NASA in Silicon Valley Live - Apollo 50th Anniversary Show
Dan. Eight. Seven. Six. Five. Four, three. Two. Hi. Everybody. Welcome. To another episode, of, NASA and Silicon Valley live, I, am your host Tiffany Blake, if this. Is your first time tuning in to the show NASA, and Silicon Valley live is a conversational, show out, of NASA's, Ames Research Center where we talk about all the nerdy, NASA. News you need to know today, I have with me the. Always, awesome Abby. Yes. I am your co-host today I'm Abby Taylor thanks, for joining us and we. Are simultaneously, live, right now on twitch, YouTube. Facebook, and, periscope. But. If you want to join in the chat and ask our guests questions, during the show you need to do that on Twitch so go to, WWE. TV, slash NASA, so. Today, we are taking, a trip down memory lane and, talking, about the upcoming anniversary. Of the Apollo moon landing, yes, I'm super, excited about this July, 20th. Will, mark the 50th, anniversary of, humans, taking their first steps on, the moon on another world actually, if you think about it so joining, us today to talk about this historic, achievement, are our guests, Kimberly, and Chad hi, guys hello, why. Don't you introduce yourselves, and tell the audience a little about yourself, about yourself well Abby and Tiffany thank you for having us I'm, Kimberly, Anika Smith I'm a research, astrophysicist. At NASA Ames Research Center in Silicon Valley and, as. A NASA scientist, I'm solving, problems, and I work a lot with instruments. And mission design, for, new, missions in space so, Google. And. I I'm Chad frost on the deputy, director for engineering. Here at NASA Ames Research Center and our, folks, have, the most excellent, role of basically. Making. The. Ideas. And concepts, and missions the folks like Kimberly come. Up with come, to life, they. They have these wonderful ideas, for science, and missions and we get to build them, awesome. Yeah. Like awesome, jobs right, before. We get into talking about, an anniversary which. Is just two days away I want, to remind our audience that we're also counting down to another important, milestone in human space exploration. Right. That's, what the clock is all about so five, years from now NASA, is planning to send humans, to the moon as part of our Artemis, program which we're gonna talk a little more about later on and this, clock here is counting, down the days hours. Minutes and, seconds until 2024. When. The, first woman and who, knows the next man will. Walk on the moon south pole somewhere humans have never been before so, we're pretty excited about that we're gonna talk about that later also in the show so for, now let's get back to Apollo. Yes Apollo, so. The. Moon ranting, kind, of a big deal who, do you guys think. Well. It's really exciting to look back on it right with the the perspective, of 50, years, it. Was amazing, achievement, then and and. It hasn't really been duplicated, you, know. We're. Coming back to it in, Artemis to finally, send humans back to the moon but it's. Easy to forget what a huge undertaking, it, was, back. Fifty, years ago and. So to, go back and sort of do a retrospective, and. Remember. All of that it's just amazing it's a great opportunity I mean I was not even a twinkle in my parents I so Apollo I I'm, after Apollo but. Looking. Back at, learning, about what it took to put humans, on the moon, so. July 20th, 1969, the. First humans, landing on the moon it's the culmination of, a lot, of work an incredible. Engineering promise. And. It. There. Was a charge by, the President, of the United States John, F Kennedy he, addressed, Congress, and, I looked this up May 25th, 1961. Mm-hmm. That, was 20, days after Alan. Shepard did the first suborbital. Human, flight okay and he. Charged, the nation, to. Put a man, on the moon and return.
Him Safely to. Earth within, the decade so labor, foundations. Later. You. Had you had this mercury program that had all these firsts, and then the Gemini which had two astronauts, there, was a period in the mid-60s, 65. 66. We, had 10 human, missions in space in a period, of 12 months what. They were doing was working, out all the different legs. Of doing, the Apollo mission, a little bit to put humans. On the moon what a time yeah. Unlike. Kimberly I actually remember, the first, moon landing and, I was a little kid but I, remember. Distinctly. Having. My little space helmet, on and. Sitting in front of our little. Watching. The first moon landing is. Really formative, experiences, is probably why I'm here, as a NASA engineer today incredibly, but to think back on it and and it was such a hugely. Impactful. Event, really. For all of humanity. Certainly for those of us in the US but it was a global, event that everybody. That could see it or watch it did, it, was it all the papers around the globe because was such a big deal but, it took a lot, of work to get yeah absolutely, I'm really mentioned this whole succession, of, launches. And missions to, you. Know to chip away at the really, hard engineering, and technical problems, which. Were many many many to. Ultimately. Get to the point where we could launch, a rocket big, enough to, carry humans, to, the moon, around. The moon down to the surface of the Moon and all the way back that. Was a, nearly. Insurmountable, set. Of engineering problems that, enormous, resources. From the country were put towards. Let's, get, into the basics so, who. Were the astronauts, that actually, got this this, great, opportunity this. To, land. On the moon but, they're talking about Apollo 11, yes so this is a series, of a Polish but Apollo 11 is the first time we had humans on the moon and there are three, astronauts. Per. Apollo mission, and the, ones that were, on that mission which was not predetermined. It was all part of you, know the Roda that they were in Neil. Armstrong, and Edwin. Buzz Aldrin and. Michael. Collins were, the three gentlemen who, did this historic, first, landing. On the moon and Michael Collins is one who was in the command. Module in orbit around them okay. But. Our design of the Apollo program right, hey where, did they land when. They reach the moon well. They were they were almost on the equator right so we. Had we had a little model in here the other day we're like looking at the little moon model, going well where was it oh yeah it's right on the equator it's actually pretty easy to spot yeah it was I right on the edge of the the super tranquility. Yeah, so it's one of these dark areas but if you look at the wiggle, the face in the moon it's one of the eyes. Was. Interesting, on the actual, moon. Landing, July. 20th 1969. The. Moon was a waxing, crescent and.
