave it there for reasons of classification no I understand that is this just something we didn't emphasize in our and our two Chief competitors China and Russia did or or why it's rare for us to lose one of these races that's all yeah think of it this way Chuck we we are exploring such a wide range of Technologies constantly perhaps we didn't put enough in this basket on the other hand we put a lot in space in cyber and Quantum Computing and dozens of other things artificial intelligence in which we do maintain a lead and believe me our teams our r d our defense firms are capable of closing this Gap very quickly and what about on the defense side of it having missile defenses that can keep up with these Hypersonic missiles where would you say we are technologically on that we are approaching what will be a breakthrough which is going to be when we stop trying to shoot down this incoming high-speed telephone pole with another telephone pole what's coming next are laser weapons that'll be capable of doing that unlimited quantities high speed speed of light you can go 10 times the speed of sound you can't go faster than the speed of light watch for lasers and Mike I want to talk about the growing intelligence out there that says perhaps ukrainians were behind the uh the um the damage on the nordstream pipeline what's your it's what what is the Diplomatic damage if that is indeed the growing agreed upon assessment by Western allies well first I'd say the assessments are pretty vague uh great reporting but you know based on vague assessments uh and that's the way it should be by the way I'm getting tired of somebody I like it when they bite Administration takes the decision to declass information I think that's brilliant I don't like it when people in the government talk to reporters about things that are classified so I'm glad it's that way a second you know the ukrainians are not going to claim credit for it and there everybody's going to agree to disagree about how it was done I think it does help to take away attention from the United States right the Russians are saying that the United States did it and maybe just maybe I'm just guessing but maybe the bite Administration wanted to throw this out here to suggest in fact that it was not us uh because that plays into the Putin narrative if it was us I am just curious like how much of that it caught I mean it had that gained real traction or was that just Russian propaganda it's gotten it wasn't just Russian propaganda lots of people believed it because there are very few countries that have the capabilities to do what was done right so you know again I want to emphasize I'm guessing here but it seems to me that the U.S Administration the Biden Administration wanted to put out some information to suggest that in fact it was not the United States it may have been somebody else well it was great to have uh you Jim stavridi's uh retired Admiral former NATO Supreme Allied Commander Michael McFall former ambassador of Russia it was a rough night last night in Ukraine it was really helpful to have you guys explain uh why it might not have been a good night for the Russians thank you both coming up hours after another train derailment the Norfolk Southern CEO testified before the senate for the first time since the toxic train disaster last month in Ohio his apologies his promises to Congress and the Fallout from his testimony are next plus Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell hospitalized after a fall yesterday will have the latest on his condition and that concussion and the reaction on Capitol Hill you're watching Meet the Press now [Music] welcome back the CEO of the rail company Norfolk Southern was on the hill today testifying in a senate hearing on the catastrophic derailment of one of his companies trains in East Palestine Ohio last month Al spoke just hours after another Norfolk Southern Train by the way derailed in Alabama this morning it's the company's third derailment since February now Norfolk Southern has faced intense criticism for the East Palestine accident and for the response to residents of the town in the face of major health concerns potentially caused by those toxic chemicals released when the derailed cars carrying hazardous material caught fire now Shaw began his Congressional testimony by apologizing to the community and committing to remain present during the cleanup I want to begin today by expressing how deeply sorry I am for the impact this derailment has had on the residents of East Palestine and the surrounding communities we're going to be there today tomorrow a year from now five years from now 10 years from now I've told the community that I've been there in person I've looked into their eyes heard their concerns been in their family rooms I'm committed to that community and so is Norfolk Southern not surprisingly though Shaw faced some aggressive questioning from lawmakers on both sides of the aisle seeking some answers on What caused the derailment and whether the company would commit to backing new legislation that would prevent similar disasters okay so let's get back to what we're here for is try to solve the problem in front of us what caused this Senator the NTSB report is still ongoing um I'm not waiting to act you noted that you have a list of safety things you'd like to implement will you commit no more stock BuyBacks until those