How to Make MONEY on Instagram (WITH LESS THAN 10K FOLLOWERS!)

i was aiming to get six clients that month and i launched that i got 15. um wait and wait wait wait what so you double you pretty much doubled your wall that's insane welcome to the turn your followers into clients podcast i'm vanessa lau and my mission is to help new coaches content creators and corporate escapees get visible and get paid i went from quitting my corporate job with no backup plan to suddenly building a multiple seven-figure business in less than two years thanks to the power of social media my life changed in an entire year and i believe yours can too so boss let's help you get visible and get paid and dive into today's episode hi rosie super excited to have you on the turn your followers into clients podcast it's been a while since we last chatted fun fact everyone rosie is actually someone who i interviewed two years ago when i still had my first facebook group called the fearless boss network and when i was still do i think i was still doing work for free and so i included featuring different experts or different people that i really respected to do interviews with and two years later we're doing an interview on my podcast now and you also have a six-figure business so uh hello i'm so excited to have you here i'm so excited to be here i this does feel like a full circle moment i i feel like we've gone through so many business milestones and life milestones together somehow in parallel so yeah i'm i'm looking forward to sharing the story with your audience as well it's been a ride it really has been so speaking of the ride can you tell us more about your journey and basically where you're at today and just introduce yourself essentially yeah absolutely and i'm i'm gonna take the listeners on a bit of a a bit of a journey through through my story just to give a bit of context because this ain't my first rodeo so today what you see i am the ceo and founder of badass careers i get to help really ambitious professional millennial women in their 20s and 30s to do work that feels really energizing really fulfilling full of purpose and help them to make those strategic career moves um so that's what you see today but um didn't really start here so basically i'm from new zealand and i carved out an international career in human resource management very much focused on learning and development and specifically leadership development and training for millennials so that was my professional jam um and i was working you know i was over i was the original emily in paris okay like i was over in paris working for lvmh to the louis vuitton hennessy group i was at l'oreal another big fortune 500 i worked at tech startups i was i was living the corporate dream um on the side of that so in september 2017 i actually started a youtube channel about my life in france for expats or maybe soon to be expats um living in france and it was all about you know tips tricks advice all that good stuff french language french culture and it kind of blew up so it you know i got it to a hundred thousand subscribers in the first two years so this is my first taster of oh i can build a community and you can monetize that community it was the first time the seed was kind of planted in my mind like about this whole online entrepreneurship world i mean i wasn't making any money off it i had 100 000 subscribers and wasn't making anything because i had no business model but i didn't know about that stuff at the time so i was a content creator um and so in august 2018 another big sort of life event hit me where i married my frenchie so i have a french husband now and while that's wonderful and good and all these kinds of things i remember starting to feel quite panicked because i was living in france so far from home and i hated the idea of having to ask my boss you know once a year may i please go home to new zealand and see my family you know it started to feel very claustrophobic and i knew that i wanted more freedom in my life one of my values my top values became freedom and it wasn't quite working for me anymore so i started thinking okay i've got to do something with this i have to yeah i have to start something you know become an entrepreneur somehow but how and what and where and all that kind of stuff so i was following a lot of gurus in the space and this is when i stumbled across you vanessa um and alongside you know the other classic sunny lena doozy amy porterfield like all the big ones and i was sort of like daydreaming and i go i got quite obsessed to be honest i say daydreaming i mean i was like on my walk to work on my walk home on my lunch break like i was considering all of this information all of the free information out there but as you know that's not enough to actually take action right so i started daydreaming about what my possibilities were i ended up using the ikigai framework so if your fan if your followers don't know what that is it's a framework which basically explores your strengths your passions your your values and what you could be paid for um and the center of all of that would be your ikigai so i used that framework to come up with three kind of business ideas and kind of sat on them for a while what were the three business ideas yeah so the three were i had continue not even french so go all in with my french language and culture youtube channel become a content creator on the french lifestyle um how to grow on youtube coach so a youtube coach or uh what eventually became badass careers so i'm really excited to talk through my decision making um i love that and fun fact everyone is when rosie was doing not even french that was when i think you had more subscribers than i did and for me i was like rosie like do you want to interview on my fearless boss network group to teach people how to grow on youtube and it's just so exciting to see how much you've grown financially because you mentioned like you could have a hundred thousand plus subscribers but you're making more money now than you ever did with a hundred thousand subscribers on youtube and i can't wait to dive deeper on your journey on this episode yeah for sure i'll i'll definitely share all of the financials but yeah basically just to like wrap up long story short february 2019 i found out that we were moving back to new zealand my husband landed a job here april 2019 i said i'm doing this i invested in boss graham academy i i was like early bird of 1.0 like definitely i'm glad you have to really know now though absolutely absolutely and then yeah that year i moved to new zealand i didn't implement bga straight away because i moved to new zealand but um from june i started with my free beta clients and it was all on september 2019 launched my instagram page for badass careers and 18 months later here i am i've worked with over a hundred coaching clients from over 20 different countries i have over 170 students in my self-study online course like i've completely transformed my life oh i'm so happy to hear this oh and honestly like i remember we basically like i'm trying to think back on how we met i think you sent me a voice note because i think i watched one of my youtube videos and i subtly mentioned like i don't think i named the name yet i think i was like i worked at a really big beauty conglomerate yada yada and then you voice noted me and you're like hi like i watched your videos do you by chance work at l'oreal or did you work at l'oreal and i was like yes and then we went back and forth voice noting and i remember you would get back to me with the voice notes while you were walking to work you'd be