When. The, landing, occurred it was, about four o'clock in the afternoon Eastern. Time but. When it, was time to open up the lunar module and take the first steps on the moon it was around 11, o'clock p.m.. Eastern. Time the, Sun had set around 8:00 so, it, was nighttime if you were on the east side side of the US and, you could look up and go there. Are some people. We're. Talking the other day that people. Went out and look to see if they could see them yeah of course they're a little too small to see. But. People did that right they're so excited to, go and say oh there's people up there right, now maybe. I can go out and look up and see them that's right I think that's fantastic. That's so cool we. Have a comment, I want to share from tyrannical. Zombie I legit. Didn't know we were planning to go back to the moon this is absolutely awesome and I'm so excited. Yeah, absolutely. And it to get to the moon we needed, the. Most powerful, rocket. That had never met me up to now putting, humans, or even other spacecraft, in was around or round orbit around the earth in, order to actually escape. The Earth's gravity and then have enough fuel to go to the moon just a quarter of a million miles away a three-day, trip Wow, yes which, other members and come back yeah that was a big rocket right yeah, I mean I of course was the Saturn five. About. The Saturn 5 and they forget just what a huge. Rocket, that was right the Saturn 5. You. Know is, let's. Say it was a almost. 400 feet tall, 363. Tall. Yeah where is that compared to well it's, taller. Than the Statue of Liberty. This. Is actually graphic from back in the day. It's. Huge, you're like 7 million pounds, of thrust and, tag, you have you were telling about how you've seen a Falcon 9 launch and, what you could, feel it yes, I was fortunate enough to be at it Kennedy, Space Center Cape Canaveral, a few, months ago for a Falcon, Heavy launch. This. Is a pretty big crib a rocket and, you. Know you see, these on TV and you're like oh yeah there's a lot of a lot of smoke, and light and if it goes and and. That that's true, but. What doesn't come across on TV is that you, you feel it. Power. Launch, is coming, out and it's, rolling towards, you yeah. There is fire and smoke and thunder and yeah you feel. One and the, Falcon Heavy is a lot smaller. The. Saturn 5 still the most powerful rocket that's ever flown til 9. 333. Of them were flown test, program Wow yeah, that's. Impressive, and then what was in the Saturn 5 rocket are, these amazing. Spaceships I mean these Apollo engineers, were, creative. Elegant. And precise. Right, which I think you would have to have, to be in or in order to you know there's such as ambitious yeah yeah. Yeah. We had we had these two amazing spacecraft, we had I, just. Could see we. Had the what. We would call this sort of the command module the Orion, sorry.
Pollen. Capsule, and a command module that had old the the fuel, and the like and. Then, it was a staged on top of the lunar excursion module, during, launch, and then it launched happened this had moved off and then it had pirouetted. Around and attached itself and. We had this, combination. With two different or one could say three. To four different spacecraft, together. Go, to the moon Wow. And, then we have the three astronauts, are in the. Apollo. The command line the command module is called Columbia, mm-hmm, and then, it was time for the. Lunar landing, on July 20th, Aldrin. And Armstrong, would move into the lunar excursion module, and they, would come apart. Michael. Collins will go, in orbit around the moon and I'm left with the lunar module. Which. Neil Armstrong then piloted. To. Then land. Wow. The. Two astronauts are on the moon Michael. Collins is around, Robert. Aeneid, operating the moon and alone the loneliest job in the world it's not extraordinary, to be on the far side another, story. The. Two astronauts would, egress. And then set. Foot yes. Tell. Them about the, debate. Over the first words spoken, from. The moon yeah tell me about well. So. We all know or we may if you're a history if you read about you. Know Houston, you, know tranquility. Base here the eagle has, landed lunar. Excursion module it was called eagle so you at Columbia in orbit and then Eagles and if the eagle has landed we've, all heard about, this. Vehicles being piloted by Armstrong, and it was about to land there. Are these two poles there's, the three of the four legs had these poles. About five feet long and. When they touch the surface of the moon Buzz. Aldrin calls out contact. Light. Followed. By shutdown, followed. By okay engine stop followed, by out of detent all these you can hear this Wow they're going through a checklist and, then. Somehow, between, contact. Light and, twenty. Seconds later we had landed on the moon and then Aldrin. Comes on and says, Houston. Tranquility. Base here, the eagle, has landed. Contact. Lake is when they actually did have the and actually if you're an eagle eyes you can look at the pictures of the Apollo of the eagle and you. Can look to see that the the, posts have actually bent 90 degrees and, sticking out oh yeah Wow because they did not sink, into the surface where they landed, I see no. No one had any idea how how, soft. And fluffy or in deep the dust, on the lunar surface might, be they, didn't know you, know as we land the spacecraft is is it going to sink three feet into, the surface, or is, it going to be you know hard as a rock or somewhere in between that we just didn't know no so, they had these probes on that landing try, and see and they were just mean. The LEM is my my. Favorite, spaceship because there's a first Bishop designed to exist in a vacuum, I mean, it only has the thinnest walls you know as soon as it is like. Aluminum, foil, I mean, Buzz Aldrin is a story that you can we could put a pin through it Wow but if now is protecting the astronauts, from wow the, emptiness of space. Wow. Of course, we're. In the period where the astronauts, are on the surface for, Apollo live and they were only there for, 21.
And A half hours but in terms of walking around only. Two and a half. Hours. 300. Feet away from the eagle okay. Lots, of pictures yeah, it's for experiments, yeah, what kinds of experiences. Well. Um well, one of the ones, to put a seismometer, they were interested, in, moonquake. Moonquake. So. Here in California we, have. So. Moonquakes, cuz at the time in the sixties, we didn't really know what the moon's surface, interior, anything was like and so they, did register moonquakes, that's. They also said an instrument, to measure dust. They. Were interested, in they had a flag that they put out just to see what, the. What was in the atmosphere, and one. Of them need us instruments. My favorite. Well. They deployed a laser, retroreflector. So. It was a corner. Reflector, that has this great property of a few shine a laser at it it, reflects, bullies are straight back from where it came and so, they, deployed. This on the surface of the moon and they could shine lasers, from, Earth at. The moon and the laser would be reflected, straight back and they could measure how, long it took the laser to. Go to the moon and back and get a very very precise, range. Measurement, and it's. It's a really, cool instrument they've deployed others, on the surface, of the Moon and they are still being used today, yeah that's, impressive right. And. We've learned that the moon is receding from us about one, and a half inches a year that's, going away if you stay around long enough. Even. Confirmed. Einstein's, theory of general relativity by. A refined. Knowledge. Of the moon's orbit around the Earth oh my gosh, so. It's really impressive so now now we've had our astronauts to deployed and they took pictures and, videos they, planted, a flag they had a Preta a phone, conversation with President, Nixon and. And. You, know Neil Armstrong's, first words on the moon a. Small. Step for a man, giant. Leap for mankind we. Come in peace for all of were you, know all of humankind was on the plaque yeah I think we have an image, actually of. There. Yeah let's go, with. This. That's. Buzz Aldrin and. It's. Neil, Armstrong taking that picture you see, the reflection and. The reflection, so. Yeah. The other thing they did is also collected, soil samples, and rock samples and one of the things that our mitrik did right as he got out of the LEM was. He took a contingency, sample in case they needed to get back to Earth right away he, had something and he put it up and he put it in his right right side pocket, and, he had a soil sample but during the course of two and a half hours. They were able to collect rocks. And soils which has transformed, lunar. Science and. Forty. Pounds or so much 40 45 over the course of all the Apollo missions we ended up with what, 800 840 pounds over six landed missions oh yeah. And, they just been instrumental, so, after. They had gone. Into the I'll go back to my model we've had our moon walks and we've collected our science the, great thing about the engineers is now we have the lamb is going to depart. With the ascent stage which, is also an engineering, achievement, had to work on its first time and, now it's gonna rendezvous with my Collins and he's not gonna have his buddy and. Come.