safety improvements are completed Senator I will commit to continuing to invest in safety in other big Capitol Hill news today we learned this afternoon that Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell is being treated for a concussion after he tripped and fell last night at a senate leadership fund event at the Waldorf Hotel the hotel formerly known as the Trump Hotel McConnell's office released a brief statement late last night that the 81 year old Senator was taken to the hospital after a fall they didn't give more details until late today before the concussion was confirmed this afternoon the president and first lady had offered their well wishes Senate Democratic leader the Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer also offered a prayer on the senate floor this morning this morning I offer a prayer of strength and healing for the leader and his family I called the leader this morning and spoke briefly with his staff to extend my prayers and well wishes Mitch McConnell is the latest Senator to receive hospital care for health issues Democrat John fetterman is currently in inpatient care for clinical depression and Dianne Feinstein is away from Washington as she recovers from shingles she had been hospitalized she has since been released from the hospital for that Ryan Nobles has the latest on both of these stories from Capitol Hill and Ryan I want to start with Norfolk Southern uh and look cutting through the sort of politicized questioning that can happen at these hearings um did he commit to not lobbying against new Federal Regulation and what did he commit to on safety any specifics here more staff different Technologies or was it as vague as the highlights we were playing at the top you probably won't be surprised to know that it is the ladder truck it did seem to be a lot more of a promising in very vague terms to be there until the very end to make sure that his company would do everything they could to fix this problem but without any very a specific amount of substance behind it uh you know the there is a bipartisan bill that's making its way through the Senate right now from both of Ohio's Senators that would address some of these rail safety concerns but you know Norfolk Southern does believe that they're not completely to blame for all of this these cars are not uh necessarily owned or operated by the company they're just responsible for transporting them that could be a cop-out somebody uh view but regardless uh you know what I think the tone Alan Shaw tried to strike here is that yes we want to take care of all of this we just don't know what it's going to take to take care of all of it and we don't want to promise anything that we can't deliver Ryan so is he bringing another company in here are they passing the buck of blame that somehow the car itself while they were the company pulling the car that the car itself is the responsibility of another company that loaded the chemicals yeah so that you know in part of that uh bit of sound that you played earlier when you talked about the NTSB investigation because it has not necessarily been concluded yet as to how this accident happened you know there is some thought that there was you know something that went faulty with the car itself and these cars are not owned and operated by Norfolk Southern they basically own uh the the car the engine at the front and the Caboose at the back and everything in between is owned by someone else and so that may be part of what Congress needs to address in terms of the regular regulatory environment as it relates to the rail company should Norfolk Southern have more control over the maintenance and care of these individual cars it does perhaps sound like there's a bit of passing in the buck that's going on here as well but that's part of the reason that I think you see members of Congress so frustrated and the other point I'd make to You Chuck and you understand kind of the the weedsy part of this is that this isn't really the committee that's going to deal with these fixes this is the co the Commerce Committee or someone where else is likely going to this was just the first committee that had an excuse to bring him in front of them so that they could ask him all these tough questions so you know we're a long way away from seeing like substantive reform come out of Congress yeah it sounds like it's the civil litigation that'll probably clear up uh the ownership issues and all of that uh before any of this but that that seems like that is a quite the thicket there let me move to Mitch McConnell it was uh look it was a bit disconcerting that we went as long as we went with so little information and I know there were a lot of people nervous it sounds like we can all breathe a bit sigh of relief um is he is he on the mend or not yeah that's that's the sense that we're getting Chuck and not just from the the public statements uh that we're getting from his office but also from his fellow Senators who were briefed on his condition some have actually talked to him so he is conscious he's been able to have conversations with them but it does does seem like he took a pretty bad fall and was beat up a bit you know a concussion is no doubt a serious situation it's especially serious for someone who is 81 years old and of course it's important to point out that Mitch McConnell does have lingering problems from his childhood