'Bloomberg Technology' Full Show (01/17/2021)
♪ >> I AM CAROLINE HYDE AT BLOOMBERG'S WORLD HEADQUARTERS IN NEW YORK. >> AND I AM ED LUDLOW IN SAN FRANCISCO. THIS IS BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY.
>> COMING UP, ELON MUSK COULD LOSE BILLIONS IN COURT OVER HIS INFAMOUS 2018 TWEET. JURY SELECTION IS UNDERWAY FROM AN INVESTOR LAWSUIT, AFTER ELON MUSK CLAIMED HE HAD FUNDING TO TAKE TESLA PRIVATE. >> AND THE LATEST BET ON ALIBABA RISKS A CLASH WITH BEIJING. WE LOOK INTO HIS REQUEST, AND INVESTOR ACTIVISM IN CHINA.
>> TENDER UNHINGED. THEY THINK USERS ARE WILLING TO COUGH UP BIG BUCKS, UP TO $500 PER MONTH FOR AN ELITE MEMBERSHIP SUBSCRIPTION ON DATING APPS. WE WILL HAVE FUN WITH THAT ONE, AS YOU DID ON SOCIAL MEDIA. WE TOOK A POOL OF YOUR THOUGHTS ON IT. BUT FIRST LET'S LOOK AT THE MARKETS.
THE NASDAQ MANAGING TO CLING ONTO GAINS FOR A SEVENTH DAY, LONGEST WINNING STREAK SINCE DECEMBER OF 2021. S&P 500 FALLING LOWER. MUTED MOVEMENTS ACROSS THE BOARD WHETHER YOU ARE LOOKING AT EUROPE, OR WORLDWIDE. WE ARE CAUTIOUSLY TRADING. THE MSCI WORLD INDEX WAS
BASICALLY FLAT ON THE DAY. THE NASDAQ MANAGED TO EKE OUT A BIT OF GROWTH, EVEN THOUGH THE S&P MANAGED TO SNAP ITS FIVE-DAY RALLY. THE NASDAQ'S KNEE BE TAKING ITS CUES FROM BORROWING COSTS. YIELDS FELL THREE BASIS POINTS, THIS ON THE TWO-YEAR. THE FRONT END POINT SHOWING THAT THE MARKET IS GETTING CONFIDENT OF THAT INFLATION PRESSURE IS IN THE REARVIEW MIRROR. WE SAW THAT IN THE
MANUFACTURING DATA TODAY. HOPES THAT THE FEDERAL RESERVE WILL BE ABLE TO CALM ON THEIR FOCUS OF INFLATION. THAT IS HELPING NEWS AROUND TECH.
I'LL TELL YOU STILL LOOKING STRONG, AROUND BITCOIN. FOR 13 STRAIGHT DAYS, -- 14 DAYS. IT IS 2013 THAT WE LAST SAW SUCH A LONG WINNING STREAK FOR THIS CRYPTO OJI, UP 28% SINCE THE START OF JANUARY. WHAT A WINNING START TO THE YEAR FOR CRYPTO. ED: IT IS INTERESTING TO SEE THE RISK ON MENTALITY BROADLY.
LOOK AT THE NASDAQ 100, EQUITIES CONTINUING TO GAIN. BUT THERE IS A NARRATIVE AROUND AN EARNINGS RECESSION COMING AS WE CREEP INTO EARNINGS SEASON, UNDERWAY THIS THURSDAY, NETFLIX. APPLE IS UP 0.9%, AND OUTPERFORMER ON THE NASDAQ 100. THAT IS AFTER WE GET THE FIRST LAUNCH OF THE YEAR. WE WILL DIG INTO IT WITH MARK GURMAN.
ROADBLOCKS, BIGGEST JUMP IN THREE MONTHS AS THEY ENTER 2022 STRONG FOR THE VIDEOGAME MAKER IN TERMS OF BOOKINGS. AND THEN THERE ARE MOVERS TO THE DOWNSIDE. WE WILL TALK ABOUT RYAN COHEN, AND HIS ACTIVIST INVESTOR BET ON ALIBABA LATER IN THE SHOW. IT IS INTERESTING HIS BETS ON MEME STOCK THAT WE HAVE SEEN IN THE LAST TWO YEARS OR SO.
THIS ONE IS DOWN 2%. IT DRAGGED ON THE S&P 500. IT WAS COMING OFF A RUN OF SIX OR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAYS OF GAINS, ITS LONGEST STREAK IN SOME TIME. IT WAS REALLY GOING INTO OVERBOARD TERRITORY. SO THERE IS SOME PULLBACK ON AMAZON AFTER A DECENT RUN. TESLA. BEST PERFORMER ON THE S&P 500. REALLY AN OUTLIER WHEN IT COMES TO THE PERFORMANCE OF TUESDAY'S SESSION. THERE WERE LOTS OF SELL SIDE
ANALYSTS REACTING TO THE PRICE CUTS WE SAW IN NORTH AMERICA, SOME OF THEM POINTING TO THE EROSION THAT WE WILL HAVE, POTENTIALLY TESLA MISSING IBITDA WHEN RULINGS COME AROUND. AND TALKING ABOUT AUTOS AND A PRICE WAR, IF THERE IS AN ACTUAL PRICE WAR. COMPARE TESLA TO THE LEGACY AUTOMAKERS, AND IT HAS MORE MARGIN TO PLAY WITH THAN OTHERS DO. BUT THE BACKGROUND IS IT IS HERE IN SAN FRANCISCO. CAROLINE: LET'S DIVE INTO THAT. MUSK IS SAID TO BE A STAR
WITNESS AT INJURY TRIAL THAT STARTED TUESDAY OVER HIS INFAMOUS TWEET, 4.5 YEARS AGO TO BE PRECISE, ABOUT A PLAN TO TAKE THE EASY MAKER PRIVATE WITH "FUNDING SECURED." PETER BLUMBERG JOINS US TO GET US UP TO SPEED WITH BASICALLY WHO IS LIKELY TO WIN HERE. BECAUSE THEY ARE GOING TO BE GOING AT IT AND WE KNOW THAT ELON MUSK LIKES A BIT OF A FIGHT. PETER: HE DOES. IT IS UNUSUAL FOR A CASE LIKE THIS, A SECURITIES FRAUD TRIAL BROUGHT BY A PRIVATE INVESTOR AS A CLASS ACTION.
FOR IT TO GO TO TRIAL IN THE FIRST PLACE, USUALLY THEY SETTLE BECAUSE THERE IS SO MUCH MONEY AT STAKE. IN THIS CASE, THERE IS BILLIONS OF DOLLARS ON THE LINE. BUT AS YOU SAID, ELON MUSK IS ALWAYS UP FOR A FIGHT. IN THIS CASE HE IS UNDER A DISADVANTAGE BECAUSE THE JUDGE RULED THAT THE TWEETS WERE FALSE. AND THE JUDGE IS GOING TO TELL THAT TO THE JURY AT THE GET-GO. THERE ARE STILL OTHER THINGS THAT THE JURY HAS TO DECIDE, AND IT COULD STILL BE RESOLVED IN ELON MUSK'S FAVOR, BUT IT IS DEFINITELY A DISADVANTAGE FOR HIM GOING INTO THIS. ED:
LET'S TALK ABOUT MECHANICS. YOU HAVE BEEN MY EDITOR ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION, COVERING THESE BLOW-BY-BLOW TRIALS. THE JURY IS KEY HERE AND SO ARE THE MECHANICS.