Home And, so this gets jettisoned, and. Then we wind up having oops. The. Apollo capsule, that's. Falling apart. This. Gets jettison and. That's what comes home that's how he returned home let's tell they returned home that's, amazing we'll talk more about that later I want to mention you guys answered the question, from, pag. On the door sorry, if I got, that wrong but how long did they stay on the moon during the Apollo missions this, one you said they worked on the surface on, the surface through 21, and a half hours but their actual walking was, only two and a half hours and then what is this about they had to take. A nap, before they could leave or they had to have a rest period what, was that I. Think. There I think there was some napping I mean they just been a really intense training, and of course you. Know not only getting to the moon but. Bringing the lander, down from orbit to land and that that was as you may have seen in some of the you, know movies and other coverage that was a very exciting, ride they, did not land, right, where they thought they were going to be. Overshot by about four miles, overshot, had, to find a less. Colder e area, a place, that was suitable to land and they. Almost ran out of fuel in the process it's pretty stressful pretty intense. So. I think they needed a little downtime. There. Were also the, inherent. Limitations of, you. Only have so much oxygen. So many supplies you, know you're only equipped to be there for this relatively, short time yeah. And, they. Knocked it out for you no it's the very first time anyone, had done it so they were being very conservative, in, all regards understand. They weren't pushing. The. Following Apollo missions, would build upon Apollo 11 things that were I just you know you're always building upon what you're learning from a driving such that the later Apollo missions spent, up to three days on the surface doing science experiments and had the rover and did all lots. Of great things all right yeah this answers my question which was seriously. They have to go to sleep. Took. Out the seats in, the Apollo 11 landing, so they were just like sleeping on the floor oh really, they. Put a hammock in but still in order to save weight they got really sheets. It's. Interesting to fly the lunar, module so I've actually got some. Some stick, time in, our simulator. For, the. I. Got. To quote land on the moon it's, both rusty, Schweickart and Charlie, Duke who were both hello, lunar, module pilots okay and, you're. Standing up you're flying the thing you know there is no seats if you're staying up and you, know bringing the thing in and flying it and of course both, those guys are. Crackerjack. At it because they're, they flew the real thing yeah, they're. Both they were both still very good at it and you're much better than us but just that. Experience of what's what's it really like to, try and go fly and land on the moon it's it's not like flying an airplane it's not like flying a helicopter it's, a completely, unique and different experience, it has to be right it's like and we're on the verge of having to relearn that, all again. And, we're, smarter too as I said we've learned so much by you, know some. Of the videos. Of Buzz and Neil. Jumping around the surface Apollo, 11 you'll see them there trying out different steps, because they're trying to figure out how to walk in 1/6 gravity huh, with the bulky spaceship, right so you see the posses yeah so. This I was also part of experiments well you know way to know how could we work and live in this environment. In. The moment and learn exactly. Questions. That we did not know because they can only simulate, so much you have to go there yeah and that's where you're gonna make the big leaps and knowledge understanding it's, like smooth, Master says moving in those suits is insane. The. Lunar module is your favorite spacecraft. My. Favorite spacecraft I. Want. You to know that a pitcher combines those my grandfather, helped, with the design of lunar module.
The. Reason, the lunar module is my favorite, is because. You. Know it's it's, one. Of the few vehicles that. We've ever built that is really, designed only, for the, space, environment yeah, never has to go through an atmosphere oh man right and so it doesn't it doesn't look like an, atmospheric, vehicle and you. Know International, Space Station is another example but there's not very many that are like that almost, everything else either at you know it's got to go up through an atmosphere it's got to come back through an atmosphere and, so, it's just a very distinctly, different kind. Of vehicle I really, like them I. Can see that yeah for those of you who build spacecraft or. Instruments. Where the earth yeah that, matters very. Cool so. One. Cool thing about celebrating, the anniversary is, that we've been gathering. People's memories, and so. I thought about what's, my memory, of, Apollo, I wasn't. Born then but it made me think oh my gosh my dad had, this. Video, tape that, he sat, me and my sister down in front of he popped it on the VCR it. Was this weird grainy, black-and-white, footage. You know was but. It was the Apollo 11 moon, landing and. At the time I was, an elementary school or something and I didn't get it but I needed that this mattered, to my dad he made us sit and watch it. Trying. To think about just being back there and just you know it was, a defining moment in. History in, that century the world just, for the whole world yeah tuning, in and watching this I think. That's amazing right just in like everyone, across, the entire group looking up at the moon just all, at once that's just amazing right do. You have some of those memories, to share with us from I do so. We have more, stories and they're actually from you all we, invited, people all over the world to share their share their Apollo 11, minute moon landing stories, and so, we collected, their responses, and, they. Are part of our NASA Explorers, your, Apollo stories podcast. And. Here's one we have here from Ellen. In Calistoga California. We. Are all glued to our television that day mind. You this, is a television that only got, three channels so, I'm grateful that we were able to watch it, was quite fuzzy, but it was so exciting, and me. Being, young I immediately, went, outside with a pair of binoculars to, stare at the moon to see if I could see Neil Armstrong, walking. On the moon you. Know when you're young anything. Is possible. So. Nice that's. Amazing, so if you all want to hear more stories like Ellen's, you can go to. Www.hsn. Yeah, I wanna, do. You want to lead us off into rapid-fire. Questions Mir. Really really quickly okay so. We have here from. An. Easter. Egg. My.