polio and that could have been part of what contributed to this his legs aren't as strong uh as you would like them to be in a situation like this but I think the big question everyone has right now Chuck is just how long of a recovery is this going to take uh they're saying right now that he's going to be in the hospital still for the next couple of days and they're not putting a timeline on when he could return you know I've been asked a lot today you know how does this impact the the work of Congress in the short term probably not that big of a deal you know there's two Democrats in our currently here right now who are dealing with their own health issues and John Federman and Dianne Feinstein so the numbers really don't matter all that much it's really the long-term issue right because Mitch McConnell is the key negotiator and all these big things like the debt ceiling and the budget and things along those lines one important detail Ryan do we know has Mitch McConnell talked with people is he alert is he uh dealing with Senate business does he know you know is he sometimes a concussion could set you way back and sometimes it doesn't we have no kind of details yet yeah so we don't know if he's you know being briefed on the business of the Senate but we do know that he's had conversations with people Senator John barasso for instance said that he talked to him that they had a good conversation that he expected to make a full recovery and of course you know barrasso is his opposition yeah yeah so he so his expertise goes beyond just a friendship here so yes he is conscious and you know okay the signs are that he'll be able to make a full recovery those are important signs those are important signs that I unfortunately had friends in similar situations where it was a much more dire Outlook anyway Ryan Nobles on Capitol Hill Force Ryan thank you up next President Biden lays out his 2024 priorities in Battleground Pennsylvania that's next you're watching Meet the president foreign [Music] ISM that we've heard dozens of times from him not just as president as Senator as vice president show me your budget and I'll tell you what you value in fact he said it today so by that measure the president just gave us a window into some of his key priorities for 2024 when he's expected to be in the heat of a presidential reelection campaign and I will say this at least he did something other presidents uh haven't done before is it he sort of admitted that the budget is nothing more than a campaign uh platform because he went ahead and unveiled it in a Battleground State he unveiled it in Philadelphia just a few minutes ago the same city where he kicked off his 2020 campaign so let's be clear on what this budget is and what it isn't it isn't a realistic piece of legislation it's not going to become law and it's not intended to become law it is intended to create a contrast with the other party it is a potential roadmap for the issues that the White House wants to focus on and see if they could beat the other party over the head with these priorities it includes a bevy of democratic priorities includes restoring the child care tax credit expanding access to pre-k and child care cap the price of insulin at 35 a month all of it paid by raising taxes on corporations and Americans making more than 400 000 a year including a new tax on billionaire and all told the president said his plan would cut three trillion from the deficit over the next decade while extending the solvency of Medicare for an additional 25 years in the near term though this budget would spend more money and have a bigger deficit in the coming year than it did last year joining me now is Susan page Washington brt for USA Today democratic and Republican strategist Doug High Susan I will say this I at least appreciate the White House rolling it out in a campaign State let's not pretend this is a serious piece of legislation and all of our inboxes are flooded with meaningless press releases about said uh budget but what do you my what do you take away from it that says huh okay that's what they're focused on I take away from he's running for reelection um this and we I think he's done a series of things in recent weeks on crime and on immigration and now on the budget that indicate that he is well into his re-election campaign and he is outlining a different vision of the role of government than Republicans have and there is almost no overlap between the priorities and approaches they would take on taxes and spending um the budget director uh she basically said uh Mo this is something to be contrasted with the other party here she is so lots of people in this town as you've alluded to I want to talk about spending cuts This president's actually putting forward a plan that reduces the deficit buys you accurately State nearly three trillion dollars on the other side of the aisle we have a contrast which is why it's important to put out budget plans and why we want our colleagues on the other side of the aisle to do the same they have proposals that would add three trillion dollars by giving tax cuts to the wealthy so do you want to bring down the deficit battery trillion or do you want to raise deficit by 3 trillion Mo I guess in poker terms she's like look we'll show you our hand show me yours well and that's exactly what they're saying right they're saying to the Republicans who are coming out