like i'm literally walking to work right now and like you would we would send voice notes back and forth and that was in 2018 2019 like or like late 2018 or something like that i think was before i even launched my business it was just more so like you when i was just creating content and not really making money i think and it's so insane now we're at like 2021 and both of our businesses both of our journeys have just changed and pivoted and it's been so beautiful and so awesome and so i guess like well that kind of answers the question of how you found bga you found it through me i'm assuming and you joined the first round and how has joining the program impacted your business yeah and i just wanna i mean vanessa honestly you have no idea how it felt too i felt so alone and so weird for like i had this amazing job on paper like an incredible corporate career like everyone was so jealous of my life in paris working at l'oreal like it was amazing i felt like such a weirdo wanting something different so to find you online and see someone who also worked for this incredible company with all of the amazing opportunities that it offers and still wants something different it was just oh my gosh i just knew you were the mentor for me when i found you so i just wanted to say that but um you know how has it impacted my business my my business is built on bga like my business is a case study of bossgram academy and i'm not just saying that it's like the first six to nine months of my business i was focused on implementing tweaking and learning from bga that was it bga was the first course i ever invested in um and in my life you know in terms of this thank you for trusting me honestly i i remember when you joined i had imposter syndrome not gonna lie i was like oh my gosh like she is like an hr like high up there hr person at l'oreal she obviously knows her stuff she has so many subscribers on youtube like ah she joined my program not gonna lie like there are certain people when they join my program i'm like oh my god oh my god i hope i deliver and you are one of those people so i'm so happy to hear that a lot of the foundations was learned from bga and that you were able to build on that through your experience as well too yeah absolutely and now now as i shift into a new sort of world i realize like that's the strategies and the techniques and everything that we learned in bga it still holds true i need to focus more on team dynamics and mindset and other things like this now because i'm moving towards the next version of me and the next version of badass um but that first you know that first year my first six figures and everything it was literally a bga case study um and now i'm just sort of trying new things and new tactics but the bga core still remains yes a lot of it really for the listeners who are tuning in is what i think what maybe difference differentiates bga a little bit from maybe some other programs is the fact that we slow down to speed up we value a lot about testing data-driven decisions market research and as you'll hear from this episode with rosie you're going to see all the different things that she tried to get to where she is right now and a lot of it is thanks to the mindset that she built within bga it doesn't matter what phase she's at in business right now obviously you've grown bga by a lot you're hiring your first team members you're putting your program on evergreen you're doing all these amazing things to scale to seven figures but a lot of the mindset components of how to run a business and how to make decisions i'm really grateful that you were able to pick up from bga so that being said i know that you know we connected since l'oreal and you did not even french which was your french youtube channel it wasn't a french youtube channel but it was a youtube channel teaching people the parisian lifestyle basically and i also heard that you did some hr freelancing and now you're a career coach like you've done a lot of different things um from what i've understood from your profile knowing you and just a little piece of what you've introduced yourself with and i would love to know like the decision making behind when you're ready to switch niche when you're ready to pivot because you've done a lot of things that you've tested out and another thing i wanted to add on was was it hard to let go of a youtube channel that had a hundred thousand plus subscribers because most people if i were in your position i would have sunk cost bias and i would be like i've already invested so much time and energy in this youtube channel took you a few years to grow it to oh you know 100 000 subs like it must not have been an easy decision for you to pivot to badass careers and all the pivots in between so can you just tell us more about that switching niches just the journey that you went through through that yeah absolutely i think this could be useful for people to hear about the decision points right so um to respond to what you just said absolutely it was so hard deciding to quote unquote give up or or you know not even french is still in my life but it's it's my it's my passion project it's my hobby so to not not go all in on on this what could be a business at a hundred thousand subscribers i had an audience at a community sort of there waiting almost um and some people might call me crazy for doing that but what i would say it comes back to is you have to really really know yourself and understand the kind of life you want to live the kind of um content you want to i mean can would do i want to talk about french people for 80 hours a week for the first year and then like you know onwards for five more years 10 10 more years and the answer was no like i love i love french people i love the french culture obviously but it's like you know the content to me also i knew that the content would run dry it would become repetitive i was moving to new zealand like it just didn't feel right anymore and when i was thinking about how i could monetize that community and offer them services and things that that enjoy like i didn't want to coach people on how to move to france and deal with administration and paperwork i didn't want to you know spend even more time into a special membership community where they'd have more calls with me and more things with me or and then i said well maybe i could write a book and it's like yeah but like selling a book at twelve dollars a pop you know like how many copies are you gonna have to sell to be able to make to to hit your revenue goals so i do really zoom out and it goes back to the sort of the process you teach in bga as well it's sort of like what are you good at great that's not enough what are you all so passionate about great that's still not enough what does the market need what can you get paid for how can you help people transform their lives take them from point a to a point b like that's still not enough like what are you what's your desired lifestyle like what do you are you going for a seven second business are you happy are you living in a small town and you're all good at 60k a year like you have to really know yourself to be able to make these kinds of decisions and so i knew that um i i'm incredibly ambitious i do want a seven-figure business and um i don't want to speak about you know french people non-stop for the next you know five ten fifteen years kind of thing so i was like you know what what else so this is when i started to think okay maybe youtube coaching i loved growing on youtube i loved figuring out all the tactics and strategies and testing things out and the business behind it