Question Why the moon before Mars. Well. I think there's a number of reasons the the. Biggest challenge, with sending humans to Mars is that. You know it's so much further away it takes a lot longer to, get there than, going, to the moon and. That. Duration, introduces. Lots, and lots of big. Problems. Right there's longer. Exposure, to radiation longer. Exposure, to really. No gravity. You. Know living in a basically, a tin can for. Potentially months. Plus. All of the technical. Devices. And, systems that. Have to be reliable, enough to last that long and rather. Than just, make, a go of it and give it a give it your best shot it's. Easier, to prove, all that out a little bit closer to home you, know we've got a long period. Of having. Humans in Earth orbit on the space station. The. Next big step is to, go for that much further, away. From us and to spend that much more time that, takes us to the moon and. The Mars is a very different mindset as well right, you know communication. Could be at much 20, minutes 30 minutes something, we're very independent. When you're out there on your own doing. Space exploration. Here's, one from stinkbutt, 34, how much fuel did it take to lift the lunar, module. The LEM off the, moon you, guys happen to know that that's a good question you know I remember, seeing the the, number for. The the. LEM. Crew, module, and I want to say. Don't. Quote me on this but I think we didn't tear out. You. Know a few let's say a few hundred gallons it, was not a huge. Not. A huge amount but it only had that one job to do yeah, that'll. Work that one time right, yeah I know the numbers published I just, don't have it at the tip of my tongue but that's there it's interests all the Apollo technical, documents, they are out there you can go online and download all the Apollo reports all the experience reports and. Like. All those technical details, they're all in there you can just go look them up it's really cool, browse through it and, everyone. Have the. There. Are some excited, comments, like can't wait to experience the same thing in five years as some did 50 years ago that's. Right where the Artemis, generation, we are the argumentation, collinear. Is Apollo but we learn, from Apollo, building, on the shoulders of Apollo yeah. We.
Actually Have a question I think it's because we talk so much about the astronauts, from it's crazy, K what did it take to become an astronaut, good. Question what did the astronauts. Have to do in order to land. On the moon an education. Skill. Determination. Of. A luck right. I, think the last astronaut, class had. Something, like 18,000. Applicants. Yeah. And our future astronauts, for he. Sustains, humans. In space you know we're gonna need all different, types you know engineers, and scientists, but we're gonna need people, can keep the machines working you know any, plumbers, or any surveyors, we're, gonna need you folks. Who are you can climb down you know canyon, walls spelunkers. Yeah. Need. All types of. Kinds. Of specialties. Here's a really good question maybe this should be our last for, now but we'll get back to more your questions later but Latino. 67, su Kimberly how long did you go to college to get the to. Get the knowledge for your current job once, you get here as, I say I stayed in school for a very long time I. Did four years as an undergraduate, got. A physics degree physics, is a great degree to learn how to solving, problems then. I did four years in grad school I, got, PhD in astrophysics. And. So, yeah steeped in school then I remember um when I got my first job which was called a postdoc, it's what you get after your doctorate, I went to another university and my dad would call me up are you still school still in school. This. Time. It. Was a good, eight, years of schooling. Outside of high school. We. Never stopped. Learning. I mean a job here working, in the space business you never never stop learning yes in a good way obviously. I think by the time you're doing your PhD you're doing something you're passionate, about and so you're in love innate right I do, think that school. For at least for me school got even more, fun and exciting, more. Years of it I had yeah. You, know I think back to like my freshman year of college and it, was a lot of work, and it was really challenging and I didn't know what I was doing and as I, spent more years in my academic. Career it, actually got easier and more fun it didn't, stop being challenging, yeah but it'd be can take on a different note so if you're if you're just starting in college or.
If You're in high school or even in elementary school you know it. Does. Get easier and, and. I would argue it gets more fun as you as you go along so don't be afraid of spending lots in school. That's. Great, excellent, all, right so we're gonna get back to more questions later and before we move on I just. Want to let people know I want to invite you to join us in celebrating the 50th anniversary of the Apollo 11 moon landing and. Hear, about our future plans to, go, to the moon and then on to Mars by. Tuning in to a special two-hour live. NASA television broadcast, that's tomorrow, at 10:00 a.m. Pacific so. To learn about the show and how to watch you can go to WWN. A sea of slash, apollo 50th, and click, on events. Are. You gonna watch it definitely. I will be watching I'm actually excited this stuff was really really cool it's. Nice so you know go back in time and meet this history and see that you know what Amy yes and so let's dig a little bit deeper into, the, Apollo history and talk about all. Of those those, cool cool, facts that you don't know about you know in order to do that we have our history year James. Tell. Us a little about yourself, so, my name is James Anderson and. The NASA Ames historian. Have been here for a couple, months right in all, the excitement leading up to. Jumped. Right in and. The last few months have been really wonderful, we've had, an opportunity to meet a, lot, of Apollo era veterans, who, worked at Ames and. Just getting to hear, even. More stories, from. That time, many. Of which you know we're not the ones that have. It you hear you know sort of all the time again. So. What what do you know about that time at Ames. It, was an. Exciting time, the. During. The whole Apollo program, the. The. Scope of the number, of people involved at its peak there. Were around, 400,000. Americans. Men, and women from diverse backgrounds working. On. The. Apollo project. And. Here at Ames there was also it. Was a time of building, to a, number, of new facilities came. Online and got funding, at, that time, and. A lot of that research, directly. Influenced, the, design of. Apollo Wow. That. It's. Amazing 400,000. People all. Coming together you know this to solve, this ambitious, and really get this this this plan going and this project going to get to the moon and to me there was an incredibly, huge that's, a lot of effort yeah. What are some of the facilities, that they were building, to support the new missions well, funny. You should ask have brought some historical, artifacts. From. Our facilities. Here at Ames, Kimberly. Was showing a little bit earlier the, model of the Apollo command module I've got another, kind of model of the Apollo, command module oh. So. You've got this one here. It's. Just like it yeah. It's. Got the exact same shape of, Apollo and you notice one side is, pointy and the other side not why. Is that Chad well, it's. This is one of the unique contributions. That Ames Research Center made, to not. Just the Apollo program but it's all of the the, manned, spaceflight programs, of the time as, Harvey. Allen was one of the. Aerodynamicists. Here. At the Senators later one of the center's directors. And he. Was studying, how. To protect. These, vehicles, from. Heat as they came back into the Earth's atmosphere and. Previously. All the high-speed. Vehicles. They were very pointy, right sort of like the front end you know I had a sharp point because that was the least, amount of drag coming, back into the atmosphere, but, they got too hot and, Harvey Allen realized, that if you went, with this very blunt, shape, it. Created, a lot more drag, and it would slow them down but, it allowed, the heat to go out and around and, it the heat would not be transferred into the surface of the vehicle so, basically that you know that the crew. Members in the vehicle would. Be protected from all that heat as as, it came back into the atmosphere and of course we're. Doing basically the same the, same concept, today so it's really a lasting, contribution that, he made you can see that with all the vehicles are returning from the International Space Station you, know even the Commercial Crew you know the the Boeing and the and. The SpaceX, capsules. Followed. The same engineering. Achievement, to shave me something, write the design and engineering of something how would you come up with that job you had a. He. Was an, eccentric, character. And it really is sort of. Ideas. Come from the eccentric.