there now and attacking the president's budget like all right what do you got now let's let's now go toe-to-toe and do this look I think this is absolutely a statement of of values and a campaign strategy and and can I just say how refreshing it is to get back to this argument that a lot of the other nonsense Washington's been arguing over the past we'll have those yeah they go away yeah but um diluted it is about sort of who we are and what government's role should be and the kinds of things we should be investing in and not investing in and it serves Dual Purpose one it does set up the upcoming campaign but it also sets up some legislative maneuvering that the White House is eager to get into with the Republican house as we begin this showdown over the debt ceiling and I think that is very much on the president's mind as well so Doug I I would assume the last thing any Republican presidential candidate would want is for House Republicans to put out a budget absolutely right but they're going to have to put out a budget here don't they they have to they can't sit here and not do something they promise their own voters they would do so I gave up Frank Sinatra for Lent and fried food yeah there's an old Sinatra song I've heard that song before and this is exactly the conversation that we had a year ago uh where we didn't want to be talking about some of these things Mitch McConnell warned us and Rick Scott came along and made sure that Democrats were talking about these things uh in attacking Republicans were in this same uh situation right now if you're running for president you do not want to be uh talking about and responding to what the house Republican budget is there won't be a set because that house Republican budget's going to become the nominees budget as far as the Democratic campaign is concerned absolutely that's that's what we saw last year in the Senate races with the Rick Scott that's what we said Romney and Paul Ryan's proposal right if he came and of course Mitt Romney picked him as but it didn't matter it was being thrown at him yeah look those are the unfair politics of politics and this is what every one of these candidates is going to have to deal with minus potentially Donald Trump because his ability to throw people under the bus and back that bus up and back and up and back whether it's uh House Republicans or Senate Republicans it's pretty legendary he may be poised to do that yeah but who does this empower it empowers the freedom caucus because they will have this they're going to want to put out a budget right oh they they promised they got a promise that they could put out a budget that's balanced in 10 years regular order yeah and now they've taken kind of gone off the table they've taken Social Security off the table they've taken Medicare off the table they're going to devastate every other spending program that the federal government has you pivoted to something that actually wanted to bring up this is a massive increase Joe Biden massive increase in defense spending yeah Mo and so if there's one part of this budget that will suddenly like I this is one of those you're like yeah it's all a fantasy not that defense budget this might actually be you know it leads to this other issue Mo progressives have been pretty muted over the last few months I'm curious if they will be muted about this well look they're getting a lot in in this budget as well right they're getting the stuff they're getting is never going to pass this defense budget increase will but this is a president who hasn't had any trouble standing up to the progressives when it comes to issues like this we saw when it came to policing we've seen it on on any number of other issues where the progressives will say and and they their hands are kind of tied because they don't have anywhere else to go this is a good Progressive president it maybe doesn't go as far as they would like but they are they get far better than the freedom caucus are you thinking that most of the progressive leaders are becoming among pragmatic I think they are marginally pragmatic I think they are looking at the Republican field and know that if they do not get behind this President Democratic divided democratic party won't survive 24. Doug this is a slight difference there is a you know whatever people want to say about the progressives pulling the Democratic party to the left they have been more muted at attacking their guy they're not seeing that the Republican party is not allowed to compartmentalize the Trump base no not at all and and part of what this move on the defense budget does for Biden is it further exposes Republican divides where on Ukraine which ties specifically into military spending a lot of conservatives for the first time I can remember um going back to well before Ronald Reagan are now talking about cutting defense spending you know this is not Ronald Reagan's party anymore and we're at right at the 40th anniversary of the evil empire speech and this is not Donald Trump or this is not Ronald Reagan's foreign policy it's not his Republican party either no and this is the part where I I'm we'll see what happens I have no idea how they're going to come up with a balanced budget that doesn't touch defense I assume they won't increase it by as much as Biden wants to increase it so suddenly they're going to look I mean this seems like they set themselves a