GOING THROUGH JURY SELECTION RIGHT NOW, AND NO SURPRISE, SOME OF THE POTENTIAL JURORS HAD ISSUES WITH ELON MUSK, REMEMBER ELON MUSK TRY TO MOVE THE TRIAL AWAY FROM SAN FRANCISCO BECAUSE HE ARGUED THERE WAS BIAS AMONG THE JURY POOL. BUT THIS IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN QUICKLY AND ELON MUSK WILL BE A STAR WITNESS. WALK US THROUGH WHAT HAPPENS FROM HERE ? PETER:THEY ARE GETTING CLOSE TO SELECTING A JURY AND THEY HAVE BEEN VERY CAREFULLY QUESTIONING THE JURORS ABOUT THEIR VIEWS AND WHETHER THEY CAN COMMIT TO BEING FAIR AND IMPARTIAL. AND OF COURSE, THE LAWYERS ON BOTH SIDES GET A CHANCE TO SPEAK UP AND DISMISS JURORS THAT THEY DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH. BUT THERE IS A FEELING THAT THEY WILL REACH A CONSENSUS BEFORE THE END OF THE DAY AND PICK A JURY. THEN WE HAVE A TWO POINT FIVE WEEK TRIAL WHERE WE WILL HEAR FROM A VARIETY OF WITNESSES BEYOND ELON MUSK HIMSELF, INCLUDING THE HIGH FINANCE PEOPLE WHO WERE INVOLVED IN SOME OF THE BEHIND-THE-SCENES TALKS ABOUT FUNDING THIS TRANSACTION, AS WELL AS SOME PROFESSOR TYPES, EXPERT WITNESSES WHO ARE GOING TO TALK TO THE JURY ABOUT THEIR THEORIES OF HOW THE TWEETS MAY HAVE INFLUENCED INVESTORS TO MAKE TRADES, AND ALSO TO TALK ABOUT WHAT KIND OF DAMAGE THIS DID TO INVESTORS AND HOW MUCH MONEY THEY SHOULD COLLECT.
CAROLINE: PETER BLUMBERG, THANK YOU FOR GETTING US UP TO SPEED. IT'S GOING TO LEARN FOR A LITTLE WHILE. APPLE JUST ROLLED OUT NEW PRODUCTS FOR 2023. HEAVY SPOTTED THAT -- HAVE YOU SPOTTED THAT? ED. WOULD GO BACK TO THE MACBOOK PRO, THE LAPTOPS. LET'S SEE WHAT THE FUSS IS ABOUT.
THEY HAVE NOT ANNOUNCED, BUT THEY HAVE GONE ON SALE. MARK GURMAN, WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT THESE PRODUCTS THAT YOU HAVEN'T ALREADY BROKEN IN THE PAST? MARK: THE NEW MARK BOOK -- MACBOOK PRO WAS RELEASED TODAY. AND THE NEW MAC MINIS. THESE ARE UPGRADES. THEY LOOK IDENTICAL TO THE PREVIOUS MODELS, THE MAC MINI FIRST ROLLED OUT INTO A 20, THE FIRST TO GET THE M1 CHIP, OUT OF THE TRANSITION AWAY FROM INTEL. WHY ARE THESE SIGNIFICANT? THEY INTRODUCED THE NEW GENERATION OF APPLE'S CHIPS. SO THE MAC MINI GETS THE M2 CHIP.
BUT IT ALSO GETS THE FIRST M2 PRO CHIP. IT ADDS HORSEPOWER ON BOTH THE CPU AND THE GPU SIDE. SO THE CHIP IS USED FOR THE MAIN PERFORMANCE, OVERALL SPEED OF THE COMPUTER. THE GPU HANDLES GRAPHICS AND
VIDEO EDITING. THE MACBOOK PRO ALSO GETS THE SAME M2 PRO CHIP IN THE MAC MINI BUT ALSO THE M2 M AX WHICH DOUBLES THE POWER ON THE GRAPHICS SIDE. IT'S A GOOD MACHINE FOR VIDEO EDITORS AND PROGRAMMERS AND ENGINEERS THAT REALLY NEED THE MOST HORSEPOWER YOU CAN GET IN A LAPTOP.
CAROLINE: WHAT CAROLINE WAS ALLUDING TO IS THIS WEEKEND, I DROPPED MY PHONE AND IT SMASHED. NOW A FACE A CHOICE OF WHETHER TO UPGRADE OR WAIT. UNI TALK ABOUT THIS BEHIND CLOSED DOORS ALL THE TIME. ANYWAY, WE DIGRESS. TIM ALLUDED TO IN A TWEET, THE EMPHASIS APPLE HAS HAD IT NOT JUST ON SUPPLY CHAINS, BUT CONTROLLING ITS APN TECHNOLOGY. WHAT I AM CONFUSED ABOUT IS, I THOUGHT THIS LATEST GENERATION OF MAC WAS SUPPOSED LAST YEAR, 2022. WAS THERE A DELAY?
WHAT HAPPENED? MARK: THERE WAS A DELAY. THE M2 LINE STARTED TO ROLL OUT LAST YEAR AT THE END OF JULY. THERE WAS A DELAY BECAUSE OF THE MANUFACTURING FACILITIES IN CHINA, THEY ALL GOT SHUT DOWN FOR ABOUT A MONTH AND THAT DELAYED THE ROLLOUT OF THE MACBOOK ERA, AND THE 13-INCH MACBOOK PRO. IN ADDITION TO OTHER FACTORS
REGARDING THE CHIP SHORTAGE AND THE OVERALL NEED A LOOK MANUFACTURING TO MORE PRESSING PRODUCTS LIKE THE IPHONE'S AND I ADDS LAST YEAR AND APPLE WATCHES, MEANT THAT SOMETHING HAD TO GIVE, AND WHAT GAVE WAS THE MACBOOK PRO AND THE MAC MINI, THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO VOTE OUT THIS PAST OCTOBER. CAROLINE: BLOOMBERGS MARK GURMAN, ALWAYS BRINGING US THE LATEST HEADLINES AND GADGETS FROM THE WORLD OF APPLE. NOW, MICROSOFT PLANS TO CUT JOBS IN ENGINEERING DIVISIONS AS EARLY AS WEDNESDAY, THAT ACCORDING TO A BLOOMBERG SOURCE UNCLEAR HOW MANY OF THE 200,000 WORKERS WILL BE AFFECTED. IT IS THE THIRD ROUND OF LAYOFFS SINCE JULY OF LAST YEAR. MICROSOFT, WHICH DECLINED TO COMMENT, HAS ALSO PAUSED HIRINGS IN MANY DEPARTMENTS. CAROLINE: WE WILL KEEP ON THE CONVERSATION ON MICROSOFT, BECAUSE COMING UP, IT IS GOING ALL IN ON CHAT GPT.