It's. An odd idea that turned out to work really, well and that concept, the blunt body concept. Was. Developed it's, older than NASA itself. NASA was founded. In 1958, but Allen came up with that idea here, at Ames in. The 50s when it was still part of the, NACA. So. Ames before, it was NASA Ames yeah. Exactly he was before was NASA Ames and. Solving a problem that was gonna be not, you know who's. Gonna be used decades, later oh yeah you know that's, incredible, - well, forward-thinking a lot of work Leon the future James what do you do with that model, what is. It solid metal it, is and. You've. Launched them all, right and one of the facilities, that was built, construction. Began in 1964. On, what's, known, as the hypervelocity free, flight facility, and. It. Formally, opened in 1965. And. This. Model and I've got another one here. This. Facility, imagine, a tube okay, 75. Feet long three, and a half feet in diameter, and, from. One end you've got a really high speed. Stream, of air at one end and in, the other you've. Got a cannon. Would. We do with this cannon while you shoot it. These. Projectiles. They're. They're made here in Ames's, machine. Shops and, this. Is another Apollo. Model. Quite. A bit smaller than the first one that we saw but, actually, this one it, would be loaded into. The. Mccannon. At one end and. Launched. Upstream, into that air so that it's traveling really. Really fast Wow. No way through the years we look this event the the facility, has a top speed for that model of about. 27,000. Miles per hour. I'm. Moving now yeah, and. It's, really to reproduce, the conditions, of. The, capsule, coming back into the Earth's atmosphere or, or the atmosphere of another, world and traveling, from say a distance as the moon I mean this was a unique problem for when you're sending something really far away and it's coming back. Right. Right, right we. Have an image don't we have what they would see here, taking. High-speed. Photos of that I think tell. Us what that's all about so, you're looking at a an, image of the shock wave that's, coming off of that little tiny model as it goes down down. The tube and in, this image the, the, capsules traveling, from right to left right so, as. It, comes into the atmosphere this, shock wave is created and we, talked earlier about how this, blunt, shape on the end of the capsule protects, it from the heat here, you can see it actually is making this layer the shockwave is making a layer around the. Capsule that that's, protecting, it from, the. Heat generated by friction as, it comes into the atmosphere and. So it's an amazing photo to see you. Can you know this is this was you know back in the you, know pre digital age, and, so they had a cameras. Set up down the tunnel to. Snap pictures as. As. The thing was flying down it amazing, that is amazing we actually have a comment here from quite saying amazing, how far we have come in such a short amount of time. Yeah. Old. Morden says awesome stream NASA thank you yeah. Thanks, for watching. I. Had. Another comment to share, I'm. Over. The moon. So. Are we, mm-hmm. Excellent, all right James did you bring anything else for us yeah. We've got another, exciting artifact. Here. Really has it. It's. Encased, in glass what is that James tell us what that is that is a genuine, moon rock Wow. This, one was rock, returned. By Apollo 15, and. Weighs. Under. A pound. 0.3. Pounds. And. It's still but I, don't, know I get shivers every time I see it it's it's it's, so weird just to to. Wrap your mind around. Four. Billion, years old. That's, kind. Of the age of the, first life, rolling. Of the ocean, here on earth. Understanding. Yeah. The the moon is this treasure trove of science the moon preserves. The, ancient history of the of the solar system, and even. Today. Researchers, applied, to NASA all over the world to, look at samples of the apollo moonrocks oh yeah, and, it still we're, still learning. New new things Wow, I love, it that in a way it kinda just looks like a rock because, that just reminds, me that these. Objects, and places in space are part, of our solar system you know just like earthen. What, I'm. Noticing that I don't know comes across on on, the video right is it kind of Sparkle it does.
Reflection. And. And, I'm. Looking at the monitor in the studio and I'm not sure that that really comes across it is it is not just this gray lump that it appears like there's some really neat stuff going, on that that. Just kind of brings it brings it well most guys it brings it to life but that's not. At. The time back in the 1960s. We. Didn't know whether, life, was, on other worlds and, it's still a questioned NASA, and, the humanity, is looking for are we alone yeah, yeah and when the Apollo samples, were returned, Ames was one of two NASA centers, that. Actually analyzed, the. Samples in looked for or whether. Or not they, actually had lightning, for, signs of life that's so cool and. How did that how did they do it, I. Think we actually has some footage of this, we, do yeah here, in our guns. Yeah. So from. Our archives here at, Ames there's some recently. Rediscovered footage. We're seeing it here now, what's. Goin on here Kimberly what are we Oh so, this, is Apollo 11, soil samples, that brought to the Ames lunar. Biological, laboratory and they're, being held in a sterile, condition, of these glove. Boxes, in a clean room and you see petri, dishes and what, they're trying to do is, see. If life grows, on, the. Lunar samples, and, they're. Mimicking, conditions, for, which life, has been known to grow on earth bacteria. Microbes. And the like and. And. Looking, at it through a microscope and. You. Know it's, it's a, very, dedicated, systematic. Study and it laid, the groundwork for the beginning of what, we call astrobiology. At the time was called exobiology. The, study, of the search for life elsewhere. In, the universe and the study of the origin of life here Wow and the. Techniques, here you know they learn, that the the. The lunar cycle samples, did not have life but, they didn't know at the time until a filming experience right. You had to check yeah it even so still laying the foundation, for more science research. Yeah the techniques, that techies. And other techniques look for amino acids and carbon. Compounds, and stuff, of life and stuff of life led, to the development of the instruments. That flew on Viking, that went to Mars in, 1976, to.