trap and the White House said great yeah let's say it and they're trapped because they won't raise taxes and if you don't raise taxes if you don't increase revenues you're going to have to really slash spending but you know you don't have to use all real numbers in a budget as we've learned and so perhaps that is the solution what you're saying is put out a bunch of numbers that don't add up and just say here's my budget I mean that is sort of caving into the whole idea that well there's at least one you know channel that might go ahead and and buy that BS right is that what you you ended up doing um you know you do what you need to put politicians and both parties do what they need to do the worst situation to be in is to be the majority with a very narrow majority because you can't lose anybody it's much easier to hang yourself together to make serious proposals if you're in the minority you know it can't pass you can stand on principle you can say let's raise taxes by trillions of dollars let's suppose taxes on people making more than four hundred thousand dollars a year on Medicare and you don't have to live with the consequences because it's not going anywhere for at least two years now we'll see being in the minority with a very narrow divided minority doesn't seem to be going well for the other side are you at all concerned Mo that it is sort of in some ways Biden does it embrace the one stereotype that yeah we want to text the rich uh do you think that's an issue anymore no I don't know I mean look I'm old enough to remember when Bill Clinton apologized to rich people yeah yeah yeah no look I mean remember that famous quote he says you probably think I raised your taxes too much I do too yeah look I don't think left versus right is what dominates people anymore dominates voters I think front versus back is right and so pitting and and exploiting and and and focusing on that divide between people who feel like the elites are screwing them is where the politics of today is right and and it's for good reason because people do feel that way and when people see these billionaires and trillionaires um getting these tax breaks they they're done with that look aren't we close it is funny because Susan's right there's no way to do this budget without raising taxes corporations aren't popular on the right anymore I'm surprised there hasn't been a few more of the JD Vance wing of the party to say you know what yeah let's tax those guys you know one of the things I learned one of the things I learned working in house leadership was um that taxes are not a sack we're saying for Republicans as we thought they were when the Bush tax cuts were expiring 2012 2013. uh Grover norquist
Americans for tax reform said the plan Republicans are putting together is a good plan back it and enough Republicans said oh I don't know about that it's not what it used to be as a Salient issue I wonder if it is because these things pull very well across party lines I think on that stuff I think imposing a huge tax on billionaires is undoubtedly popular with everyone who is not a billionaire right and so that is probably a safety usually yes and there's last time I checked the billionaire caucus very small it is it is pretty tiny uh anyway well good to see you good thank you thank you Susan thank you both after the break defense secretary Lloyd Austin meets with Israeli leaders as anti-government protests have been sweeping Israel's cities over the last couple of days we'll have the latest on the ground in Tel Aviv next you're watching Meet the president [Music] welcome back Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin's shorter than planned trip to Israel happened today after the Israeli government asked him to delay his arrival by a day and restrict his movements once he got there on the ground Austin met with Israeli counterpart and with prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu but he never left the confines at the airport that's how bad things are right now in Israel the purpose of this visit by Austin was to urge de-escalation in the occupied West Bank and to discuss the threat posed by Iran but this Trip's been overshadowed by the ongoing protests all across Israel demonstrators are holding another day of disruption today in response to the government's plan to overhaul its Judicial System protesters blocked the roads to the country's airport it caused prime minister Netanyahu to helicopter to his meeting with Lloyd Austin secretary Austin also had to briefly wade into his Israel's domestic politics during a press conference today as President Biden has said the genius of democracy of American democracy and Israeli democracy is that they are both built on strong institutions on checks and balances and on an independent judiciary joining me now uh in from Tel Aviv is our foreign correspondent Ralph Sanchez so Ralph obviously it's night time I assume things have calmed down a little bit but uh tomorrow's the Sabbath what do we expect uh over the next few days well Chuck we are seeing no signs the Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is preparing to back down from these very controversial judicial reform plans as he calls them just a reminder under this proposed law Israel's parliament would be able to vote by a simple majority to ignore rulings of the Supreme Court Netanyahu will tell you that that is curbing the excesses