IT LOOKS TO WE DID INTO ITS OFFERINGS PRETTY SOON. WE WILL TALK ABOUT THE AI OPPORTUNITIES AT MICROSOFT AND ALSO INDUSTRYWIDE WITH MICHAEL DEMPSEY,, MANAGING PARTNER AT COMPOUND. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. ♪ CAROLINE: CHAT GPT. STILL IN THE HEADLINES. THIS TIME, BECAUSE MICROSOFT IS PUTTING THE TOOL TO USE. THE TECH GIANT IS MULLING AN ADDITIONAL BILLION DOLLAR IN CHAT GPT. GIVE US A LOOK AT WHAT MICROSOFT PLANS ARE. ED: THIS WAS AN INTERESTING BLOG POST FROM THE COMPANY, PARTLY BECAUSE DAVOS IS GOING ON, BUT ALSO BECAUSE OF HOW FRESH THAT REPORTING WAS. THEY HAVE BEEN BOOSTING THEIR
FUNDING INTO OPEN IT I, THEY HAD ALREADY INVESTED $1 BILLION IN 2019. HE WILL TAKE OPEN A.I.'S TOOLS AND BRING THEM INTO THE AZURE CLOUD PLATFORM. FLIP OVER THE BOARD AND WE CAN
GET SOME DETAIL. IN LIMITED CAPACITY SINCE 2021, MICROSOFT HAS OFFERED A VERY SMALL GROUP OF ITS AZURE CLIENTS THE ABILITY TO USE OPEN I AI TOOLS. IF YOU ARE A COMPANY THAT HOSTS YOUR OWN TOOLS ON THE AZURE CLOUD PLATFORM, YOU NOW HAVE ACCESS TO USE GPT 3.5, DALL- E, FOR EXAMPLE. NOW THEY ARE OPENING THAT UP TO A WIDER RANGE OF CUSTOMERS. WHY DO WE CARE? WHAT IS IN IT FOR MICROSOFT? THERE IS A LOT OF EMPHASIS ON THEIR SEARCH ENGINE, BEING, HOW CHAT GPT COULD IMPROVE THE PLATFORM. THERE IS REPORTING ON THE BLOOMBERG TERMINAL OTHER USE CASES ABOUT HOW THAT LANGUAGE MODELS AND THE UNDERLYING ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE COULD IMPROVE OFFICE, FOR EXAMPLE, AND MICROSOFT TEAMS AS WELL. IT IS AN INVESTMENT OF THERE
BEING MORE OPEN ABOUT ALTHOUGH THERE WAS TO ALLOT THEY DIDN'T SAY IN THAT BLOG POST. CAROLINE: MORE QUESTIONS THAN ANSWERS. LET'S PUT MORE QUESTIONS TO MICHAEL DEMPSEY, MANAGING PARTNER AT COMPOUND AND HAS A NUMBER OF INVESTMENTS IN AI, AND MACHINE LEARNING STARTUPS. MICHAEL, GREAT TO CATCH UP WITH YOU. GIVE US THE ITERATION, THE SCALE , THE APPLICATIONS YOU ARE MOST EXCITED ABOUT FOR SOMETHING LIKE CHAT GPT OR GENERATIVE AI.
>> FIRST CHAT GPT, SEARCH GETS EVERYBODY EXCITED. YOU CAN THINK ABOUT HOW EXISTENTIAL THAT IS TO GOOGLE AND HOW THEIR ECONOMIC MODEL WORKS. I THINK AS YOU START TO SEE MORE AND MORE USE CASES BECOME MORE EMERGENT AND PROFESSIONAL-READY IN AREAS THAT START OFF AS NEEDING INSPIRATION AND MOVE TOWARDS THE 90% PERFECTION AND EVENTUALLY MAKE THEIR WAY, TO 99-PLUS, THINK OF GOOGLE AS AN EXAMPLE, AND IN THE MIDDLE AREAS, YOU CAN THINK ABOUT AREAS LIKE BIOLOGY, MATERIAL DISCOVERY AND THINGS LIKE THAT, AS WELL AS A BUNCH OF OTHER ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE USE CASES. SO WE THINK THIS IS INTERESTING ACROSS A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT INDUSTRIES AND IS GOING TO CUT INTO A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT COMPANY USE MODES ALL THE TIME.
CAROLINE: A LOT OF HANDWRINGING AROUND THE ETHICS OF THIS. IS THAT DEVELOPING SIMULTANEOUSLY WITH THE INNOVATION? ARE YOU WORRIED ABOUT THE RULES, THE REGULATIONS, THE STEERING OF THE ROAD NOT BEING FORMED QUICKLY ENOUGH? MICHAEL: WITH ALL EMERGING TECHNOLOGIES, ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY GET THE KIND OF ADOPTION THAT YOU SEE WITH CHAT GPT, YOU SEE CONCERN ABOUT HOW CAN WE ROLL THIS SAFE. I DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT AS MUCH. THERE IS A LOT OF OPEN QUESTIONS ABOUT ARTIST ATTRIBUTION. ABOUT FAIR USAGE OF CERTAIN TYPES OF DATA. WHEREAS IF YOU ARE PULLING FROM
A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT SOURCES, SHOULD YOU CITE THOSE SOURCES? IN GENERAL, I THINK THE VALUE OUTSTRIPS THE DOWNSIDES, AND WE REALLY SHOULD FOCUS ON THE OPTIMISTIC VERSION OF THESE TECHNOLOGIES. ED: ARE YOU SURPRISED, AS SOMEBODY TRACKING THE SPACE, BETWEEN THE TIME THAT REPORTS CAME OUT THAT MICROSOFT WAS THINKING ABOUT BOOSTING ITS INVESTMENT IN OPENAI, AND THEN LAST NIGHT WHEN A BLOG POST COMES OUT ABOUT HOW THEY WILL INCORPORATE THE UNDERLYING TECHNOLOGY INTO THEIR OWN PLATFORMS? AS SOMEBODY WHO KNOWS HOW THESE DEALS WORK AND ALSO WHAT THE UTILITY IS, WHAT IS YOUR READ ON THE NEWS ANNOUNCEMENTS? MICHAEL: I THINK IT IS JUST CONTINUALLY I AM IMPRESSED BY MICROSOFT OVER YEARS NOW. I THINK THEY SEE THE STRATEGIC ASSET THAT HAVING THESE FOUNDATION MODELS AND LARGE LANGUAGE MODELS INTEGRATED INTO THEIR PRODUCTS CAN BE AND HOW IT CAN ALLOW THEM TO BEAT COMPETITORS. AND I THINK WHAT YOU ARE GOING
TO SEE IS, AS WE ALL KNOW, OTHER LARGE COMPANIES FIGURING OUT WHAT THEY ARE GOING TO DO. GOOGLE WAS THE MOST NOTABLE ONE ON THE SIDELINE. I THINK THEY HAVE BIGGER REGULATORY HEADWINDS AND SO THEY ARE BEING CAREFUL ABOUT THIS. BUT I THINK ALL OF US KNEW THE
SCALE OF PEOPLE THAT HAD CARED ABOUT THESE PROBLEMS THERE, THAT WERE INTERESTED IN FIGURING OUT WHAT ARE THE WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN DISRUPT OURSELVES AND/OR DISRUPT OUR BIGGEST COMPETITORS. FOR MICROSOFT, IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT DISRUPTING COMPETITORS, SPECIFICALLY FROM THE ENTERPRISE LAYER. I THINK WE ARE GOING TO SEE THAT MICROSOFT'S AMBITIONS WILL EXPAND FAR OUTSIDE OF JUST ENTERPRISE WHERE, AND I THINK -- ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE, AND I THINK PEOPLE WILL BE SURPRISED IN THE NEXT FEW MONTHS. ED: I AM SEEING PARALLELS IN THE EXPERIENCE YOU ARE SEEING, PARTICULAR IN YOUR INBOX. LOTS OF EMAILED HAVE COME ACROSS -- AMONG US ABOUT AI. IT IS HARD TO DISTINGUISH