i loved love loved uh growing youtube and monetizing youtube but then when i thought about the kind of content i liked to create and i knew that i wanted to be a course creator because i was working in learning and development for years i loved creating online courses internally for corporate so i knew that i wanted to be a course creator out in the wild and i was like gosh with youtube the thing is is like every change of the algorithm every new feature every year i was gonna have to be updating it all the time and there's this whole like aspect that's outside of your control like what if the platform you know goes away in two years then what then what formulas you know so so i mean so that was a big decision and then so basically it all came together what i'm good at what i love but also what's a smart business model a sustainable business model that i'm happy to talk about for years and years and years and guess what i had the proof in the pudding i've been loving my career in hr for the past 10 years so why not turn that into something that i can you know work for myself like it was right in front of you too like it was right in front of me i was looking everywhere else right i love that and actually i have a question so um totally i love the fact that with not even french i think at some point i remember creeping you a while back you were selling merch i think too like didn't you yeah hurts or some sort of merch like you did you did the damn thing with not even french and i really want the listeners or the watchers whoever's you know youtube or podcast listeners or whatever else they realize that like rosie could have monetized and she had the audience to monetize like a lot of people would kind of quote-unquote say that as easy money but you it wasn't about the money for you it was the audience was there you could have easily monetized you saw how it could work but you just couldn't see the long term of you truly being happy with that niche and even with badass careers like even if you decide to do something you're always entitled to change your mind right like a lot of times people think that oh i've spent so much time to build this business and i can't let it go i don't want to disappoint people all these different things but i think in your journey so far your proof that you could always pivot you could always change it's not comfortable to let go of things that could be quote-unquote easy money but what you get in exchange of that is so much more like you've been able to build a six-figure business and it's not even about the money the fact that you've been able to impact hundreds of people and help them get promotions i've creeped you on instagram and the wins that you get for your clients in the career side of things mind-blowing like i wish i met someone like you when i was looking for jobs like it's so incredible yeah that's exactly it and i to be honest i had loads of limiting beliefs i was like okay so to make my first six figures with badass careers i'm gonna need at least 20 000 followers on instagram thirty thousand youtube subscribe you know i was thinking about that the other day i was like i can't believe that i'm almost a year into my youtube channel and i've only got eight thousand freaking subscribers but am i on track to have a multiple six figure business yes it's incredible it's about quality not quantity and that's one of my biggest takeaways from this journey but you're completely right like with not even french i had an audience i was i was trying things out i had a patreon i did merch i did affiliate marketing i did all sorts of stuff to try and monetize it and play with it from an entrepreneurial perspective i'm glad i did it because i realized that i don't want to have this like bitsy sort of hustle like that it just wasn't my design i wanted to have a transformational program which i now have with my career glow up and it's getting these results that you see um and i really want to impact people's lives and i'd rather work with fewer people but in a more intense way and it's so you have 8 000 subscribers for badass careers on youtube but you had a hundred thousand with not even french there's a lot to say there's a lot to unpack here like the fact that just because you can get a hundred thousand subscribers on one channel on another one it takes you start back from zero and it takes time to build it's not a magic pill formula which is also why i also kind of strayed away from the youtube being a youtube teacher or whatever else because it the algorithm is so unpredictable you need to understand the foundations and literally it's just a consistency and patience game with youtube and that's why even for me if i were to teach youtube i would need to put a business component to it so something that people can actually control instead of just a soul youtube program so i love that but i also want to talk and kind of highlight the fact that you have been able to build a six-figure business with 8 000 subscribers on youtube now obviously to some people that might be their goal but the fact that you used to have a hundred thousand and you know a lot of people have six figure businesses they have a huge audience and all that you don't have a big audience like not as big as you did when you were doing the french stuff right and so let me unpack that a little bit like because i know that a lot of our listeners they feel like oh well they don't like like some people obviously love to take my advice but they always have this like skepticism in the back of their mind but well it's because you have a big audience so you can make all this stuff i'm like okay well fair what about how does how did you make six figures with less than 10 000 followers less than 10 000 subscribers on youtube yeah it's it's incredible because i was kind of one of those people to be honest i mean i like and it comes back to limiting beliefs your brain needs evidence right it needs evidence to to prove to yourself that it is possible for you so i hope that this podcast episode provides some evidence for some people out there um because i would have never imagined being able to like make the revenue i'm making with the the size of audience i have my not even french youtube channel is actually up to 150 000 subscribers now um and it is it's a completely different world it's entertainment it's a very high search volume niche it's got lots of stuff going for it that the careers you know if you're wanting to wind down on a friday night you're not necessarily searching how to write a resume right um so it's a completely different ball game but the people who are following are really interested in the topic you know and that's that's where it changes the game um i would say honestly the the journey to six figures it's it's half strategy and half mindset and self belief i'm gonna be honest i like you know in my first six months of doing the doing the damn thing i almost burnt out because i was working with so many clients at such a low price point it was absolutely impossible to sustain vanessa you're gonna kill me this is not what you were advised to do in vga but basically i'd come out of my free beta coaching and the next stage for me was sort of my next level of pricing i was having one-off sessions with people which is not transformational you know i was having like i was selling packages of three calls doing writing people's cvs for them writing people's cover letters and linkedin for them plus three calls for like 300 bucks it's also like very transactional too it's like basically doing something for someone whereas i find that what you've done to reach