Look For life on Mars and, then you know. Several. Packages, that were also exploring, life you know on other, places in our solar system because our knowledge of the solar system today is way different it's, a much beautiful more diverse solar system then the, scientist, back in the 60s could have ever imagined, because we've been sending all these robotic explorers, over the last couple of decades out to Pluto out. Through the giant planets, the moons of the giant planets in is an amazing. Place to, explore we're still looking today and we, have. Yet, to find you know our life on this pale. Blue dot our blue Oasis world here is still one, of a kind yeah. Yeah. More to come you know. Yes. I have. A few Moonrock questions, maybe we could take these as like rapid-fire, okay. First. Of all what is the difference between moon, rocks and earth rocks and to go with that our moon rocks more porous, compared to the rocks on earth or are they just about the same how. Do you know it's, a range so short, answer the. Rocks on the moon are very similar to that on earth so, we have igneous, that were made in a volcano, we have, metamorphic. That were made with high temperatures and high pressures we. Have not, quite sedimentary. Which were made on the earth with wind and water on the moon they're called Breck is there they're shocked, so we've slightly different types the, moon on average, is lighter in terms, of its rocks, than the earth it's less dense oh and this can lead to another discussion of how the earth under inform so they're very similar but they're slightly also, different but they're made of the same things we're all made out of Stardust, essentially, yeah. Nice. Perfect. History. Question for James before you have to go do. The original mission control computers still work do you know. The. Computers, themselves. Images. Of them have been used to. Recreate. The. Mission control room. In. Houston and. I. Would actually have to have to check, but. I know that the the recreation, was done some of the some, of the material, in there is original, and other, stuff was actually just sourced, on eBay so the coffee, pots the cigarette ash. Trays, all, of that stuff to really, give the. Feel of what Mission, Control was. Like during that time and, the. Flight, director Gene Kranz when, he went, in just a few weeks ago and saw this installation I, think. He made the comment was something like he could hear the voices of. All the controllers at their, computer stations, at their monitors. That. Recreation, was so spot-on. That just brought back. This. Is a really intense moment, of a memory that you know, how. Could you not forget so they really got it right. Beautiful. One. Last, comment before the moon rock has to go away, emergy, a member, Jim not sure. Sar. Coming, even. Though we're still have a lot you still studying the there's. Been samples, that have. Been kept in have. Not been touched in 47. 50 years that, are being looked at researchers say because our laboratory, equipment today is much more sophisticated in, advance so, I'm. Thanking, the scientists, of the previous generation, who, left this gift to us today so. That we can continue, our search, of knowledge and when. We get even different. Moon rocks from different places of the Moon yes we will be able to answer some pretty tough questions that we haven't been able to answer the moon rocks gave us a huge leap in understanding. And we're still being studied that's awesome amazing time, capsule, or time capsule, yeah there are teams of ames that are gonna study those samples so we'll be able to provide, an update yes sometime, in the future, sometimes. Yeah. Well thank you James for joining.
With. The history. We'll. See you another time, and. You. All don't forget to, join us and celebrating the 50th anniversary of the Apollo 11, moon landing and. Hear about, our future, plans to go forward to the moon and on, to Mars by, tuning in into a special. Two-hour live. NASA television. Broadcast. Tomorrow at 10 a.m. Pacific, time. Learn, more about the show and how to watch by, going to, WWN. Assay gov, fort, slash apollo. 40th and don't forget to click on event Apollo, 50th, in fact but. Back. Please oh yeah. Let's, talk about our next. Giant leap. Artemis. Yes Artemis. So. What, what, is Artemis. Well. Why do we call it morph Artemis, the art of Artemis was, Apollo's. Twin sister, yeah, right so if you know your Greek mythology. Mythology. It's, Diana, but it's great maja. Kimberley, with the fun facts. A. Very evocative I mean she's the goddess of the moon I mean, it's, very, appropriate. And, and. Also with the Artemis charge we're, going to place the first woman on the moon yes, so with the next crew to go to the moon yes and an, amazing. Leap for womankind, yeah. Humankind. Absolutely. It's about time. Women. Out there students. Young girls who are like watch. Out moon yeah coming, for you, and since we're having our Artemis is a sustainable. Inner exploration, program, it's just different than Apollo Apollo, was like a road trip I mean it did no amazing things, and it. Was a. Huge. Engineering challenge it just to even conceive, going, from suborbital, flight to going to the moon and back in less, than 10 years and to build that whole infrastructure, with, a very elegant but complicated, and logistical, solution, was immense, immune. Artemis, is different we're doing not doing it alone it's. No longer the realm of governments. And superpowers it's a different era yeah, we have commercial, and international partners, sustainable. Presence, and. You. Know in the pursuit of knowledge and the pursuit of innovation. With, opportunities. For economic, and you. Know more spin-offs, you, know the Pala programming, of us a lot of spin-offs what we call things that we use today as a result of the, research the research, and the engineering, technology, development, that that is not just to go right the objective of Apollo was to, go to the moon and safely, return right but that was that was the objective right.
With Artemis it's to. Have a longer-term sustained. Presence. And of course it's the path to Mars, which is the next giant leap so. That it's fun as Kimberly, said it's fundamentally. A different approach. To then Apollo wise you. Know okay it's the same basic destination. But we're. Not going to land directly on the moon we're going to the Gateway first, that will be orbiting an orbiting, space station around, the moon and then, going down to the surface from Gateway we're, going to the South Pole, which. Is a very, different place in many respects, more challenging, than, where Apollo was landing. So, there's many fascinating. Different, things that are going into Artemis, that, were. Really never, something. That was even approachable, back in the Apollo era yes, it's a big big stretch from where we were at with Apollo and of course we have this longer objective, than of taking. What we learned from. The Moon portion. And taking. That with us to Mars nice. Summary. There. Are a bunch of questions that we'll get to about the goals and what's different oven I think you just gave a great overview of. Course. A huge, part and. Really kind of the first and biggest step. For Artemis right is how do how do you launch how do you get there yeah we're talking about carrying, a lot of material we talked earlier about the Saturn 5 yes, well the, big, rocket for, Artemis. Is the Space Launch System SLS and. SLS. Is if you thought Saturn 5 was impressive, SLS. Is even more impressive. You can see some video of it here. The. Rockets, and the the engines already being under a lot of tests right now right, and a lot of this is, materials. That we learned from doing, the Space Shuttle missions. So. It's a little bit shorter, than the Saturn 5 its 322. Feet tall stature and v was 363. Feet so it's before t1 feet shorter. But. It's that's also. A lot bigger than the Space Shuttle which is one, we're used to flying right this shuttle, was huge, and it's only 184. Feet tall so. This. Is as we said earlier Saturn, 5 is taller than the Statue of Liberty and right. So is that's a lot that's. It's almost. When. We have it flying it's going to be the biggest rocket ever built Wow. So this capability even take payloads to Saturn and Jupiter I mean this is a very capable machine we talked, about our rush how, much thrust at how much payload the Saturn 5 had and, SLS, is over a million pounds, of thrust more powerful, oh wow right, so the SLS, can deliver more. Cargo, to, the moon than, the, shuttle could take to low Earth orbit Wow Wow this is just an enormous, capability. And. Is Kimberly no do it take take this lots, of other destinations, in the future, this. Is a huge capability it's a unique capability it's, not something, you need to put satellites into orbit for example it's that's, really for this unique very, unique mission, awesome very cool yeah. We. Have a comment here from King to throne when, they're astronauts, on the moon I will stand and wave at the moon at the, full moon I hope they wave back I'm. Sure they'll be waving back. Artemus. If I get my wish I want to land astronauts, on the far side of the moon because we haven't been there yet, in. Fact Apollo only may have only gone to about 4%, of the surface of the Moon there's a lot of terrace. Right Luna incognita. Latin. Unknown. Territories, on the moon that we have seen we also have not yet been to the South Pole right. Destination. Decimus and to, remind everyone what. Exactly, we're counting down up here this. Is the time until, 2024. When the Artemis mission will land people, on at. The South Pole of the moon right there. Is a question. Someone, was asking what's. Special about the Lunar South Pole could, you tell us quickly what we might oh yeah, just. In the last 10 years our. Understanding, of the moon, flip. It set itself on the head and we learned that there's water on the moon I mean, of the Apollo generation, we thought the moon was bone-dry, turns, out there is actually water moon it's actually all over the moon has different sources but the, poles seem to have large quantities of water now, we should we should know this is not liquid water. Frozen water and water, indifferent yeah, frozen water crystals in, the soil soil, and so, it's, scientifically, interesting because I, shouldn't.