BETWEEN THOSE PLAYERS THAT HAVE GENUINE PROMISE, THOSE WHO HAVE SOMETHING UNIQUE ABOUT IT, STRONG UNDERLYING TECHNOLOGY OR IP. IS THAT YOUR EXPERIENCE? ARE YOU GETTING PICTURES QUESTION MARK PEOPLE SEEKING INVESTMENT, FROM YOU AND YOU ARE SAYING I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS REAL IN THE WORLD OF AI AND WHAT IS NOT? MICHAEL: AS SOMEONE WHO HAS SPENT EIGHT YEARS IN AI, AND A SIMILAR TIME IN CRYPTO FROM 2016 ON, I AM USED TO THESE HYPE CYCLES. THE VERBIAGE, WHETHER IT IS WEB3 OR NOW AI TO THEIR PITCH. BUT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT ARE THE CORE SPECIAL SKILLS OF THESE FUNDERS OR ENTREPRENEURS. ARE THEY PRODUCT OR TECHNOLOGY-CENTRIC? EARLY DISTRIBUTION-CENTRIC? MOST OF THESE TEAMS ARE NOT DISTRIBUTION-CENTRIC. IF YOU ARE NOT THERE, YOU HAVE TO BE ELITE ON THE PRODUCT SIDE. SO I THINK WE WILL SEE BOTH A
LOT OF PEOPLE WHO PITCH AI AND NEVER GET THERE, BUT ALSO, A BUNCH OF PEOPLE THAT INTEGRATE OPENAI OR OTHER COMPANIES' APIS AND BUILD PRODUCTS, BUT ARE SUFFERING FROM DEATHS BY A THOUSAND CUTS, HAVING NO REAL MODES FOR THESE BUSINESSES. CAROLINE: I THINK BACK TO A U.K. START THAT GOOGLE PURCHASED, AND THE FOCUS U.K. HAD IN ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE. WHERE IN THE WORLD ARE THESE STARTUPS BEING BUILT AT THE MOMENT, THEY SEEM U.S. CENTRIC AT THIS TIME? MICHAEL: THE U.K. IS ONE OF THE MOST INTERESTING PLACES IN THE WORLD FOR ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE TODAY.
IT IS THE U.S., CANADA, AND THE U.K.. EUROPE HAS A FEW DISPARATE AREAS, BUT THE CONCENTRATION OF TALENT IN THOSE PLACES IS PRETTY OBVIOUS. THE BEST PART FOR THE U.K. SPECIFICALLY, THERE IS A COMPANY CALLED WITH A IVR INVESTED IN, A SOFT MICHAEL: -- SELF-DRIVING COMPANY. WE ARE SEEING A RENAISSANCE OF THESE MACHINE LEARNING RESEARCHERS NO LONGER WANTING TO BE IN RESEARCH OR ACADEMIC SETTINGS. SO I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE IN EUROPE AND LONDON SPECIFICALLY WERE IN DEEPMIND, REALLY ENJOYING PUBLISHING THEIR PAPERS, AND NOW THEY ARE SEEING CHATGPT HIT 5 MILLION PEOPLE IN A COUPLE OF DAYS AND SAYING, IT'S BEEN COOL SITTING AROUND IN WORKING ON TECHNOLOGY FOR A FEW YEARS, BUT IT IS TIME TO GO AND BUILD. ED:
MICHAEL DEMPSEY, MANAGING PARTNER AT COMPOUND. TRYING TO DISCERN WHAT HAS PROMISE, AND WHAT DOES NOT, IN THE WORLD OF AI. COMING UP, THE ENERGY CRISIS IN EUROPE. POTENTIAL RECESSION IN THE U.S.. IS THERE STILL SOME LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL? ED: IN DAVOS, WHERE THE WORLD ECONOMIC FORUM IS UNDERWAY, SOME TECH LEADERS ARE OPTIMISTIC ABOUT THE ECONOMY. IBM'S VICE CHAIRMAN GARY COHN,
SPOKE TO BLOOMBERG'S DAVID WESTIN ABOUT THAT, AND THE ENERGY CRISIS IN EUROPE. HAVE A LISTEN. >> I THOUGHT THAT THE RISK TO GERMANY WAS REALLY THE ENERGY SITUATION GOING INTO THE WINTER, TO THE EXTENT THAT WE HAD A REALLY COLD WINTER AND THEY HAD TO START RATIONING ENERGY AND THEY HAD TO CUT BACK INDUSTRIAL GERMANY TO KEEP PEOPLE WARM. I FELT THAT THAT WAS A REALLY TOUGH SITUATION POTENTIALLY. WE ARE NOW DEEP ENOUGH INTO THE WINTER THAT WE KNOW WHERE WE ARE , WE KNOW WHAT IS IN RESERVE AND IN STORAGE. I THINK GERMANY WILL GET THROUGH THE WINTER EASILY AND THEY WILL CONTINUE TO POWER THROUGH THIS, SO I AM IN AGREEMENT WITH THE CHANCELLOR.
DAVID: BIGGEST ECONOMY IN EUROPE. WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT EUROPE IN GENERAL? GARY: I THINK GERMANY WILL GET THROUGH THIS. THE U.K., NOT SO CLEAR. IT'S A DIFFICULT SITUATION, IN THE U.S. WHEN WE RAISE INTEREST RATES,
WE CAN ALL HANDLE IT. THE INTEREST RATE PICTURE IN EUROPE THAT CHRISTINE LAGARDE HAS TO DEAL WITH IS DIFFERENT. GERMANY CAN HANDLE HIGHER INTEREST RATES IF YOU START RAISING INTEREST RATES. EUROPE HAS MORE DIFFICULTY WITH THE REALITY OF WHAT IS GOING ON. DAVID: DAVID: YOU ARE DIRECTOR AT THE NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL. IN THE UNITED STATES, WHAT ARE THE CHANCES OF RECESSION? I SPOKE WITH JEAN FRASER OF CITI, SHE'S THINGS SHE THINKS I CAN HAVE, IT IS POSSIBLE. GARY: SENTIMENTGARY:
IS NEGATIVE, SO THAT TELLS ME IT SHOULD BE POSITIVE. [LAUGHTER] I HAD DINNER LAST NIGHT WITH A LOT OF GLOBAL CEOS. MOST OF THEM RAISED THEIR HAND THAT THEY WERE NEGATIVE ABOUT THE ECONOMY. BUT WHEN THEY TALKED ABOUT THEIR BUSINESS, THEY WERE ALL PRETTY POSITIVE ABOUT THEIR BUSINESSES. I THINK EVERYONE THINKS EVERYONE ELSE HAS A PROBLEM.
I AM PRETTY OPTIMISTIC. THAT DOESN'T MEAN WE ARE A BULLISH ECONOMY. WHAT I AM OPTIMISTIC ABOUT IS I THINK WE CAN MUDDLE THROUGH WHERE WE ARE. I THINK THE FED IS GETTING TO THE END OF THEIR TIGHTENING CYCLE. WE MAY HAVE A COUPLE OF MORE 25 BASIS POINT INCREASES FROM THE FED, TOP OUT AROUND 5% IN FED FUNDS, BUT I THINK WE HAVE FACTORED THAT INTO THE SITUATION, AND I THINK WE ARE IN A RELATIVELY GOOD SITUATION.