the six figures is you you basically transition from transactional to transformational giving people the tools so they can do it themselves instead of you doing it for them yeah and so the first six months i made like 20k and then when i shifted out of that packaged up the courier glower created that transformational program like you teach to do in bga and sold it at a higher ticket price then in the next six months i made an excess of the 80k that took me over 100k for my first you know six figure year um so it's like 20k in six months versus you know more than 80k in the next six months just through shifting that self-belief of actually like i'm not here to write cvs i'm here to change people's lives and that is a higher price point because it's it's a higher value add someone's life right and what do you think are the shifts because i think that a lot of people they don't understand that once you start charging the prices that you know you want to you want to charge and that the market is willing to buy for the value that you're giving because obviously it's a positioning thing too you want to make sure you're increasing your price the way that you communicate the value is you know makes sense and people will buy in um i'd love to know like what was some observations that you've noticed with the newer cohort of clients and students who paid more and just you transitioning to your new program career glow up like i'm sure that there was some sort of energetic shift either within yourself or maybe even an observation on the type of client that you were working with at that point can you shed some light on that yeah absolutely i i definitely have really high quality clients now like it's like every client coming in feels like an ideal whereas before i was sort of like i was like like oh we can make this work you know like for some of the clients i can make this work i can i can fit you in my agenda somewhere like i can help right like i can help but it's like not that like like lighting you on fire like oh my gosh this relationship this is so exciting i love serving you i love you know like all of that kind of stuff so it's like that yeah definitely a lot of ideal clients coming in now um i had to let go of like i don't have many followers and i want to be um i guess more on the expensive side a higher level of investment in my niche there are so many career coaches out there charging peanuts and you know you've got to drop that comparison because you know good for them and good for the people working for them at lower price points and stuff um but i didn't want that and as was saying i was like you know playing in the transformational space so i think what helps you to charge higher prices is just knowing that your point a to point b feel you know like feels worth it like feels like how much you know some of my clients yes it can be tangible some of them get you know forty thousand dollar pay rises a hundred percent pay increases like huge salary jumps and stuff within mixed rolls but that's not what they're talking about in their testimonials they're like i have clarity i have fulfillment i know my purpose i am on track in life i am not doubting myself anymore like it is hard to quantify that but when you know that's the kind of impact you're making that that is worth an investment and when people energetically invest at that higher level they are in you know before with the career grower because it's a hybrid of coaching and course um earlier clients weren't completing the course you know because after a few months they kind of move on or they you know like whatever you know that sort of you know half of the group were kind of getting halfway through and then like circling back six months later like hey can i still have my calls like it was just a little bit different right whereas when there when i really invested at that higher level and some of them have made a lot of sacrifices to be there you know they're selling clothes on on ebay they're doing the damn thing to make sure that it can happen and they can invest in themselves like they're in and so the results that they're getting are so much more powerful as well yeah i love that it's just a bigger game too and when they actually commit then they're showing up a different way and the fact that you don't feel resentment as the coach or as the instructor or as whatever because you know you're paying or they're paying what you believe the program is worth and what you believe you're worth so there is no resentment i find that when you charge prices that you don't want to charge and it's because of fear oftentimes you'll have conversations with your friends or with other coaches or whatever but ugh my clients are so annoying or oh i'm just so annoyed that i have to do this or why are they like this or blah blah and it's a bad energy like you don't want to talk about your clients that way but most times what i find it's because of resentment it's because i'm not getting paid what i'm work i don't what i'm worth i don't feel valued and i don't feel like in i don't i just feel invalidated because oftentimes at lower price points you're giving it your all regardless right and the fact that either that client doesn't appreciate it or ask for a discount or ask for a refund or whatever else it is that kind of more so happens on the lower ticket side of offers then you just burn out burnout comes from feeling invalidated a lot of times and not feeling hurt or not feeling like you're being given what you're worth and so i love that another thing that i also want to pinpoint is the fact that in rosie's case it took her a while to get to the price points that she's at now right like do you think if you started you could have just easily slapped 5000 or whatever else your program is worth now like do you feel like that trajectory though of working for free and then charging a little bit more a little bit more a little bit more kind of helped with your confidence or you know let's talk more about that inc that price increase journey for you absolutely so i needed it definitely so i was i started out beta coaching like beta clients for free and then low price points and then i packaged up the career glow up it had you know six private sessions a whole online portal it was like an amazing offer and for me i took this huge and this is about you know like you know eight months into my business for me it felt like a huge thing i priced it at 1200 u.s and that felt

crazy to me and i was like who is going to pay that sort of like you know in the career coaching space i just didn't have a lot of other career coaches out there that were doing the thing at a high ticket price point and so i was sort of like you know i was just like really full of self-doubt and stuff i was aiming to get six clients that month and i launched that i got 15. um wait and wait wait wait what so you double you pretty much doubled your goal that's insane were you ready like were you like oh my gosh like i have to stay i had to stagger them out um when i realized though you your sales calls should not have a 90 close rate like if your sales calls are closing at 90 percent you need to up your prices like this you know finding that you were getting a 90 closer like was that kind of what told you like okay my price is really low for the amount of value that i'm giving yeah no i spoke to 18 people and 15 said yes at my new like quote-unquote high ticket price point like it was insane like i was just i was just so full of self-doubt so i would say it was important to me though to go through that that phase um i could have sped it up if i