of activist judges but the protesters we saw on the streets of Israel on the highways of Israel today in their tens of thousands said they were deeply concerned about the impacts that this would have on Israeli democracy and Chuck I thought it was really interesting that secretary Austin who is not a particularly political person himself he's a former Soldier weighed in on this internal Israeli domestic issue in his prepared remarks alongside the Israeli defense minister which I think is a really clear sign that the Biden Administration wanted to lay down a marker to the Israelis that they share at least some of the Israeli protesters concerns one last thing Chuck the Israeli president who is a largely ceremonial figure but whose words hold a lot of moral weight was on TV a couple of hours ago saying the divisions within Israel are a disaster and he pleaded with Netanyahu to abandon these judicial overhaul plans replace them with some kind of compromise but right now the standoff continues Chuck uh and I you know I is there any point where we think these protests will let up or will the Sabbath provide a pause it's a really good question Netanyahu is actually out of town at the moment he's gone to Rome for the weekend this is kind of a controversial trip he doesn't have a very full itinerary in Rome it is his wedding anniversary his wife is with him so this is not a great look Chuck especially because there has been a terror attack here in Tel Aviv in the last couple of hours a Hamas gunman opening fire on Israeli civilians at a cafe on a very busy street here in Tel Aviv the shooter was killed three civilians wounded one of them in critical condition so Netanyahu is under a lot of pressure right now the country so deeply divided but also this Terror attacks for sure Ralph Sanchez in Tel Aviv 4 is rough thank you still to come as the abortion debate continues to divide the GOP and speak with Republican Congresswoman Nancy mace who says she's tried to quote reign in some of the craziness inside her party we're watching me to press now foreign welcome back Governor Gavin Newsom of California announced this week that estate will not renew a 54 million contract with Walgreens why he's upset that the company announced it would not dispense a medication abortion pill in some states even where abortion is legal all of this comes as we wait for a ruling by a trump appointed federal judge that could pull a common abortion medication pill off the shells Nationwide bottom line the spotlight on this issue of abortion in America not going away anytime soon which arguably is probably not good news politically for the GOP as they continue to struggle to navigate this issue that has been a major political liability particularly when you continue to look at what happened in 2022 I've seen some new data that only underscores for women that were self-described Independence abortion was the number one issue they voted on joining me now is Congresswoman Nancy Mesa republican from South Carolina who's criticized her party over these stricter and total bans that have been around the country congresswoman it's good to see I want to we have you on today because you introduced uh uh a new bill on contraception trying to make it more over the counter uh completely give me a little bit of details if your bill passed what do you believe it would do well particularly after Roe v Wade being overturned we want to make sure that women have access to birth control wherever they can get it and this bill would speed up the application process to the FDA for approval would cut that time in half it would also waive the fees for companies that are applying for for a self-administered birth control options for women it would waive those fees and make it more efficient and more affordable as well down the line through that application process it would speed it up it still makes it safe and more cost effective because we want women to have access to it no matter where they are do you believe we we can make all birth control over the counter well I think for self-administered birth control that should be an option if we can do that in my home state of South Carolina Chuck we have entire counties in rural areas that don't have a single OB GYN doctor so what are we going to do to help improve the lives of those women if we're serious about saving lives then certainly especially in states where they're banning abortion we ought to give Every Woman access to the birth control that they want and need we can sit here and talk about specifics I could talk about the six-week ban that's proposed in Florida we could talk about this court case but I want to go big picture here with you for a second it do you feel as if anybody in your party saw their election returns in 2022 because I look around at some of these and I don't I don't mean to be a bit cynical about this but it's like there seems to be a whistling past where the public is on this particularly with voters uh with Women Voters on the on the center right and in the middle right we clearly buried our heads in the sand after after Dobbs and you said earlier that for Independence and for women especially that it was their number one issue I I represent a district where we have Independents Republicans and Democrats Independents outnumber Republicans by double digits Independents and Democrats outnumber Republicans in my district