. THE CONSUMER IS OK. THEY ARE NOT GREAT, WE ARE STARTING TO SEE A FEW CRACKS, THE ECONOMY IS SLOWING DOWN. BUT I THINK WE ARE GOING TO MUDDLE THROUGH. CAROLINE: MUDDLING THROUGH WITH IBM'S VICE CHAIR GARY COHN, THERE IN DAVOS. SHARES OF THE BANK SILVER GATE SPIKED AS IT OUTLINES STEPS LIKE SHEDDING ASSETS -- SHEDDING ASSETS. SILVER GATE IS A LENDER FOCUSED ON DIGITAL ASSET INDUSTRY WORLD AT LARGE AND IT IS TRYING TO NAVIGATE THE FALLOUT FROM FTX WHICH PROMPTED CLIENTS TO WITHDRAW IT MORE THAN $7 BILLION IN DEPOSITS. THE COMPANY HAS SAID IT HAS MORE THAN $6 BILLION IN CASH ON HAND. ED:
OF BIG INTEREST TO OUR AUDIENCE IN SILICON VALLEY AND ALSO GLOBALLY WAS THE WARRIORS OVER THE WHITE HOUSE. KEY STARTUP INVESTORS INCLUDING STEPH CURRY WHO LOOKS AT THE WORLD OF STARTUPS. AND YOU HAVE ONE OF THE CO-OWNERS AND A CLIENT AT PERKINS.
A BIG DAY FOR THE BAY AREA. CAROLINE: WELCOME BACK TO "BLOOMBERG TECHNOLOGY." ED, IT'S A PRETTY RARE CASE OF AN ACTIVIST TARGETING A PROMINENT CHINESE COMPANY. MEME STOCK ROYALTY RYAN COHEN
HAS TAKEN A STAKE IN ALIBABA AND HE WANTS THE E-COMMERCE GIANT TO BUY BACK MORE SHARES. THAT COULD PUT COHEN MAYBE EVEN AT ODDS WITH XI JINPING, WHOSE ADMINISTRATION HAS WIPED OUT ALIBABA AND OTHER BIG TECH COMPANIES. BUT IS IT A RETURNING OF THE GUARD? FIRST AND FOREMOST, WE KNOW HIS POWER OVER GAMESTOP, BED, BATH & BEYOND, BUT HE DOES NOT HAVE MUCH POWER OVER THE SHARE PRICE MOVEMENT OF ALIBABA.
>> IT IS INTERESTING BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT THE STOCK MARKET REACTION, ALIBABA IS DOWN ABOUT 1.6% DURING THE U.S. SESSION AND ONLY MANAGED TO GO UP SLIGHTLY OVERNIGHT IN HONG KONG WHEN THE NEWS INITIALLY CAME OUT. IT IS VERY DIFFERENT FROM THE HUGE RALLY WE SAW IN THE MEME STOCK. I THINK IT POINTS TO SOMETHING ABOUT BIGGER QUESTIONS HEARING FROM INVESTORS. BECAUSE THIS IS A CHINESE COMPANY AND AS FOR AN ACTIVIST, HOW MUCH REAL IMPACT AND INFLUENCE HE COULD HAVE ON THE BOARD. BECAUSE FIRST, HIS STAKE IS PRETTY SMALL. THINK ABOUT ALIBABA AS THIS
HUGE TECH GIANT OF MORE THAN 300 BILLION MARKET CAP, AND HIS POSITION IS LIKE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS, SO THAT IS LIMITED POWER. ALSO I THINK WHAT IS TRICKY AND MORE INTERESTING IS BEIJING'S PERSPECTIVE. BEIJING IS TAKING OFF THE SO-CALLED GOLDEN CHEERS. IT IS A MINORITY STAKE, BUT IT WILL ALLOW THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT TO HAVE THE RIGHTS, OR THE CONTROL, OR INFLUENCE ON THE BOARD AND SWAY IMPORTANT DECISIONS.
FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, THE ACTIVISTS COULD BE UNDERMINED IF THEY ARE AT ODDS. I THINK THAT ALSO POINTS TO THE OVERALL BACKGROUND. IT IS VERY RARE IN CHINA. ASIAN INVESTORS ARE ALSO JUST NOT THAT FAMILIAR WITH THAT KIND OF CONCEPT. ED: IT WAS ONLY LAST THURSDAY THE REPORTS CAME OUT THAT CHINESE GOVERNMENT ENTITIES WERE TAKING SO-CALLED GOLDEN SHARES NOT JUST OF ALIBABA BUT TENCENT AS WELL. AND ACTIVISM IS MORE RARE WHEN
IT COMES TO CHINA TECH, MAINLAND CHINESE COMPANIES. MY QUESTION IS, YOU STRIP OUT ALL THE NOISE AND DEMANDS, WHAT IS THE OUTLOOK FOR ALIBABA? THERE WAS A BIT MORE OPTIMISM AT THE END OF 2022 BECAUSE THERE WAS A PULLBACK ON COVID ZERO, A BIT MORE SUPPORTIVE OF STOCKS. YIQIN: THAT'S RIGHT. RIGHT NOW, FOR ACTIVIST INVESTORS, IT IS A PRETTY GOOD ENTRY POINT BECAUSE MANY WOULD ARGUE NOW WE ARE AT AN INFLECTION POINT FOR CHINA EQUITIES. LIKE YOU MENTIONED, IT IS BECAUSE OF THE CHINA REOPENING TRADES RAISING HOPE. ALSO ON THE REGULATORY FRONT WE
ARE SEEING MORE AND MORE SIGNS BEIJING IS FINALLY EASING AWAY FROM REGULATORY CRACKDOWN, AND THAT IS THE INITIAL TRIGGER THAT CAUSED THE BRUTAL SELLOFF IN ALIBABA. SO NOW PEOPLE ARE MORE CONVINCED THE WORST IS BEHIND, AND HOPEFULLY WITH THIS INFLUENTIAL INVESTOR'S ENGAGEMENT, IT WILL LIVE TO SENTIMENT OR BRING MORE ATTENTION FROM THE RETAIL TRADERS IN THE U.S. CAROLINE: WHAT ABOUT ALIBABA BUYING BACK ITS OWN STOCK? GIVEN IT IS STILL AT ABOUT 60% DISCOUNT VERSUS THE HIGHS OF 2020. WOULD ALIBABA MANAGEMENT WITH OR WITHOUT RYAN COHEN THINK IT IS A GOOD IDEA? YIQIN: I AGREE.