had actually taken the time and i encouraged everyone to do this listen to what people are saying to you they're not giving you testimonials you don't have that social proof they're not like you know you're not a charity case i don't know they're not feelings like this is some of like the things going through my mind was like oh they just feel obligated to give me feedback or like they you know they would have got that anyway on their own without me like that lack of confidence is just it's gonna kill you and it's gonna kill your business you know you have to when people take the time to say lovely things about you and say you've changed my life i wouldn't have got this 20k pay raise if it went for you i wouldn't have found my purpose if it went for you you have to listen to that that is true you are adding value to people's lives and you need to take that on you really need to learn to listen to that there's also i think with pricing a lot of that you project onto other people so for me growing up relatively poor like i had definitely had like poor kid syndrome where i was thinking who could pay that who could afford that like you don't know people's financials you don't know their business like i have i've had clients sign on and say yes and i've you know learned through working through them they're from incredibly wealthy families like you you don't know you never know like where people are coming from and other people who aren't from wealthy families but they have hustled in the background they've been saving up for the past four months to work for you you know they've taken on side jobs they've sold their old clothes they sold their own old tech like they've been saving for months to work for you and them saying them being able to do that and being able to give you that money to work with you is a huge highlight of their year like don't take that from them you know like they've been working for that so i think it's like shifting your mindset to being like like this is so cool like that i'm meeting someone like we're crossing paths in life at this exact moment and i've got something that can really help them and really transform and it's exactly what they need right now and they're ready they want to invest and they're here too and it's it's like a beautiful thing it's not like a sleazy thing at all you know and so the more that i've i've worked with my mindset on that and actually been like i'm i'm open to receiving people wanting to work with me it's really helped i'm still working on it i've i've put the prices up of the credit global very incrementally about three times since and it's now priced at 2000 us for the program um however i've restructured it and it's a group program now so it's a bit different but yeah so it's it's much more scalable but um yeah it's been a journey it's been a real real journey and i've had people tell me in the space you could be charging 5 000 for this program you're changing people's lives they're landing jobs at facebook they're getting 100 pay raises like you know but i'm not there yet and there's also a point i think with the pricing the goal isn't always just to go up up up up there's also you know what feels good for your ideal client avatar where are they where are they at you know as well a lot of my client a lot of my clients haven't actually invested in themselves before i'm the first coach they've ever had so you've got to take that into account as well so i feel really good with where i'm at now that my god it's been an 18-month journey oh my gosh we are so similar in our philosophy with pricing like i think even you've told me this are so many of my other students for me that's like why is bj price this low you need to have it higher oh my gosh you could like a lot of people would pay like 5x what bga is but it's the exact same thing for as you like it's not a money mindset thing for me at least right now like i could easily charge way more but it's the fact that i know my audience so well like for a lot of the people who come into the boss crime academy very similar to how you came in two years ago or a year a year and a half or whatever it is you know it's your first investment it's their first investment like that dollar amount is a lot to them it might not be a lot to me but it might it's a lot to them and the fact that you know over time you change the structures of your program too very similar to your program was a one-on-one now it's a group and then who knows eventually once you kind of understand all of the questions that come through it's very similar to the journey with boss graham academy i used to when you were enrolled in it i was doing weekly calls with everyone answering their questions and all of that then the second round it became a group style weekly calls became monthly calls and that would allow me to actually understand what's going on like with my people like what questions are there and then once i collected enough information and i think it's kind of the stage you're at right now is like once you collect so much information and you do so many calls you kind of realize that all the questions are almost the same and that's a good sign that you need to start updating your program so that all those faqs are integrated into your lessons and now bossgram academy as a is at a place where you really don't need calls because everything that you would have a question about all of the things we even have mindset lessons now is in the program and that is considered into the price as well because the more diy it is you know the less it might be versus the more attention that you get from the actual course instructor the more one-on-one experiences the more calls it's going to be more expensive and so i really love that we share very similar uh pricing strategy slash philosophy because my one of my biggest pet peeves is like charge what you're worth and it's like well honey like you're worth everything you know you as a person you are invaluable you can't put a price on your worth but your product it's a mix of you believing in yourself yes i agree with that but it's also you understanding your your audience really well where they're at in their you know journey it's understanding what's in the product what's included what is the value that that some that person's going to walk away with there's so many factors that come into pricing yeah absolutely hey boss are you enjoying what you're hearing so far well i'm interrupting my own episode to invite you to my free training over at www.followers2clients.com this training has helped thousands of my own students nail down their niche create content that brings the more leads to their door and implement an easy to deploy social media funnel that helps them close clients like a boss this training is perfect for anyone who's starting out in business and wants to know the road map to making 10k months regardless if you're a new coach content creator or corporate escapee by the end of this training you are guaranteed to walk away with strategies that you can implement instantly the best part is is that this training is absolutely free and breaks down my entire methodology to signing paid clients plus complementary trainings that i don't share anywhere else on my free channels register today at www.followers2clients.com