Have Been there and why is it there we'd like to know why, it's there and and trigger it is but. As from a human, exploration, its, water, is h2o can. Be used for hydrogen and oxygen for fuel, oxygen. To breathe. So. The pole going to the poles is a step in a, human, exploration using resources, off the land and the. Same techniques we'd use to harvest the moon water, similar. To what we do in Mars because we know Mars has subsurface frozen, water as well, okay so training. Ground that's, the big reason that's, a big reason to go to the South Pole South. Pole is hard because. You. Know, it's. It's in a lot more shadow right the sunlight is a much lower angle, so. You have, to really think about how, you build your mission much more carefully, how. Do you generate electricity, how do you stay warm there's, a whole, new set of challenges that. Were, we, really didn't have to worry too much about in. The Apollo mission. Yes. And the Artemis program will have humans. On the moon for weeks at a time initially, and company, two months at a time I mean it's also different than Apollo Apollo is you know Apollo, 11 was two and a half hours on the surface 21, hours just there on the surface 22, and a half hours walking around we. Most went up to three days on the surface so this. Is a very different, approach. To being offworld, for long periods of time and how you do that from an engineering, solution your power your. Fuel your water your air your energy, that. Temperature, extremes. You'll experience. They. All can be overcome and they gonna be and the solutions are gonna be amazing, yes you, answered a question from pi day what, are some new difficulties. With Artemis that were not present during the Apollo missions yeah well duration. That's. Maybe one of the biggest ones is we are sending humans. Out there for much longer periods, of time and. They're beyond, the. The, shielding, from radiation that's. Afforded. Earth's magnetosphere, so, when astronauts, are on the International Space Station for long periods of time right, up to a year as the, record. That. That's a challenging, environment but, it doesn't have. The same degree of exposure to radiation that, going, out away from Earth has, and, so that's I don't know so. NASA's gonna need a lot of doctors. And, biologists. And people who study human physiology to, work on mitigation. And also to help, with how humans, the fragile aslong. Durations based or you, know. Exploration. How the volumen body behaves and reacts and recovers. Yeah. It's. Gonna happen at Mars too yeah. This, question from Sleepy, underscore, Gary some. Of your answers already answered his question what. Are the main scientific, goals of the Artemis moon mission and answering those questions are, scientific, in kind of Awesome or things that we want to you, know find out right those are our goals, yeah. Scientifically. I mean some of the biggest unanswered questions, even after processing the wonderful. Lunar samples, from Apollo, we. Still, don't. Really know what happened during the early phases of the early times of our solar system here's the, rock samples that we have might. Have have. A bias in it they might not have been sampling, some of the oldest places on the moon so looking for older rocks how. The moon's interior, looks like we would like to have samples of the moon from the mantle something below the crust oh yeah that, that will take service but going to different parts of the moon where we can actually get to the mantle and press, we can understand how that moon formed, and how it cooled. And. The. Mode, also, potentially. Could tell us what happened with our early Sun we're, interested, in how the Sun behaved during the earlier solar system and this can help us understand, extrasolar.
Planet, Systems where we're looking at planets, around other stars today, you know more, planets and stars out there so, our view of the universe is changing we have our solar system in our backyard here the moon has. Has. The answers to some of these questions, awesome. There's. Also the basic science around you know human physiology right, which as we said you know how. Does the human body respond, radiate, an exposure to you, know long-term deprivation. Of gravity all, these things I know, those, are really basic, questions that are, they're important, for our eventual, journey to Mars but they're also you. Know the the just the basic knowledge that's, often, really helpful in, unexpected. Ways for. Improving life on Earth and, as, a astrophysicist. I would be, amiss if I didn't say I mean it would love to put a telescope on the far side of the Moon and. Open up a different range of the electromagnetic spectrum that we have not explored before because it shields from. The radio emissions, from the earth so it becomes a new window into the universe just right in our backyard because, the far side is is facing. Away from us I know what could make it really big. Maybe. You'll get your telescope. Speaking. Of human, bodies what. Kind of spacesuits, should be used big, and, bulky but, safe or a small, tight, but, flexible because have, been some really exciting work done. Exactly in this area and. There's, a number, of different designs, that are still being considered, but they, kind of hit, both ends of that spectrum right, so some of them look like a more traditional a little bulkier, suit because, it offers a lot of protection from, the, environment some. Of them are a little more streamlined, and sleeker, because. They're just easier to walk around in and do things and. Get stuff done and. They just just don't weigh as much but. I think the jury's, still out as to which, is the preferred, one right now there it's an, area of ongoing research. And development yeah there's a cool idea of a particular, design of one of the Landers on the moon to deal with the lunar dust which is a kind of a hazardous glass like because there's no wind or water on the moon flowing, water to just, smooth it out and one of them has you sort of layer in your your, spacesuit. And you go in and leave your face spacesuit on the outside, you. Know you kind of cloak. Or something and then yeah therefore the dust doesn't get into your habit it never comes in oh yeah I, like that idea. Back. In the spacesuit the docs - yeah. That's. A your suit always stays on the outside where, all its all the dirt all the contaminants. Out, there so there's and, there's a lot of work ahead I mean you're gonna when, you're on the surface doing things you're gonna learn oh like, like the Apollo astronauts learned they're gonna skip and hop to get maneuvering with that bulky things the. Artemis astronauts, are gonna find new things with their spacesuits and what things to change I can't drill as much I can't climb I can't you know rappel. Down the crater in, yeah. Easiest. Way as I'd like you know so, there's there's gonna be a lot of different suit designs for the applications, it needs and so we need those, we, need those solutions and we need to while we learn, those as we explore more yeah always. Learning we're, learning we're. Learning. To. Have a question in mind they think I do. Well, we have one here for Chad it's. And it's about the SLS why. Why. Are we, designing. A new system to get to the moon and not just use the same Apollo equipment, that be used, last time yet well it's a good question maybe, you want to tell everybody the, what the full system, consists. Of we talked about SLS mm-hmm, well I think. That's the main one we're talking about but there's, also you know the equivalent, to all the Apollo, vehicles, that Kimberly was showing with the little props right there's a there's, a command module which now is the Orion there's.