two to one but across the board in my election the number two issue number one was inflation but the number two issue for everybody regardless of politics was abortion and we don't have a plan we're not working together we're not showing compassion for women especially women who've been raped especially for girls who are victims of incest especially for women in foreign rural areas that don't have access to birth control or or doctors who can get them birth control what are we doing what's the plan and so I decided Chuck that just about every week that we're in session but at least the first part of this year I'm filing a bill addressing these these issues and this week it was uh this contraception Bill to speed up the process for self-administered birth control what do you what do you think should happen if this federal judge decides to essentially take that uh one of those abortion pills off the market what would you like to see the federal government do what do you think State Governors should do um is there anything that can be done well I find it very difficult to believe that a medical product that was approved by the FDA could be pulled off the shelves and so I would imagine that that would have to go I would go through the courts and up to the Supreme Court as well but I have a hard time seeing how that would that would be legal in this country regardless of the way you felt about that medication um I I and I'm not trying to bait you here but do you think a republican can run on the idea that they're for Freedom if they have if they're in favor of these extraordinarily restrictive laws on abortion six weeks and things like that well I'll tell you in the state of South Carolina a state lawmaker just last week filed a bill that would allow women to be executed who had abortions if we're going to say women can't travel out of state if we're going to say women should be executed for having an abortion these are not messages that we can stand behind and we have to stand up to the extremism and show some balance show a way that we can protect the right to life and protect women's rights because when you talk to women across the country and across the political Spectrum we agree somewhere in the middle there are a number of things that we agree with on this issue whether it's whether it's 20 weeks or 15 weeks or looking at a contraception and the right to access those things women who've been raped girls who are victims of incest there are many things that we agree on but my party's silent on these issues and I refuse to be silent I'm going to continue to be vocal and fight for the for women everywhere hey Before I Let You Go considering what's happened with January 6 again and it's dividing your party again you think it was the right call for Kevin McCarthy to unilater rarely give the January 6 footage to a loan well uh to a loan uh host I don't know what to call them I I yeah yeah so so on February 22nd I disagreed with that decision I believe if we're going to release that footage release it to every media outlet and release it to every defense attorney who said they didn't have access to it and to the public at large so they can make a decision after seeing that footage on their own right but doing it this way sort of probably it was the worst of all outcomes well I don't believe in filtering it through a singular lens this is something that was that happened uh it was not a good day in our country and everyone in our country should be able to see what happened that day it was a very difficult you were there was it violent history was it violent it was it was and I will tell you I had death threats leading up to that because I said I was going to certify the Electoral College and ever since then Chuck I've had to carry a gun everywhere I go and I've been very vocal about that but at the same time we can learn from this we can work on ensuring it doesn't happen again ensure that we're not that we are being honest with the American people and heal our nation we've got to heal let me ask you a quick question on presidential politics if you decide to endorse will their position on abortion be matter to you before you make that decision I'm thinking Nikki Haley or Tim Scott in particular it and dear to my heart and I know that it matters to my voters it matters to my constituents it matters to my state and if we want if we want to be serious about winning the White House in 24 then we've got to be serious when we're talking about this issue do you think you're the candidate do you think Nikki Haley has the right position on this yet we've had some very encouraging conversations about the issue I've talked to her about as one of the first subjects I brought up when I heard excuse me running for congress and I was impressed with her responses and I hope that there are others will feel the same way Congresswoman Nancy mace uh republican from uh Charleston area in South Carolina appreciate you coming on sharing your perspective with us always good to get it thank you you got it thank you all for being with us this hour I'm going to be back tomorrow with more Meet the Press now but NBC News Now coverage will continue with my friend Tom Costello he's sitting in today for Hallie Jackson and the show begins right now thanks for watching our YouTube channel follow today's top stories and breaking news by downloading the NBC News app
2023-03-11