link is in the description box below i can't wait to see you there and now let's get back into the episode yeah so i love all of that i would love to know too is was there a specific like shift for you when it came to the pricing where you're like i'm ready i'm ready to like charge this much is it was it when you actually saw how awesome your program was or did it take a lot of social proof for you to kind of get that confidence i'm probably a little bit of a turtle on this like i'm definitely like i'm definitely a bit of a slower at like slower to catch up on this so but i think the big turning point for me was so before if you can imagine i was working with so many different clients at a different price point i was like i can help the student wanting to get into a master's program i can help the corporate professional who wants to break through the glass ceiling and get her promotion i can help this person i can help that person you know like going through all of that mess and realizing i'm not showing up for my clients like i don't want to be the exhausted coach i don't want to look burnt out on my videos like people can read your energy like this and it's just like you know i don't want to be that coach and it's sort of like okay so i knew like part of it was a kick up the ass like i'm gonna be a better coach when i'm working with fewer people at a higher price point so part of it came from a like i have to do this um and then part of it came from a like just designing that step-by-step transformation realizing you know the best courses are quick and streamlined i was putting this into an online course like portal to help them i couldn't stop creating content i had to real i was like i know so much you know i've worked with so many people now i've got all the tips and tricks like i've got so many things and mindset shifts like all sorts of things that people can use to get to like to be successful um i think just designing that program from a to b and realizing gosh like this is my lifetime's work you know i've been in hr like i was like oh i've never been a career coach before it's like girl you you've been working in hr for 10 years you know you've been working with people and like some of those talented people high potentials i was i was focused on talented millennials at l'oreal that was my that was my niche you know but they're already doing it it takes time to realize like this is my lifetime's work this is my collection of stories of experiences of knowledge of my readings of my learnings like it's all here you know how long did it take you to you know work on like learn hr like all of those years before you start a business count yeah my master's degree my yeah exactly how much of all the money you spend yeah exactly it's insane once you start i think it's just literally realizing everything that you've done to get to this point the transformation you can create listening to the people that you know when they're giving you that feedback and that social proof looking at how you're impacting people's lives it is hard putting a number on that because yeah if you charged your worth it would be 20 grand the program you know so there's like but you've got to you've got to get to a point where you can you can charge a reasonable amount to meet your financial goals for sure and then as you said then you've got the layer of where is my person at on their journey yeah what would feel good to them there's so many factors that we're talking about right now like the fact that factoring in the fact that you have invested in your master's degree you worked at a huge company at their head office like the head office like i worked in the canada office rosie worked at the france office like she was the head honcho like anyone who worked at france was like oh my gosh it is the french people for this french company um and we're also factoring basically where your people are at in their journey and you're factoring in the fact that you literally can visualize and see all of your life's work all of your material just packaged in when you actually see that in front of you because i i asked that question so i can also share i think that my money story really changed when i put everything on paper and i basically started filming the videos filming the exact same lessons that i was teaching my clients so essentially i started very similar to rosie almost like free beta clients did one-on-one services which is what we teach in bga because that's literally where you're going to learn the most as like you're going to learn so much from actually talking to someone instead of just talking to them through a powerpoint presentation and not give calls and not give anything it's a it's a it's a kind of process to go from what beta to diy courses to everything else right and so for me it wasn't until i packaged everything filmed the videos saw the curriculum did the worksheets created all those things where i can actually like visually see all the work that goes into creating a program and also goes into sharing all the knowledge that you have basically hoarded or paid for or whatever also think about all the courses and this is specifically for our listeners like think about all the courses maybe you purchased to learn things to upgrade your skill and all of that that also factors in and the fact that you're creating a program for other people that help save them time that helps save the mistakes that you made that is worth charging for so for instance for me the reason why i like if someone's like bossgram academy is too expensive i'm like okay well then it's not for you because i'm not lowering my price any lower than it is right now okay because you are literally learning from someone who has a seven figure business now i'm still updating the program with all the lessons that i learned all the mistakes that i made so that you can avoid those mistakes so for those people who are listening the mistakes that you made that you're trying to teach people not to do counts as well like you probably made tons of mistakes or you've witnessed a lot of people in your career who've made mistakes during a business during an interview or during a negotiation for salary and now you're integrating that into the program so that they don't have to make those mistakes that could cost them more money or that could cost them the job which is even worse yeah absolutely yeah and i love that you said that about um you know people say to you like bga is too expensive then it's not their program honestly bga is priced so low that you know that you know that like i've done programs since i i invested you know five thousand and one i recently invested like twenty thousand in another more recently like i just can't believe like bj is just up there and i know that you get this all the time but to the point where i was like struggling sometimes with my pricing because i was like i couldn't charge more than bda you know like that's how low it is i noticed that though a lot of our students are afraid they're like but i don't want to charge more than the boss graham academy because the boss gram academy is like so up there in terms of value and i'm like yeah and this is this is actually a teachable moment though this is where you really need to understand your business really well the reason why i can charge that low is because i can afford to because i have a huge audience right whereas one thing that you said earlier on in this interview that also factored into your pricing was the fact that hey i don't have a really big audience right now and if i'm going to sell an ebook or if i'm going to sell something less than whatever when i crunch the math and i need to put food on my table i need to reach my personal goals and this work we don't we're not making a charity this is a business for a reason because we want to make money we want to you know have freedom that's one of your values that requires money and you need