ALIBABA HAS ACTUALLY ALREADY STARTED TO DO SO FROM LAST YEAR AND HAS EXPANDED SHAREHOLDER SHARE BUYBACK PROGRAMS. I THINK IT JUST REMAINS TO BE SEEN IF THEY RAMP UP EFFORTS, BUT IT IS ALREADY ON THE TABLE. ED: IF YOU ARE RYAN COHEN AND YOU ARE TRYING TO CONVINCE ALIBABA'S BOARD OR THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT OF CHANGE, WHICH DEMAND DO YOU THINK IS MOST LIKELY? IT IS A DIFFICULT QUESTION, BUT WHICH DEMAND IS HE PUSHING FOR MOST? YIQIN: I WOULD THINK SHARE BUYBACK IS PROBABLY THE RIGHT ASPECT, JUST GIVEN THAT THEY ARE SITTING ON PILES OF CASH AND HOW TO BETTER USE THAT PART OF CAPITAL IS A STRATEGY I THINK THE BOARD NEEDS TO BE CONSIDERED THOROUGHLY. CAROLINE: FASCINATING. ALIBABA HAS 50 TIMES THE SIZE OF GAMESTOP? QUITE A DIFFERENT BALLPARK HE IS PLAYING IN NOW. YIQIN SHEN, WE THANK YOU SO
MUCH FOR STAYING ON TOP OF THE NEWS. MEANWHILE, WE HAVE HAD A BIT OF NEWS IN THE WORLD OF AUTOS. ED: YEAH, IT WAS AN INTERESTING EARLY START TALKING TO GM, BECAUSE CHEVROLET JUST UNVEILED THE FIRST EVER ELECTRIFIED CORVETTE. OK, ELECTRIFIED, KIND OF.
70 YEARS AFTER THE FIRST CORVETTE CONCEPT WAS UNVEILED IN NEW YORK CITY, THIS IS A HYBRID. 0 TO 60 IN 2.5 SECONDS. NOT A PLUG-IN HYBRID, THOUGH. I CAUGHT UP WITH GM'S PRESIDENT ABOUT WHY THEY PUT A BATTERY OF SORTS IN THEIR SPORTS CAR, AND WHAT THIS FITS IN WITH GM'S TRANSITION TO ELECTRIC.
TAKE A LISTEN. >> THE CAR ITSELF IS SO DIFFERENT. AND IT REALLY IS SOMETHING THAT TAKES ADVANTAGE OF ARCHITECTURE AND GETTING POWER TO THE FRONT AND REAR WHEELS THAT MAKES IT ALL WEATHER MACHINE. WE ARE VERY PROUD OF IT. IT IS AN ENGINEERING MARVEL. TODAY IS A BIG DAY FOR THE
WHOLE TEAM. ED: THIS IS THE FASTEST EVER PRODUCTION CORVETTE. THE ELECTRIC, OR ELECTRIFIED PROPULSION SYSTEM IS A BIG PART OF THAT. GOING BACK TO BASICS, THIS IS NOT A PLUG-IN HYBRID, THERE ARE TWO SIMILAR PROPULSION SYSTEMS THAT WORK IN CONJUNCTION WITH ONE ANOTHER. MY QUESTION IS, IS THIS A SIGN
THAT THE CORVETTE CUSTOMER IS NOT READY TO GO FULL ELECTRIC, TO GO FULL BATTERY ELECTRIC? MARK: THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION. I THINK THE CORVETTE CUSTOMER IS EVER-CHANGING, AND SO IS THE CAR. AND SO I WOULD SAY THIS IS THE NEXT STEP IN THE EVOLUTION OF GETTING 160 HORSEPOWER IN THE FRONT AND 490 HORSEPOWER IN THE REAR, ALL TO THE GROUND. AND SO IT IS A LITTLE FASTER, A LITTLE QUICKER I SHOULD SAY THAN THE Z06, AT 2.5 SECONDS. BUT IT'S VERY DIFFERENT. SO WHEN YOU DRIVE THE CAR, IT IS AT HOME ON THE TRACK, IT IS AT HOME EVERY DAY, AS CORVETTES USUALLY ARE, ON ALL STREETS.
THIS IS THE NEXT STEP. AS I SAID, THE CORVETTE BUYER IS EVER-CHANGING. AND SO, THIS IS A PRETTY EXCITING TIME FOR US. AND I DO NOT THINK IT IS A QUESTION OF WHETHER SOMEONE IS READY OR NOT. I THINK PEOPLE, WHEN THEY LOOK AT THE CAR AND IT IS COVER THE INTEGRATION OF THE POWER, AS YOU MENTIONED ED, AND HOW WE ARE DOING IT AND THE SOPHISTICATION AND THE INTEGRATION, THINGS LIKE STEALTH MODE AND THE LAUNCH ITSELF. AND LIKE I SAID, THE VEHICLE
DYNAMICS ON THE TRACK, WHEN YOU ACTUALLY HAVE THE FRONT WHEELS ACTUALLY PULLING AND DOING THINGS THAT THE REGULAR DOESN'T DO. I THINK IT IS JUST THE NEXT EVOLUTION IN PROPULSION PERFORMANCE VEHICLE DYNAMICS AND SOPHISTICATION. ED: LET'S GET AN UPDATE ON THE ELECTRIFICATION PLAN MORE BROADLY. THERE IS A LOT OF EXCITEMENT, AND QUITE CLEARLY A BOOK OF DEMAND FOR THE LYRIC AND THE HUMMERY V. FROM BLOOMBERG'S REPORTING, THE OUTLOOK STILL SEEMS QUITE LOW FOR THOSE TWO VEHICLES.
WHAT WAS THE SITUATION THERE? MARK: WE BIT OFF A LOT IN TERMS OF HAVING LOWER VOLUME VEHICLES. SO OUR OWN CELL PLANTS ARE BROUGHT ONLINE. WE JUST BROUGHT OUR FIRST PLANT ONLINE FOR THE SELLS OF ALL THOSE VEHICLES IN OHIO. THE NEXT ONE ON A VOLUME BASIS COMES IN SPRINGHILL, WHICH IS BUILT JUST ADJACENT TO THE LYRIC. ALSO, THESE ARE ALL NEW ELECTRIC VEHICLE PLATFORMS. THEY ARE NOT RETROFIT
ARCHITECTURES WITH BATTERIES, AS SOME OF OUR COMPETITORS HAVE DONE. WE ARE DOING THIS RIGHT, WE ARE DOING IT FOR THE NEXT 20 YEARS, WE ARE NOT DOING IT FOR THE NEXT TWO YEARS. I THINK YOU ARE GOING TO SEE THOSE CELL PLANTS COME ONLINE IN HALL VOLUME, AND YOU ARE GOING TO SEE THE OUTPUT OF THE FIRST VEHICLES INCREASED DRAMATICALLY OVER THE NEXT YEAR. CAROLINE: GM PRESIDENT WITH OUR OWN ED LUDLOW.
MORE NEWS IN THE AUTO WORLD FOR YOU. UBER AND HERTZ ARE JOINING FORCES ACROSS EUROPE AND HERTZ WILL BE MAKING AS MANY AS 25,000 ELECTRIC VEHICLES AVAILABLE TO UBER DRIVERS IN EUROPEAN CAPITAL CITIES BY 2025. ALMOST 50,000 UBER DRIVERS HAVE RENTED A TESLA THROUGH HERTZ. SO THE EXPANSION IS GOING TO BEGIN IN LONDON THIS MONDAY. ED:
FASCINATING. WE TALK ABOUT DEMAND. I ASKED WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO GET ALL THOSE EV'S FROM. A NEW BILL IN THE U.K. COULD PUT TECH EXECUTIVES BEHIND BARS. THIS IS BLOOMBERG.