Equivalent. To the service module which actually the Europeans are providing, there's, a you, know lunar. Vehicle, that. Will, be you. Know putting the humans down on the moon what's. Different, this time from Apollo is we also have the Gateway which. Is an orbiting space station around, the moon. And of course the big, rocket so the question is why, don't we just use what we had in the Apollo era well in, principle you you could use those designs, right. But for. One thing we'd like to carry, additional. People, and the, Apollo capsule is only big enough to carry three we'd really like to carry four. We. Have some video footage of the Orion they. Can run that maybe. I'll talk while we go right and you could you can see it's pretty good size one, of the other reasons is that all. Those designs haven't, been produced, for 50 years and so, to go back and, recover the design recover the tooling. It's. Basically, as big a job as making a new one. There's. A story about how Eames participated. In a 21st. Century, detective. Story on the. Re-entry. The thermal, the. Tiles on the bottom of the production. Thermal protection system, of the Apollo capsules, they were made of a chemical. Thing called avcoat, and, I had a re-engineered the, chemical formula, and a. 21st. Century version of that is on the Orion capsule, so, we, we think we. Thank the Apollo engineers. Were. Providing. That groundwork. And we're. Using that research using. The learning the ideas if. Not the actual specific, designs are carried, along in the new program and I'll, you know a lot of the elements of this program have actually been in development now for more than ten years so, we're not starting from scratch today. This. Has been in development for, some time but. A lot of the times if you want to take literally, the old design and, reuse it it, can be just as much work as doing. A clean sheet of paper and, doing the new design also allows you to bring you, know all our latest and greatest technology. And ideas, which. Can make things lighter. More. Cost-effective. And in many cases a lot safer so. We're always looking, at those, things as we come up with new new, pieces I mean, even the Orion, capsule that we were just looking at it's essentially. Apollo on steroids because it has an incredible, amount of computing, power then, the, Apollo, capsule did not have that makes it can carry a lot more payload, and it is, supports. More astronauts, for very long durations, in space it's a very different. Design. As, similar, as similar as the Artemis program is to Apollo, in that we're going to the moon a lot, of it ends right there because, the. The basic requirements, for what it has to do for how long it has to go for how many people it's going to carry are, all different from a plane which, leads you to you, know somewhat, different solutions, in the design make sense make sense so we have the SLS. Rocket we have the Orion spacecraft and then, we have, way you, talk a little more about Gateway at least gonna be my next favorite, species. Fascinating. III it's it's, designed, in mind to be essentially, our first interplanetary. Space. Tug and, IO it's a face ship that could have what have the capability, of allowing us to maneuver, things in space and propelling. Other, vehicles. To Mars, but. It is a orbiting. Ship. Around the moon it gets us close to a thousand, miles of the moon's surface and he goes as far away as forty. Thousand miles it's, in this rectilinear. Or, orbit, it allows, you. To land on any place on them on the moon Wow which we didn't have with Apollo although the the orbit, trajectory was, you know on. A specific place could only had Lander on the equator. This, allows us to go to the poles which we were talking about earlier it allows the far side but. It has a very unique propulsion. On it a solar electric propulsion and, it's more powerful than anything of that type that we've seen before and that's the type of propulsor, we're gonna need when.
We're Far from home like, on our journey to Mars and. So that's gonna be used and I also love the fact that it's open architecture all. The ports are gonna be made available online because we want it's. Gonna have commercial, and international partners, docking, coming. And going and having humans on it and not having humans on it and it's gonna be a. Vacation. Home type thing you know that stress will be there for a few weeks or months at a time and then then, they'll be empty for some time and it, really is a way a different approach to thinking about long term human exploration than space it's kind of like a space condo. The. Staging place we. Hang out there for a while and. And. Then, you know then we'll come back later and we'll pick back up you. Venice propulsion to be a tugboat it, also allows us to put biological. Experts other science experiments, on it I'll, put a telescope on it went on yeah, going in there control, the Rovers on the surface from it. Let's, go a potential, I think we actually have an animation of Gateway, to show. There. We go this is showing all the different component. Modules. From. Both commercial, and international partners, as well as NASA being, assembled to form you. Know eventually this this really functional, outpost. And orbit. Around the moon, and. It also lets have constant, communication with earth which, again is you know something you won't have when you go to Mars but at least this time while, we're working out all the interesting, challenges of being, away from planet. Earth and being in this environment, for. Long periods of time it. Truly is a proving ground and. It's. It's flexible, in terms of what it can be used for awesome. You, guys answered a question from. Oh, gosh. I've lost it Yoga fire is Artemis. A joint venture the way that the International, Space Station is International you talked about very very much so yeah. And and more partners as well International, Space Station this has about 15 partners, I mean now we have 89 nations. On this planet, that have satellites in orbit we are a very different, species than, we were years ago yeah, so as you. Know, the. Future of space is for the whole world and, we have a lot of nations you know working. In space in terms of their economics. Or, the communication. And. They'll be partnering with you. Know this. Is what this the, honours program is about mm-hmm, yeah you. Have a question here from an easter egg is, gateway bigger than the ISS no, no it's a ISS. Is really huge and, and. Gateway because it's so much further away is going to be a much, more compact, vehicle. You. Know it'll it'll have a lot of the functionality, that ISS, does just be a little, smaller well. A lot smaller. Is, they still need to be occupied not so the ISS, an amazing achievement has, been continuously, occupied for almost 20 years November. Of 2000, was the first. Occupants, that's a people. On space, soon and definitely, designed, for that reason is so are tough so gateway is gonna be designed differently because, it has to be able to support humans for periods of time in the period where it does