to understand your business really well and what prices you can afford to charge for me yeah a price point like bga is not going to make sense for someone who's trying to do something who's literally trying to copy and doesn't have the same i don't know business background or same infrastructure or same audience size or whatever so for me i'm factoring all those things all those things in in my pricing if my audience like cut in half or i lost everything yeah the price is definitely going up right so there's just so many things to keep in mind of when it comes to pricing oh my god this is such a good episode yeah yeah it's a it's a very complex topic and it's a game that you just test and you play with and it evolves all the time yes and one thing i want to reassure our listeners too is the fact that you know if you're starting out yes it's very scary to start charging and all of that and very similar to what rosie and i did we just started small first and then we just built it up and built it up and it takes time but the best part is is that as you get more confident as you kind of see the transformations that you're getting the first few clients that you get the moment that they say oh my gosh you changed my life it's going to be very obvious to you that you need to change like raise your prices is it a little bit scary and uncomfortable yes but very similar to what rosie said earlier she was at a place where she knew she had to yeah yeah and when are you going from just testing out your stuff to actually getting real results as you just said if someone's coming back saying you've changed my life that's your moment you know just takes one person at 1200 to give you evidence that you can charge 1200 just takes one person at 2 000 to know that you can charge 2 000. you know it just it does build up over time and once you every time you put your prices up you're going to think you know have i outdone myself have i am i over charging that kind of thing and then you'll you'll find that if you're creating that value you're getting that results you are transforming people's lives there's always going to be people who are saying i want to work with you specifically on this i love that and also it's the fact that you know a lot of people are like oh like when when will i know i'm ready like i don't know when i'm ready you're either gonna very similar to rosie see the transformation that you're making and being like okay yeah it's my moment it's my moment to shine and it's my moment to raise my prices or you're gonna get to a place where like oh my gosh i'm so tired i'm so burnt out and booked out very similar to kind of the earlier phases where you were at where you knew that you were severely under charging because there were everyone was saying yes and you had more clients than you could handle that was a good good indication for you that you also needed to raise your prices at that point and make the career glow up package everything because you were hitting a ceiling and you're like i can't breathe yeah absolutely yeah i love all of that all right so congratulations again for hitting six figures and you know i know your goal is now hitting seven figures which i am totally 100 rooting you on for it's incredible that you were able to do that with less than 10 000 followers and i'm just very proud of you and so can you tell us maybe the top three game-changing strategies that you did in your business that you feel contributed to the fact that you were able to make the money that you're gonna you're making now with the audience that you have yes absolutely so i just want people to know that i hit my first six figures around three and a half thousand followers on instagram wow i didn't really ha i had you know maybe 1500 on youtube or something like this is the size we're talking and i know that people can hit six six figures with 500 followers with 700 followers mine was about three and a half thousand followers just you know um i i took a bit longer to get there um but just to so people know it doesn't need to be 10 000 15 000 you know just wanted to anchor that so i guess my number one thing is look it's not about the number of people you have it's about the quality of people that you have in your audience and to get quality people you need to niche down hard this is what we learn in bga you can you can have a hypothesis as a niche at first work with real people tweak refine get get further and further and further down that's what i did i was like career coach for millennials and then i've really narrowed that down over time um but niche down hard listen to them constantly interact with them constantly instagram is a social media platform hold them question box dm them voice note them learn from them listen to their words listen to their pain points and all of that goes into your copy when you're when you're taught within your captions it goes into your sales page it goes like that's when people are like you know who i am and like you're the coach for me mm-hmm and actually like gold and have you been getting most of your leads from instagram or is it mostly youtube like how does how do you find that has been the most effective for you for closing clients and all that because i know a lot of my listeners you know maybe they don't have time to be on all these platforms or maybe they don't know what to spend their time on what has been effective for you like social media wise yeah absolutely so i was on instagram only from september 2019 to march 2020 so that was my instagram and so i was getting all of those first that huge flurry of clients through instagram only i think youtube for me it does it's really um great at providing evergreen content that gets people opted into my freebies and on my email list but honestly the sales are happening on instagram for me um it's really happening through yeah that relationship the dms the voice notes and then inviting people onto the sales calls and stuff for the career glow up i only launch on instagram the other stuff is sort of like like so i'm on youtube and and linkedin as well i feel like like each each platform has a purpose but my relationship and my selling goes down on instagram for sure i love that okay great so we talked about that one strategy what are some other strategies that you did to grow to six figures yeah so number one if they could sum it up it's like treat them like gold treat your audience like gold the people you have number two is what we were talking about throughout this whole episode so i won't you know spend too much time on it but it's design something transformational and charge for it you know charge accordingly for it price it right so so yeah rather than you know as a career coach i could be down in the trenches editing people's resumes and and auditing their linkedin profiles for 100 bucks that kind of stuff you know that's going to be a fast road to burnout um and it's actually not the level of work i want and level of impact i want to be creating on the world you know i want i want to actually be contributing so design something transformational and and charge what it's worth um and we talked about that a lot and then i'd say the biggest strategy um number three is work on yourself you are gonna hit limits you have limiting beliefs you are going to doubt yourself you need to surround yourself by people you know you need to find your mentors online it doesn't have to be like real mentors it can be like you looking up to people online find your mentor surround yourself with people who are actually doing similar things so you see what's possible that's why bga is really awesome