♪ ED: META PLATFORM'S PRESIDENT OF GLOBAL PLATFORMS SAYS THE COMPANY IS INNATE PERIOD -- IS IN A PERIOD OF TRANSITION, BUT ALSO IN THE VERY EARLY STAGES OF THAT TRANSITION TO THE METAVERSE. THAT IS AS A SCRUTINY IS PLACED ON SOCIAL MEDIA APPS AROUND THE WORLD. HE SPOKE ABOUT THE TRANSITION AND THE THREAT OF OTHER TECH GIANTS LIKE TIKTOK OWNER BYTEDANCE. >> I THINK YOU SEE THIS HUGE PENDULUM SWING FROM THE TECH EUPHORIA OF THE PAST WHERE TECH COULD DO NO WRONG.
THE ERA OF THE ARAB SPRING WHERE ALL THINGS BRIGHT AND BEAUTIFUL WERE HELD TO BE PRODUCED BY TECH AND NOW OF COURSE THE PENDULUM HAS SWUNG PRETTY DRAMATICALLY IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION. AND EVERYTHING THAT IS BAD, WHETHER AN ELECTION OR REFERENDUM OUTCOME PEOPLE DON'T LIKE, IS ASCRIBED TO SOCIAL MEDIA. PART OF FINDING A RESTING PLACE FOR THAT PENDULUM, BECAUSE EXTREME OPTIMISM AND EXTREME PESSIMISM ARE BOTH AS FOOLISH AS EACH OTHER. OF COURSE INVOLVES REGULATION.
THERE ARE ISSUES LIKE DATA PRIVACY, CONTENT RULES, DATA PORTABILITY, THE RULES OF HOW SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORMS SHOULD OPERATE DURING ELECTION TIME AND SO ON. ALL OF THOSE ARE RULES THAT SHOULD BE SET, NOT BY TECHNOLOGISTS, NOT BY ENGINEERS ON THE WEST COAST, BUT BY LEGISLATORS ELECTED BY VOTERS. I THINK THAT IS THE PROCESS YOU ARE SEEING. IT IS MOST ADVANCED IN EUROPE, BUT YOU ARE SEEING THAT DEBATE IN D.C. AS WELL.
IT IS NOT PRODUCING LEGISLATION AS MUCH AS IT OCCURS, BUT ALSO IN BRUSSELS, IN LONDON, IN AUSTRALIA, YOU ARE SEEING THIS MOVE TOWARDS REGULATION. I SUSPECT SOME OF IT WILL NOT STAND THE TEST OF TIME, AND OTHER BITS OF REGULATION WILL MAKE SENSE AND WILL STAND THE TEST OF TIME. >> I SUSPECT ONE OF THE REASONS YOU HAVE YOUR IMPORTANT POSITION IN META IS YOU HAVE BEEN ON BOTH SIDES.
YOU HAVE BEEN DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER OF THE U.K., SO YOU HAVE SEEN THE GOVERNMENT SIDE OF IT, AND NOW YOU ARE SEEING THE PRIVATE SECTOR SIDE OF IT AS WELL. I AM NOT SAYING THERE IS ANY RIGHT ANSWER, BUT GIVE US SOME PRINCIPLES. FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE ON BOTH SIDES OF, WHAT ARE SOME BASIC PRINCIPLES YOU THINK SHOULD BE FOLLOWED? NICK: I THINK THE SECRET IS IN THAT NAME, THAT WORD, PRINCIPLES. WHEN THINGS GO WRONG,
LEGISLATORS -- WHO ARE NOT TECHNOLOGISTS, THEY DON'T KNOW HOW AI WORKS AND SO FORTH -- I THINK WHERE THINGS GO WRONG IS WHERE LEGISLATORS TRY AND IMPOSE SOME SORT OF STATIC CONDITION ON TECHNOLOGY THAT MOVES VERY FAST. I THINK WHERE LEGISLATION AND REGULATION MAKES MORE SENSE IS WHEN IT IS BASED ON SOME PRINCIPLES WHICH ARE SORT OF EVERGREEN PRINCIPLES THAT CAN APPLY TO DIFFERENT TECHNOLOGY, AND TO TECHNOLOGIES THAT INVOLVE -- THAT EVOLVE OVER TIME. LOOK AT THESE BIG COMPANIES LIKE META, GOOGLE, APPLE AND SO ON. LOOK AT THEIR SYSTEMS, HOLD THEIR SYSTEMS TO ACCOUNT, BUT DON'T TRY TO MICROMANAGE THEIR CONTENT OR EVERY CHANGE IN THE CODE THAT IS USED TO PRODUCE THE PRODUCT. I THINK THAT IS THE FUNDAMENTAL
LESSON THAT I HAVE CERTAINLY KIND OF OBSERVED SO FAR. >> IT STRIKES ME ONE OF THE BIG ISSUES NOT JUST IN DAVOS BUT FOR THE GLOBE RIGHT NOW, IS SOME DIFFERENCES IN SYSTEMS. THERE ARE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN EUROPE AND THE U.S., BUT FUNDAMENTALLY THE SYSTEMS OF THE SAME. CHINA IS QUITE DIFFERENT. TWO SOCIAL MEDIA, INCLUDING
OTHER THINGS. CAN WE HAVE A WORLD WHERE THEY ARE INTEGRATED OR CAN IT BE BIFURCATED? NICK: I THINK THEY ALREADY HAVE BIFURCATED. WE DON'T HAVE A GLOBAL INTERNET. IT DOES NOT EXIST. WE HAVE A CHINESE INTERNET, WHICH ON ITS OWN TERMS IS HIGHLY SUCCESSFUL. IT IS WALLED OFF FROM THE REST OF THE WORLD, SUBJECT TO A GREAT DEAL OF INTERNAL SURVEILLANCE, BUT IT DOES NOT WELCOME -- FOR INSTANCE, FACEBOOK IS NOT ALLOWED TO OPERATE IN CHINA, WHILE CHINESE COMPANIES ARE ALLOWED TO BE IN THE U.S. >> HOW BIG OF A RISK IS TIKTOK? BECAUSE MANY IN WASHINGTON THINK IT IS. NICK: I WILL LEAVE THAT TO THE
NATIONAL SECURITY EXPERT. WHEN I WILL OBSERVE TO YOUR EARLIER QUESTION, THERE IS NOT A LEVEL PLAYING FIELD. CHINESE SOCIAL MEDIA COMPANIES ARE ABLE TO OPERATE BOTH IN CHINA AND IN EUROPE AND AMERICA. WE ARE ABLE TO OPERATE IN
AMERICA AND EUROPE, BUT NOT IN CHINA. AT THE MOMENT, THERE'S AN IMBALANCE THERE, WHICH IN THE LONG RUN I DO NOT THINK MAKES A WHOLE LOT OF SENSE. IT IS PARTLY BECAUSE THE APPROACH TO DATA, THE APPROACH TO PRIVACY IS JUST VERY, VERY DIFFERENT CULTURALLY, LEGALLY, AND POLITICALLY IN CHINA THAN IT IS ELSEWHERE. THEN THERE ARE SUBTLER, NARROW
DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE EU AND THE U.S. AS WELL. ONE OF THE INTERESTING DYNAMICS YOU HAVE IS THAT YOU HAVE THE EUROPEAN UNION NOW LEADING ON NEW RULES AND REGULATION, BUT NOT LEADING TECHNOLOGICALLY OR COMMERCIALLY. ALL THE BIG TECH GIANTS ARE EITHER IN THE UNITED STATES OR CHINA, AND YET IT IS EUROPE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE BIG TECH GIANTS WHO IS INVENTING THE RULES FOR THEM. SO IT IS A VERY INTERESTING JIGSAW. I WOULD ACTUALLY ADD A FOURTH ELEMENT, INDIA. YOU HAVE EUROPE, AMERICA, CHINA, AND INDIA, THOSE ARE THE FOUR GREAT BIG JIGSAW PIECES THAT MAKE UP HOW THE AND TONIGHT -- THE INTERNET OPERATES IN THE MODERN WORLD.