because you've got the community of literally people posting in me every day got my first client hit my first 10k or like all of those good things so you're like okay this is possible this is real it's not a scam you know and you have to believe it's possible and you have to work on yourself every step of the way bga was my first investment in myself i was petrified to make it um and then once i went through it and i realized like it paid itself off like instantly in a matter of weeks once i launched on instagram because i had all these people been like can i work with you um and you know like every step of the way has just paid itself off obviously um a hundred times over but um i would just say like you know it's it really is like the when you know it's the right program for you it's the best thing you can do and it's gonna happen more and more and as i said before like over the past six months i've invested um over thirty thousand dollars in myself now and that mindset shift to go from freaking out over bga to like being like okay what's next how can i you know how can i live up my identity my mindset how can i go further how can i scale all of those big questions that where i'm at now and it's just it's a no-brainer you've got to do it you have to do it like you are going to be running around in circles for months if not years and years and years stuck in your head trying to tweak your niche statement and your in your instagram bio if you don't invest in a program like this yeah 100 and another thing too is there's two things i want to say is you know when you start investing in your business in yourself or whatever else you know i'm always thinking i'm gonna make that money back anyways like that's already the the energy that i'm going into let's say i'm paying for i don't know 20 000 mastermind or whatever i'm like i'm gonna make that money back easily at that level of you know at that game that we're playing i'm definitely to be making my money back and more so i'm excited for that another thing too is even let's say you join a program because we all have and it's not what you thought it was or maybe you're disappointed or maybe it just was not what you wanted well guess what that's a learning lesson there's very very few courses that i've bought that i'm like oh my god why did i buy this i ended up learning so much about curriculum design i learned i learned so much about what type of support is you know needed or what type of support would be appreciated from people i do market research and understand you know why wasn't this a positive experience and what can i get out of it what can i teach other people about that experience so even if you invest in something and it's it's quote unquote flops for you it's always going to be a learning lesson on either how you can create your own programs and make them better or learning lessons that you can turn into free content pieces which is very very good or other learning lessons that you could have gotten from that program regardless yeah absolutely yeah and so what does the next step look like for you because now you've hit that six-figure mark and i know for a lot of business owners it's like oh i just want to hit my first 10k okay now i want to hit my first 50k and then i want to hit my first 6k and then i want you know this is this whatever else and so what's the next step look like for someone who has a six-figure business and all of that like what's the next step yeah this is such a good question and i love it because i wanna really drive home the message that it will look different for every person what i did what i realized i was doing about six months ago is i almost created a career ladder for online business i was like okay so i need to do one-to-one coaching then i need to do a group program then i need to like package that into a course and then i need to offer really high ticket masterminds with a retreat in bali and then you know and i was really looking at every other person and i was just like i need to that's the career letter actually no i've designed what i want my life to look like my my business to look like and it looks a bit something like this so i'm very much like there are some people who want to become like the master coaches that the new tony robbins that you know they love coaching and they want to do that one to one and do that private coaching i'm not that person i am a pedagogical designer i love creating transformational courses and i love creating content i i like i love creating my reels my youtube videos my instagram posts i love creating courses um so it's very much like quite similar to bga and vanessa's business model that's what i want and why because i want schedule freedom i want time freedom i want to be able to you know design my days not feel you know like oh my gosh i've got eight hours worth of calls today i have to be on if it's an off day like that's just my how i want my business to look and so what i am doing at the moment is i am scaling um the career globe into an evergreen model there's going to be a community aspect but i'm eventually going to hire support coaches and i'm going to take me out of the out of the process a bit more and more over time because i know my methodology works and they don't need to work with rosie they need to work with my step-by-step framework so that's what i'm really working on for the korea blow up i also have an sort of entry level course as well called badass your resume which is about writing an awesome um resume cover letter so i'll have like my two kind of programs running on evergreen and eventually i'll add more and more to the product suite i've had a lot of demand for starting your side hustle so like you know as you know as i was a youtuber on the side of my busy corporate role and i started an online business people are asking me to create some kind of you know side hustle academy for people who are still in corporate so i might create a course on that i'm just sort of exploring that at the moment but i think long term my business is going to be at like a really cool online course sort of portfolio i just basically want to be the coolest hub on the internet for all things careers like the most modern no bs advice um and i want it to feel really fresh um and really up to date and innovative and yeah that's sort of where i see my business going personally so that's where i'm that's where i'm working towards um bit by bit and i'm just really freaking excited i'm so i'm like smiling ear to ear because i think this is why you and i jive really well and why like after two years we still kind of keep in touch in the dms because we're so similar like everything that you're laying out is exactly how i've laid out my business as well i've also identified myself as someone who is more of a content creator more of a marketer i love creating and by the way you guys have to check out rosie on instagram like i'm actually getting so much inspiration from you because your content game is strong and i love seeing the fact that your time with not even french and like i feel like everything that you did leading up to this point is all like mushing together like you were always a content creator you were always very creative with your old french channel and now you're bringing that energy into badass careers and it's really exciting for me to see another thing that i love that you said is i had the exact literal exact same thing as you where i felt like i needed to follow that extension model of like okay i need to have one-on-one and then i nee

2021-06-29 07:06

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