CAROLINE: META PLATFORM PRESIDENT OF GLOBAL AFFAIRS NICK CLEGG HAVING A VERY GLOBAL AND LEGISLATION FOCUSED CONVERSATION THERE. LET'S TALK ABOUT THE U.K., WHERE NICK CLEGG USED TO BE, WELL, DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER. IT COULD BE ON THE VERGE OF
PASSING LEGISLATION THAT COMMITS SOCIAL MEDIA BOSSES BEHIND BARS IF THEY BREAK CERTAIN RULES. PRIME MINISTER RISHI SUNAK INTENDS TO SIGN THE ONLINE SAFETY BILL WITH CRIMINAL SANCTIONS FOR TECH EXECUTIVES. THE BILL AIMS TO PROTECT ANYONE UNDER 18 FROM HARMFUL CONTENT. THAT MEANS IF YOUR REGULATORS FIND A PLATFORM HAS BEEN PUSHING TEENS TO SEE CONTENT INCITING VIOLENCE, MISINFORMATION, SOME EXECUTIVES COULD FACE UP TO TWO YEARS BEHIND BARS. THE SAFETY BILL IS EXPECTED TO BE SIGNED AS EARLY AS SPRING, ED. THIS IS AFTER BUT WAS A BIG BACKLASH FROM HIS OWN CONSERVATIVE PARTY MEMBERS, THE BACK BENCHES AS THEY ARE KNOWN, WANTING TO TAKE OUT A CERTAIN AMENDMENT THAT WOULD REMOVE ANY CRIMINAL LIABILITY.
WHAT IS SO INTERESTING IS BASICALLY TAKING A LEAF OUT OF IRELAND'S BOOK, BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE THIS PRECEDENT SET. ED: ALL SOCIAL MEDIA PLAYERS HAVE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THIS ISSUE FOR YEARS. I THINK META IS A REALLY INTERESTING EXAMPLE IN LIGHT OF WHAT THE U.K. IS DOING. GO BACK TO 2019, ZUCKERBERG'S OP-ED IN THE WASHINGTON POST, WE NEED NEW RULES FOR THE INTERNET. META, THEN FACEBOOK, SHOULD NOT
BE THE ONE TO FORM THOSE RULES. THEN THE META OVERSIGHT BOARD WAS BROUGHT IN. IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN THAT SOMEONE ELSE SHOULD ACT. NOW THEY ARE ACTING, AND THIS IS A PRETTY SEVERE COURSE OF ACTION IF IT IS TO BE TAKEN. CAROLINE: THE IRISH LEGISLATION, IT DOES HAVE CHECKS BEFORE THAT. IT IS NOT SUDDENLY YOU ARE DEEMED LEGALLY CULPABLE AND PUT BEHIND BARS.
YOU APPARENTLY GET A SERIES OF CHECKS, INCLUDING IF THEY DO NOT COMPLY WITH WARNING NOTICES FROM THE COUNTRY'S ONLINE SAFETY COMMISSIONER. THESE RULES ARE ALREADY APPLIED TO CERTAIN INDUSTRIES IN THE U.K. JUST THINK OF BUILDERS, FOR EXAMPLE, CONSTRUCTION COMPANY, BANKS, EVEN, DO HAVE A LAYER OF ACCOUNTABILITY UP TO THE HIGHEST EXECUTIVES. IT WILL BE INTERESTING HOW THIS IS KIND OF NAVIGATED, BOTH LEGALLY AND IN PRACTICE. ED: YEAH, AND SOCIAL MEDIA IS JUST AS SOCIETALLY IMPORTANT AS THOSE THINGS YOU JUST MENTIONED. WE WILL SEE. COMING UP, CAN YOU PUT A PRICE
ON LOVE? TINDER IS CONSIDERING A SUBSCRIPTION THAT WILL COST YOU, WAIT FOR IT, $6000 A YEAR. THIS IS BLOOMBERG. ♪ >> CAN YOU PUT A PRICE ON LOVE? HINGE, THE DATING APP OWNED BY MATCH, THANKS SO. THEY ARE GOING TO OFFER A NEW SUSPICION LEVEL AT $50 TO $60 A MONTH. THE IDEA IS TO GO AFTER GEN Z APP USERS WHO ARE QUOTE, HIGHLY MOTIVATED DATERS, AND IN RETURN OFFER THEM ENHANCED FEATURES THAT BOOST THEIR PROFILE AND THEIR CHANCES OF FINDING A MATCH. BUT IT IS QUITE A JUMP FROM HINGE'S EXISTING $35 A MONTH OFFERING. MATCH TEASED THE NEW HINGE TIER IN THEIR NEW EARNINGS REPORT, SAYING IT WOULD BE TARGETED", THE MOST INTENTIONED USERS WHO HAVE A HIGHER, QUOTE, PROPENSITY TO PAY.
$50 TO SIX DOLLARS A MONTH? CAN YOU PUT A PRICE ON LOVE? CAROLINE: CAN YOU? DID YOU? I MEAN, I KNOW THAT YOU ARE A MAN WHO -- WELL, MANY HAVE FOUND LOVE THROUGH CERTAIN DATING APPLICATIONS. IN HINDSIGHT WOULD YOU SPEND $6000 A YEAR? IT IS KIND OF AN AMAZINGLY TO BE AMPLIFYING YOUR MARGIN. ED: THESE ARE TWO DIFFERENT PRODUCTS. YOU HAVE HINGE, $60 A MONTH, PALATABLE. YOU THEN HAVE TINDER THINKING
ABOUT $500 A MONTH. WE ASKED THE AUDIENCE WHAT DID THEY THINK. I THINK THE RESULTS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES, CAROLINE. CAROLINE: WE THREW IN, ARE YOU SITTING ON THE FENCE, OR DO YOU THINK THIS IS ALL RIDICULOUS, AND IT SEEMS IT IS ALL RIDICULOUS. ROMANCE IS DEAD, 61% SAID THAT. 7% SAID SIGN ME UP. I THINK THIS IS TRYING TO TAKE
ON THE ELITE-ORIENTED DATING APPS, WHERE YOU DO PAY AN AMOUNT BUT YOU GET PERHAPS SPECIFIC TARGETED AUDIENCES, DO YOU THINK? ED: FULL DISCLOSURE, I MET MY WIFE ON HINGE ALL THOSE YEARS AGO. HAD I KNOWN THEN WHAT I KNOW NOW? I WOULD COUGH UP THE CASH. CAROLINE: WEDNESDAY WE ARE GO TO TALK ALL THINGS CRYPTO AND BITCOIN'S BULLISH RUN. ED: DON'T FORGET, THERE'S SO MUCH TO RECAP.
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